PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[Royal Deluxe]

That's why I don't do "Death is death" during experimental.

I think anyone need to do it to find flaws, or you have them in stable too

 

[Joe. Blow]

It's not that bad

What do you need a trader for? I just do the quests for the iron tools early on but I don't rely on them for anything. You can always run. We have new run options so you can slow zombies down if you want, total control. I had to bite the bullet and go from playing with 64 zombies solo on horde night to 24, and its pretty easy for me. I don't feel like its a grind. I haven't fought any radiated since the rebalance if they seem too hard I'll make sure they are adjusted.

It's just not the same game it was, you have to be careful now or you'll get dead! I'm loving it, POI's are well stocked with quick death for the reckless. You gotta have an AK for the radiation types thats all.

 

[meganoth]

I really don't think the vehicles should have a schematic or trinket to craft - it just put's everything back to the old caliper situation all over again, where you're entirely reliant on RNG.

Fix for that: You need a schematic if you just unlock the vehicle, or you buy the perk above the vehicle too which unlocks an easier recipe for the same part without the schematic (and maybe less materials).

why dont we like chance?

We like chance. "We" is just less than 100% of the players sadly.

Some people got burned by earlier alphas where a wrench would just not drop for endless hours (and lets face it without a single wrench you have a steep climb before you). There are players who take that as a new challenge (I'm in that group) but there are others who either are less resistant to frustration or their play-style becomes impossible without that (builders?)

RNG works excellent, but probably there should be an alternative non-RNG way to get items that are "game-breaking" essential. For the sake of a peaceful forum :cocksure:

 

[madmole]

I just feel like we're going back to a16.4 with the forges up and running before the first 3 days, completely bypassing the first part of the game.

How long should we shaft people early game? I played 4-5 hours using crap tools and got mine. In Rust I can usually get a forge going on the first evening and start getting iron tools. Iron tools without mods or perks to make them better are not great at all. I could have maybe got my forge up a bit faster but I spread a few other perks where needed like strength and pack mule. Iron tools are not end game. We can always level gate perks, I just don't like level gated attributes.

 

[madmole]

My biggest complaint is I can't level if I want to take time to work on a good base. If you get too far behind in the weeks, you get spanked by the Zeds. Hope there is going to be some kind of comprise.

If you don't level up the hordes stay easy. The hordes do not get nasty until your game stage is high.

 

[Aldranon]

Tier 1 Quest rewards should include Glue 50% of the time

Tier 2 Quest rewards should include Beakers 50% of the time.

Tier 3 Quest rewards should include Oil 30% of the time.

Tier 4 Quest rewards should include 7.62 50% of the time.

Something like that. Thank you for considering my humble yet accurate request.

 

[madmole]

As we people tend to do, I figured I was "normal" in that Job 1 (or maybe 2, definitely no lower than 3) in 7D2D is to find a working forge. The forge-cabin isn't all that rare, and of course the traders might have a working one. I've only done 3 A17 worlds so far, but in each one I had access to a forge by day 2. I prioritize it over leveling or base-buliding.
With the proposed system, though, you could specialize towards forge-building and make your own by day 2 or 3 maybe, but at the cost of having basically no other attribute increases or perks. Seems to me that would increase play style choice without really affecting people who don't prioritize the forge like that.

I play almost exclusively 2-player co-op and we want to specialize. He's going to be the melee tank and I'm going to be the ranged expert, crafter, and chef. I'll take a little strength for backpack space and he'll take some perception because he needs to hit the broad side of a barn, but otherwise we try to mostly stay in our lanes to maximize our team capabilities.

Under current rules, we found ourselves stopped by the gates. I could have waited 6 or 7 levels until level 30 came along and then spent all those points in a bunch, but instead I dropped points into nice-to-haves or some extra strength or whatever. Proposed system would allow me to keep diving deeper into perception & intellect, but at a cost to my ability to generalize. Fits nicely with our play style.

