PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[MidnightRook]

Awesome video MM...thanks for taking the time to show us. I am a little concerned about the mention that zombies on the ground that are not dead will continue to wiggle and move. It takes away the need for "double tap" ...the sudden surprise that a zed you thought you ended was not quite dead.

I would suggest perhaps that...they wiggle most of the time when they hit the ground...because that IS a neat effect...but on occasion they will play dead for a moment...this would cause the wiggle on the ground zombies to lull us into thinking we know when something is down or not and when they do get up it will be even more surprising.

Just a thought...I hate to criticize things I haven's experienced yet, and I hate to offer criticism without suggestion to support it. Other than that I LOVE the new perks and that whole system...I can really see you guys building this for modular support on expansion of ideas. I just love you guys!

*Ahem* Please support the People's Legion of Panties for Peace and add clothing slots for undies!! Peace!

 

[The Gronk]

Been away for a bit. People being (mass-)banned now? That seems like a change...not sure thats for the good (though I imagine R's patience might run out/have run out cause you know...moderating is testing)

A lot of people are feeling frustrated, unfortunately not everyone knows how to deal with such feelings well.

You've missed some quite epic rants where people swear that they're going to delete the game, wipe their hard drive, hammer nails into their motherboard, burn their house down and ruin TFP with an epic anti-marketing campaign. Usually they just leave a bad review on steam and that's it.

 

[beerfly]

A lot of people are feeling frustrated, unfortunately not everyone knows how to deal with such feelings well.
You've missed some quite epic rants where people swear that they're going to delete the game, wipe their hard drive, hammer nails into their motherboard, burn their house down and ruin TFP with an epic anti-marketing campaign. Usually they just leave a bad review on steam and that's it.

It is the equivalent of sending angry mail ot the support in the late 90`s. Kids these days live their lives in sort of evolved way. With anger involved which is as useless as before.

Hm. Don`t mind them guys.

 

[spud42]

MM said zombies dont stun, the stay down perk says stun chance? did i miss something? or is stun being used in different contexts here?

not that i care i dont use a club ,ever. my preferred melee weapon is an AK-47 or a 9mm SMG if i dont have an AK-47..

 

[beerfly]

Would be lovely to see a change log release at the time of the streamer release. You know, for us commons :

Fingers crossed !

 

[PurgatoryWolf]

Smell could maybe work similar to a character carrying a light source maybe. Just simply give them a buff for smell if they are carrying food not in cans? maybe the more you have the more you smell? rather then trying to adjust smell based on specific foods.

 

[Bubo]

Good loot comes from quests now...

Thanks for the earlier reply.

So, about quests.. will we earn any points from quests?

 

[meganoth]

Yes, and of course I know it's for A17 and not the actual release, but typically TFP do a great job in polishing up each alpha release so I'd think stuff like that might get polished out, either disabled or removed if it's just a broken option that doesn't do anything, but we'll find out once A17 drops! :3

If it is in the menue it is a small incentive to implement it before release because removing it is also work (even if minimal). If it is polished away they might subconsciously equate it with a dropped feature.

You probably don't want this.

If its free to the player to decide, I would expect almost noone waiting then. As the player would then waste "skilled up time" for no reward.Most people try to play the optimal route...

For me its more about an idea to have beginner not get overloaded with decisions about skilling up (that they cant do in an informed way)

And also giving a reward to have survived the first week (being excited to be allowed to skill up).

A beginner will still be a beginner after playing an in-game week. People learn by mistakes and experiment. It isn't neccessary for a game with replay value to guide you to a perfect first run.

 

[meganoth]

I've had this game for 3,5+ years now.. was starting to be brave with venturing out scavanging BUT A16 got me so scared with them dang sleeper zombies and wolves that I now only leave base under pain of death!

I'm an old lady.. my reflexes are slow and I risk a heart attack if I go anywhere near a structure.

May I suggest always having a blunderbuss or shotgun in the belt with you. If you think you are in trouble, keep everything with bad breath at distance with it. It is easy to hit them with a shotgun even in the heat of battle.

Thanks for the earlier reply.
So, about quests.. will we earn any points from quests?

Info from TFP was that quests don't give skill points anymore and there is a fixed amount of skill points available. You have to specialize, either be the best in only some skills or mediocre in all.

 

[FM2009]

MM said zombies dont stun, the stay down perk says stun chance? did i miss something? or is stun being used in different contexts here?

I think Stay Down's stun chance is against the zombies, not the player.

 

[Survager]

Difference between stunning and knocking down.

No clubs stun, sledgehammers knockdown. But yeah you wouldn't bother with clubs if you go with heavy metal, and you wouldn't bother with heavy metal if you perk up in clubs. Its a choice to specialize. There are more perks than you'll have perk points so you have real choices and consequences in building a viable character.

@MadMole, what is the difference between stunning and knocking down? Stunned enemies will not fall? A zombie knocked down will immediately get up, and a stunned zombie will lie for a while before starting to get up?

 

[Jebolicious]

@Faatal or @MadMole

I'm curious, does TFP use a specific development method like SCRUM or AGILE to develop 7D2D? Or are you using a self-developed method? Also, do you have a sophisticated git structure or is all the code just saved on a network?

I ask because at the moment I am studying computer sciences and have noticed that a lot of companies have different approaches to software development.

