PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17
- Thread starter Roland
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I played 16.4 but that was last year already. idk how our hordes differ but military zombies, hazmat zombies, cops, and feral zombies all drop like 500-2,000 dukes worth of gear on average even in 16.4. I will routinely make a mental note of all those kinds of zombies I kill and even leave my base mid-horde to collect their stuff so it doesn't get wiped out by other zombies destroying the gore blocks or whatever.
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Chronic Cougher
The only thing is...that is not the only way into a POI...alerted zombies should not be thinking..and saying.."I heard a bump downstairs..let me investigate." He seemed to be playing a game like COD singleplayer without save points. Just didn't seem to make sense with all the respawning. * shrugs*
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akram22
Refugee
yup , i totally understand you , but building a base still there , and not is still too . dont forget the other added aspects never mentioned once
playing the game must be fun after all, a company wont take that long to release a version less fun then the other , and if we assume you dont like it the option to rollback is still a thing .
note : many players complained about the gore blocks and fps drops , zombie loot is crap , etc .. that was the decision they make . maybe loot is still something with higher level Z's ?
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they are not meals , MM said , and you had a lot meals there , time for diet .
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Chronic Cougher
Actually a great explanation.. totally agree ….but you forgot the condom in the wallet ... on the skater dude.
Maybe we need some additional zombies with backpacks "bugout/prepper zombies" or fanny packs "nerd zombie" wearing the poindexter glasses and cap....
and of course a ...
Coughs * Fireman Zombie * Coughs
Regards
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Louie04k
Refugee
Hey cool dude, thoughs are just my opinions, i like alot of what they are doing, but removing things like numerical item quality, gore blocks, and the wellness system are negatives for me, ill reserve judgement on the zombie loot until i see more on it. As for your comment on choosing a different game, thats very condesending, i love 7d2d, and thats why im giving my views on what iv seen, if YOU dont like it, you can leave these fourms, how about that?
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Blake_
Captain Obvious
Your concern and point of view is valid and sexy, therefore I must fight your words with words of my own, dear sir. I agree that the loot from bloodmoon hordes can be very good, sometimes a little less good than we expected, sometimes might exceed our expectations by far. But keep in mind, this is a17, and from what I've heard, a military zombie won't might or might not give you gun parts, military clothes and some bullets. A military guy might or might not give you a tiny bag with A FULL RIFLE, A FULL ROCKET LAUNCHER, A TANK, A HOUSE AND SOME KIDS ALL WITH MILITARY GEAR AND ONE SPACESHIP. So now you understand that, even though we love to whine and whine some more. Whining far and wide to all the greek gods and the like ,still, the fun pimps are thinking on the best way to keep you interested. And they will succeed because of their god; The mighty Stone Boar who protects them and fills their souls with wonder.
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bloom_meister
Banned
Seriously Roland?
Your comeback and rationale is that because TFP choose not to display a graphic for a backpack they dont carry any loot? Thats fantastic news mate, now all I have to do when I play PVP so as not to lose any of my gear on death is not wear a backpack!! ...oh wait...no, that would be really stupid and illogical....
I get it; zombies can still have loot it's just more rare. I just see a potentially major design problem and I want to talk about it earlier than later. I don't care if it's more difficult or whatever, just as long as the zombies recoup some of my losses on horde night. I don't care about drops outside of horde night because I'll be looting PoIs not zombies. I get it. The only case I'm talking about is horde nights, in which the zombies come to you and as such are the only potential sources of loot. In fact, what if the zombies just had a chance to drop treasure maps instead of loot, I'd be okay with that. As long as I have some degree of compensation (delayed or otherwise) for base damages. Otherwise I'm just... not going to build bases or fight blood moon hordes. And those are my favorite parts about the game.
cnconrad
Refugee
@faatal
I don't disagree. The idea of random rpg drops always struck me as a bit unrealistic.
But, don't forget the law of gaming "game play Trumps realism" and games are meant to be fun. Going around and killing zombies for loot is fun. It is currently the best part of the mid to late game. With no reason to seek out zombies I'm afraid that will become much less fun.
Right now, building a nice base with no exploits and defending it takes lots of work. I find it fun, but with no reward for defense the fun decreases very quickly.
Same thing with finding and making great new weapons. If there really is no reason to use them other than emergencies they really do not serve much of a purpose.
I hope we can find some middle ground, I understand you guys are doing it for technical reasons. But don't technical reasons decrease enjoyment.
Erik Louden
Refugee
There was too much loot in the word as it is. Zombies still drop stuff but it is more rare.
Prisma501
Refugee
But they do give loot. Be it rarely (more rarely than now). So there is "some" form of compensation isnt there? Or does it have to to be compensation far and beyond? I dont get the problem really. I would if there would be no loot whatsoever on any zombie (hordenight or nah).