But if I did want to generalize, in an SP game perhaps, I could still do that with the proposed system. Win-win?

This is exactly what I didn't like being stopped by the gates, at least in my attributes. You can't be a bruiser tank if your strength and fortitude are level capped. So you end up buying other stuff because you are waiting to someday feel specialized. The old system was like Ark, everyone was the same build because of level restrictions. Now we're more like Fallout 4 where you can be any class right out of the vault with 10 INT and 1 strength. Strengths and weaknesses are way more interesting. The old system promoted jack of all trades master of everything someday.

 

[Aldranon]

… We can always level gate perks, I just don't like level gated attributes.

Now that sir, is a great idea! Some perks, if maxed in certain sets, are very OP. I'm all for keeping the "Death Knight" Perks behind a 100 level wall where they rightly belong!

Keep thinking the good stuff and thanks MM!

 

[wolffblood]

it's not that we hate RNG... the biggest complaints are from those who dont get what they want and they in turn hate RNG.
think about it.

btw, RNG doesnt do me any favors either when i want something... i just dont cry and rant about it as much.

just my observation about it... and of course others will tell me to shut up....

Yeah, I'm one of those that hates RNG. Idk how many times in A16.4 my friends would find the minibike schematics in a couple days (yea if on our MP server) but it would always, ALWAYS, take me 30+ days to find it on my SP maps and I'd already be end game by then so it wasn't needed, just would have been nice to have earlier. Or shoot, many games that have that 95% chance to succeed and I fail 10 times in a row. Or with zombie loot, I once looked and had 400+ zombie kills and never had a bag drop, lol. I've always had really bad luck in games (mostly irl too, other than finding my wife). Now I know some things just need to be behind RNG, like hit chances, crit chances, etc. but chances of finding items and that being the only way to get something really does frustrate me. I'd rather something be gated way late game that I work towards than an early game RNG that more than likely I'll never get. So yeah, I hate RNG, but as long as I can get something without RNG, then I don't care if RNG is put in, too. If I for once get mega lucky (or have my friends playing) then it just means I get it earlier if not later.

 

[wolfbain5]

How long should we shaft people early game? I played 4-5 hours using crap tools and got mine. In Rust I can usually get a forge going on the first evening and start getting iron tools. Iron tools without mods or perks to make them better are not great at all. I could have maybe got my forge up a bit faster but I spread a few other perks where needed like strength and pack mule. Iron tools are not end game. We can always level gate perks, I just don't like level gated attributes.

part of the problem with this is intel sets the quality. by the time you get to iron, you arent making poor quality anymore. you are automatically set to making better quality for the first iron tool. it need to be tweaked a bit so that when you do make a higher tier req'd item, you start at low quality for first attempt and have to get better at it.

example you first get iron tool crafting capability. it starts at 1, but by the time you can make steel tools, iron quality is 3, but steel quality is 1 until you put pore points into it. same with weapons and armor.

 

[madmole]

Simple problem is that the early stages are so penalizing that you simply want to reach lvl 60 or so.And i dont speak about guns or zombies

Stamina, Stamina, You are hot, you are cold, stamina. You are encumbered, Stamina, you are encumbered.

This is so annoying the first 14 Hours that there is not a single second you can enjoy the game.

Why should i spend many real hours in building a base that will be destroyed 10 Hours later if a Zombie only looks toward it.

Means so more TFP try to force me to stay in a gamestage that make no fun at all, so more i want to leave it.

Reinforced concrete and steelwalls should be endgamestuff. Not like now where it is the only material you can rely on.

There is simply no other material you can build a base with.

Ergo: Powerleveling

This sounds like heavily outdated info. Have you played the last update? I was able to fend of a horde on day 7, I logged out and nearly fended off the second horde that spawned because I logged back in with just reinforced wood and 2 rows of spike traps and wooden bars to walk on, around a simple 7x7 3 tall box house.