Thanks!

Jebo

 

[Bolliz]

Question for Madmole..

Do u even lift?

 

[Bubo]

Info from TFP was that quests don't give skill points anymore and there is a fixed amount of skill points available. You have to specialize, either be the best in only some skills or mediocre in all.

Really?! Missed that one, thx. I was hoping they'd add more quests (for points) to the trader stash.

 

[The Gronk]

@MadMole, what is the difference between stunning and knocking down? Stunned enemies will not fall? A zombie knocked down will immediately get up, and a stunned zombie will lie for a while before starting to get up?

The stunned animation is when the zombie grabs its face and staggers a bit, the knock-down animation is when they actually fall down as far as I know.

 

[Swiftpaw]

Do you mean the canned Unity select video resolution and windowed mode dialog box that appears when a Unity programs launches (if enabled)? If so, then that is just showing the choices that were added in the project settings. Vulkan is in there, but it make most textures pink, so not real useful right now.

Maybe....If that is what the game launcher for 7 Days to Die is when you first press start. In A16 the option was not there but in A17 the option is there and although Madmole doesn't remember mentioning it, I wouldn't have added it to the start page unless he did. But it appears that in any case it isn't going to be hooked up for A17.

It's kind of confusing because both are available. The Unity3D video resolution thing faatal is referring to can be enabled in the 7DtD launcher, so you can get two launcher config windows one after another.

Here's this Unity3D developer page explaining the options:

https://docs.unity3d.com/Manual/GraphicsAPIs.html

And here's this "Shader Compilation Target Levels" page which if I understand correctly means that you need to have "pragma target 3.5 (or es3.0)" or higher in order to support "DX11+, OpenGL 3.2+, OpenGL ES 3+, Metal, Vulkan, PS4

/XB1 consoles."

https://docs.unity3d.com/Manual/SL-ShaderCompileTargets.html

So I assume that shader level or higher has been reached and this is what took a chunk of time in A17 development.

Found a thread about pink textures!

https://answers.unity.com/questions/939160/getting-pink-textures-in-build.html

This is expected behaviour - when compiling a build, Unity only includes those shaders that it knows are required (i.e. are assigned to a material in the scene). If you want to change a shader programmatically at runtime, Unity won't know to include that shader unless you explicitly tell it to.To resolve this, go to Edit -> Project Settings -> Graphics and add the Toon/Basic Outline shader to the list of Always Included Shaders.

The problem is most likely because of how Unity trims the fat when you build projects. Any asset which does not appear to be used will be left out, resulting in "Problem Pink" in the case of missing shaders, materials, or textures. If your only reference to them is in scripting, it won't detect that they're needed for the build.
Try putting all these special materials in the Resources folder. OR, an alternative that seems to work is, keep some deactivated dummy objects in your scene that use these special materials so Unity knows to include them in the build.

I haven't done enough Unity3D development myself yet to see this problem but hopefully that's helpful!

 

[FileMachete]

Just a comment on 'no respecs'.

Please consider what the game "gains" vs. what a player may feel they "lose".

If the design choice is to hard limit the number of points available so that it's impossible to be 'master of all' then a respec would be trading say blades for blunts. Maybe not really a huge deal?

Can see that if there are a number of skills that become obsolete due to leveling then a mid-late game respec might result in an 'overpowered' toon. That could be designed away or around though.

Consider a player that only has a few hours a week to play. They may have invested many weeks into a playthrough, then want to change things up, but they're hard locked into x spec. Some will happily start a new game, others won't care to and may become frustrated.

What was gained?

Speaking from my own experiances choice is far more likely to be embraced than restrictions.

There are also numerous ways to take the middle ground. Free repecs at lvl 25/50/etc. Could even choose a system where the lvl 25 respec gives all points back, then the lvl 50 respec only return the points from 25 to 50, etc. Or a Respec Quest. Basic point being that TFPs can certainly devise a way to respec that isn't painless, yet offers the portion of their playerbase who would want to the opportunity to do so.

Just my .02 cents but I just don't see the point.

Thank you for the video & looking forward to more

 

[The Gronk]

I haven't done enough Unity3D development myself yet to see this problem but hopefully that's helpful!

Pink textures are just unity's way of telling you the shader failed in a very fundamental way. Either the shader is missing entirely or it's so borked in some way unity just "nope's" out of there.

It's the same as blue plasters for a chef. There are few blue foods and few intentionally bright pink textures so both tend to stand out among the other colours around them.

 

[Roland]

I think it is just perspective. Some people see more meaningful choice as being a function of choosing between this AND this AND this AND this whereas others see it as this OR this OR this OR this.

 

[FileMachete]

I think it is just perspective. Some people see more meaningful choice as being a function of choosing between this AND this AND this AND this whereas others see it as this OR this OR this OR this.

Not sure I'm following, if I was meant to

Example I was thinking of was the current Blades vs Blunts. I like Blunts (heh) but the harvest bonus for Blades means they're always 'better', if you had to choose just one or the other. Right now I can lvl blades first then incorporate blunts mid way, and usually max out both before a playthrough is over.

Or Rifles vs Pistols. Clearly Rifles right? But it's fun to choose to carry a pistol and use it when possible.

So I may have read to much into it but it sounded like the new system wouldn't really be supportive of that kind of mix & match, and I hope I'm wrong about that