PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

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My guess is that the first stage decides about a general path between zombie position and target location using a few straight lines. It makes sure that the zombie uses doors or other openings if available instead of going straight to the target.
The second stage looks for the immediate direction the zombie takes, for example to go around small obstacles like a cactus or a fellow zombie or even introduce evasive movement so the player has a harder time shooting
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The first stage generates data for an area, which makes the actual path generating second stage much faster and multiple paths can be generated from that data.

 
Navmesh was tried last year and found to be too slow. (that was not even taking into account the issues I said below)
The path system in 7dtd has to handle the fact that anything can be a path, since it can be broken and the world dynamically changes all the time as blocks are added/removed, which gives a lot of standard path systems big problems.
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It can be awful slow for certain things such as recalculating for terrain changes and and absolute pain for others such as trying to cross from one navmesh to another, that's probably why they're levering it into the job system. It's a pity since it does produce far better results... eventually :-)

Have you managed to find a way to get rid of the tendency for NPC's to follow the grid?

 
The first stage generates data for an area, which makes the actual path generating second stage much faster and multiple paths can be generated from that data.
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1) How often does it scan

2) What's the time difference between scan and pathing decision? Just thinking if a rocket launcher in front of it when we see it realize we exist would mess it up.

 
It scans an area. If nothing changes it does not update.
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Can it tell the difference between ground and a bush? I see NPC's walking and standing on the strangest things. Rocks, bushes, saplings, bags of garbage eta.

Seeing a pig standing on a branch way up in a tree just looks wrong. :)

So can this new system tell the difference?

Will the NCP have a preference, preferring to stand or walk on ground rather than a bush?

 
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Better yet. Hire them to mow the grass. :p
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You just made me think of an idea Maharin.

When a zed dies and becomes a Gore Block:

IF that Gore Block is allowed to decay then the land under it becomes fertilized!

 
1) How often does it scan2) What's the time difference between scan and pathing decision? Just thinking if a rocket launcher in front of it when we see it realize we exist would mess it up.
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I would guess it’s only generating data based on world geometry, meaning it would be effectively blind to rocket launchers. A rocket launcher doesn’t have collision, so I don’t know why it would affect pathfinding at any stage.

 
The first stage generates data for an area, which makes the actual path generating second stage much faster and multiple paths can be generated from that data.
Click to expand...

1) How often does it scan2) What's the time difference between scan and pathing decision? Just thinking if a rocket launcher in front of it when we see it realize we exist would mess it up.
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3) How do you handle multiple events, and decide when to trigger stage 1? Some areas will have heavy player trafic...

 
I would guess it’s only generating data based on world geometry, meaning it would be effectively blind to rocket launchers. A rocket launcher doesn’t have collision, so I don’t know why it would affect pathfinding at any stage.
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Rockets make holes in the ground.

 
Rockets make holes in the ground.
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Ah, I see what you're getting at now. In my experience, the zombies we have now don't have an appreciable delay between when a path opens or closes (like breaching a wall or destroying a ladder) and when they start accounting for the change. Hopefully the new system is at least as fast as what we have now.

I'm most curious about the pragmatic results, like if the new system will enable zombies to attack hatches in earnest.

 
It can be awful slow for certain things such as recalculating for terrain changes and and absolute pain for others such as trying to cross from one navmesh to another, that's probably why they're levering it into the job system. It's a pity since it does produce far better results... eventually :-)
Have you managed to find a way to get rid of the tendency for NPC's to follow the grid?
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A little. I have mild smoothing and turn prediction to next path point as it reaches current point.

 
1) How often does it scan2) What's the time difference between scan and pathing decision? Just thinking if a rocket launcher in front of it when we see it realize we exist would mess it up.
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1. Initially for the area around a player. Partially when player moves past threshold. A chunks worth when a block changes.

2. Paths delay when a scan is in progress. The scans take a fraction of a second, depending on size.

 
Can it tell the difference between ground and a bush? I see NPC's walking and standing on the strangest things. Rocks, bushes, saplings, bags of garbage eta.Seeing a pig standing on a branch way up in a tree just looks wrong. :)

So can this new system tell the difference?

Will the NCP have a preference, preferring to stand or walk on ground rather than a bush?
Click to expand...
If it is not marked for collision like grass, it can't tell it exists.

Nothing should be pathing up a tree.

Rocks and such could be avoided if in wander mode we looked at end points and gave it open flat areas to stop at.

 
If it is not marked for collision like grass, it can't tell it exists.Nothing should be pathing up a tree.

Rocks and such could be avoided if in wander mode we looked at end points and gave it open flat areas to stop at.
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except Spider Pig!

5F3543E3CA685406AAA9DD82822525C70AD8541B


ok a little bit older. but times where also nice and the Zombies where much more flexible for example the longneck spiderzombie underground invasion

BA77027AD8A3370826FDA198B4AC993A56F9D408


 
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