 

[madmole]

They can always gate things through other means. If they make the bellows recipe out of more advanced components for example that would delay being able to get your own forge. They could also make the bellows be a reward for a tier 2 quest and they could make it a very expensive item in the trader's secret stash. Multiple ways to get the bellows but all of them more difficult than now meaning that whether you purchase the perk or not you still have to track down the component to build it and it isn't going to happen during the first few days.

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/images/thumb/bellows_6105727_250.jpg?version=3.1.195

<recipe name="toolBellows" count="1">

<ingredient name="resourceWood" count="6"/>

<ingredient name="resourceLeather" count="20"/>

<ingredient name="resourceMetalPipe" count="2"/>

<ingredient name="resourceDuctTape" count="5"/>

<ingredient name="resourceNail" count="5"/>

</recipe>

 

[madmole]

You need to see screenshots of Royal's constructions. He goes for epic. Surface rectangular base of flagstone upgraded to brick is not really his mojo. He's plenty creative but he's also "go large or go home" and that isn't fitting well with the A17 early game.

I like to build huge castles, but typically have an area designated to fight the zombies, like a big T that comes off my outer wall.

 

[Red Eagle LXIX]

@madmole,

Will we ever see the return of our feet which were supposed to come back "in a few builds"?

That or can we please have a way to hold and lean over an edge for block placing, etc; like was opposed because we were going to get our feet back?

 

[madmole]

The option depth of field works as it should be...

The game looks very nice with this active, but not when i'm looking thru my "windows"

i have to disable it at night in my base :upset:

Is it possible to change it?

Or is this a bug

That seems like a bug to me.

 

[madmole]

I've been pretty critical of a lot of the changes in A17, but I'm also not above heaping the praise when its more than deserved. I didn't think they'd look at progression and perks. I assumed that since they did so much work on it, that was it. This was the new way.
Im very happy to eat crow on this. This is the best news I have heard this Alpha. Even more kudos for using the new schematic system to remove some stuff from perks and adding it to something we can find on our own.

Im very excited and for the first time since week one I am hopeful and looking forward to trying the next Experimental update. Good job MM and team for listening to the players and not taking the easy road and having player just accept things the way they are. You have reaffirmed my faith in "In Pimps We Trust" again.

It may never be as hard as I would like it to be and that is fine, there's modding for that, but getting the base games issues in order is a wonderful foundation to begin with.

Thanks Jax, I somehow only see your supportive posts

 

[Ayrton]

Madmole

Can we see attack structures such as catapults and large crossbows as defenses that we put as turrets?

- - - Updated - - -

I like to build huge castles, but typically have an area designated to fight the zombies, like a big T that comes off my outer wall.

I'm just like you, I love building defensive castles but we can see attack structures like catapults example and big crossbows as defenders that we put as turrets? and shoot big arrows?

 

[Roland]

https://www.collinsdictionary.com/images/thumb/bellows_6105727_250.jpg?version=3.1.195
<recipe name="toolBellows" count="1">

<ingredient name="resourceWood" count="6"/>

<ingredient name="resourceLeather" count="20"/>

<ingredient name="resourceMetalPipe" count="2"/>

<ingredient name="resourceDuctTape" count="5"/>

<ingredient name="resourceNail" count="5"/>

</recipe>

Now make it a workbench recipe and people will only be able to craft it if they find a working workbench... heheh

(But also make it a quest reward)

 

[jdzane]

So does anyone have the problem where they can't make a new map? I made a new seed last night for hubby and I to play in, and it ended up loading my solo player game from 199. Identical map, even though I told it to create a new seed....

 

[chaosterone]

So does anyone have the problem where they can't make a new map? I made a new seed last night for hubby and I to play in, and it ended up loading my solo player game from 199. Identical map, even though I told it to create a new seed....

I found I need to delete all 7DTD/The Fun Pimp files from %appdata% and %programfiles% on my computer to get rid of ghost data. I try to avoid regedits, but sometimes I go through that and delete 7DTD related software keys to avoid problems. Hope that helps.