Cheers
Xtrakicking
Refugee
This is a good question. Previously, fighting any special zombie was quite futile, as they never dropped anything of interest. Now, if the loot thing also affects bosses, and you don't gain skill from killing them either, there's literally no point in fighting them. Waste of ammo.
akram22
Refugee
you missed his point , the early blood moon is complete crap, but with your words at this stage you will get from a military zombie literally A FULL RIFLE, A FULL ROCKET LAUNCHER, A TANK, A HOUSE AND SOME KIDS ALL WITH MILITARY GEAR AND ONE SPACESHIP , thats all
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Yeah I know. But we don't know to what extent. We know that Roland said "it's extremely rare to the point where I usually don't even bother looking." The devs said they will likely tweak it. We don't know how it will turn out without a chance to try it. I'm still going to raise my concerns so everyone can start to think about this now.
cnconrad
Refugee
I agree 100% with everything you said.
Blood moon cleanup day was almost always like Christmas morning. We always made a profit. I kid you not fighting a horde and being rewarded the next day was the most enjoyable part of the game. I would even go so far as to say that is what I played the game for.
I'm keeping an open mind. But if the game doesn't feel as good I'll just wait until A 18 when they change it all back. (they have done this 3-4 times so far make something needlessly tedious and not fun for "reason" then changed it back)
NBornkilla
Refugee
the xp bar was going up on joel video so
bloom_meister
Banned
logic error
TFP has introduced hardly any new actual content in actual years, it being much more important to them to remodel the bear 18 times or perhaps redo the trees 15 times. No, the reason they removed level loot is all to do with time.
You see before leveled loot, just like it would be in an actual apocalypse situation, you could get lucky when scavenging and find some really good stuff, not all the time of course but it was pretty random as to what quality you could find and therefore, if you looked long enough and hard enough you could find good tools and weapons in the first few days.
Of course finding good tools and weapons early significantly shortened the amount of time it would take you to get up and running and building your base and therefore it sped up the early and mid game. TFP did not like this because they don't have any content and they knew that if you got to the end game quickly (ish) then you might just get bored and go play something else so they introduced leveled loot to make an artificial grind to stretch out the game stages and make you play longer.
Now of course the entire rational they used is utter horsecrap because if they understood just maybe 20% of what the average gamer does then they would know that the single most important element in keeping people playing your games is not in fact grind, but fun!
Now its at this point where some xml smartass will point out that there is still a chance to loot something decent early game and yes, that's true, its also astonishingly ridiculously tiny to the point where I would say in the last 20 server restarts I have played it has happened maybe twice in a couple of thousand hours of play so no, it doesn't really frikkin count.
It used to be that if you explored enough, traveled enough, killed enough zombies, that you would very likely get good gear early on but no more. Now you are forced to grind because TFP has no other mechanism of getting you to play longer than making the grind harder because they simply refuse to listen to their players who only ever wanted more fun.
So no Guppy, logic wont help you here my friend.
Ahh Guppy, my friend, the argument against leveled loot was made and won a very long time ago and you and I both know the real reason for its introduction. For our newer friends however I will remind them.
TFP has introduced hardly any new actual content in actual years, it being much more important to them to remodel the bear 18 times or perhaps redo the trees 15 times. No, the reason they removed level loot is all to do with time.
You see before leveled loot, just like it would be in an actual apocalypse situation, you could get lucky when scavenging and find some really good stuff, not all the time of course but it was pretty random as to what quality you could find and therefore, if you looked long enough and hard enough you could find good tools and weapons in the first few days.
Of course finding good tools and weapons early significantly shortened the amount of time it would take you to get up and running and building your base and therefore it sped up the early and mid game. TFP did not like this because they don't have any content and they knew that if you got to the end game quickly (ish) then you might just get bored and go play something else so they introduced leveled loot to make an artificial grind to stretch out the game stages and make you play longer.
Now of course the entire rational they used is utter horsecrap because if they understood just maybe 20% of what the average gamer does then they would know that the single most important element in keeping people playing your games is not in fact grind, but fun!
Now its at this point where some xml smartass will point out that there is still a chance to loot something decent early game and yes, that's true, its also astonishingly ridiculously tiny to the point where I would say in the last 20 server restarts I have played it has happened maybe twice in a couple of thousand hours of play so no, it doesn't really frikkin count.
It used to be that if you explored enough, traveled enough, killed enough zombies, that you would very likely get good gear early on but no more. Now you are forced to grind because TFP has no other mechanism of getting you to play longer than making the grind harder because they simply refuse to listen to their players who only ever wanted more fun.
So no Guppy, logic wont help you here my friend.
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