PC Developer Discussions: Alpha 17

[Gnomaana]

1. i play on servers so this is something that i cannot edit.
2. how does that in ANY way shape or form counter my argument?

Hey mummy! Look! I've ♥♥♥♥ my pants! Even though I havent done that for ages. Dont worry. I probably wont do that next year, so all is fine right? You just have to deal with my ♥♥♥♥ until i descide to move on... IF I move on.

But since only but a few people wanna see reason in this thread, Ill shut up and let my downvote in the steam reviews do the talking. What? Its only temporary until they fix it. So its totally deserved and nobody should criticise me for beeing petty.

*sigh*

__________

*edit*

1. Then choose servers that agree with you and make the change themselves.

2. How does the fact that this is the first iteration and they are still debating it internally debate your argument? Oh, I don't know. Maybe, that you have made your point and it sounds like even some devs agree with you but even waiting for them to decide in the future it is an easy fix? Exactly what did you expect as an answer? "Oh, you are so right. We never thought about that. We will delay A17 to go through the attachment list to suit your playstyle." LOL

3. And, YES down voting because of a feature you haven't even played yet is being petty. So is your entire post style so......

 

[Scyris]

Well let's think about it in this case. For an options menu toggle it would have to be either:
1) All Permanent

2) All Removable

because anything more complicated than that would be ridiculous for an options menu. Eventually there will be dozens and dozens of mods and I certainly hope you aren't suggesting that TFP create option pages (yes pages) where players can toggle each individual mod attachment to either permanent or removable.

Also...casual players probably aren't going to care enough about this issue to even want to change it away from whatever the devs decide. Casual players tend to want to play games the way the devs designed it.

Also...those who want to change it presumably want to change it for realism reasons and so doing an option menu for all removable won't be realistic either (provided they are being genuine in their agenda and aren't just wanting to avoid tough choices). So for someone who wants the attachment feature to be realistic they really are going to want to use the xml settings menu already provided to tailor exactly which mods are permanent and which are removable.

I agree that in other areas of the game general menu toggles will be good. But not in this case.

(I had this ready thanks to Jax...)

I'd be fine with that option, for realism just don't remove mods yourself that you feel would be unremovable. If you are able to restrict yourself you shouldn't need a game to force you to do it. For example in valmod I never use any of the legendary weapons as I feel they are quite op, only one I may use is the fireaxe if I get it very early for cutting wood. Otherwise I won't use em, its a self restriction.

 

[Scyris]

So a long menu for some things is ridiculous, for some others is acceptable?

The mod config menu is a thing in fallout 3/new vegas/4, a modder could make something like that for 7dtd to extend it maybe.

 

[Gnomaana]

then probably you need to look for the meaning of such word

I understand all the words we have used. I still say that Yes, a long menu for some things is ridiculous while it isn't for others.

It would completely depend on exactly how big a menu you are talking and what the actual menu was for to decide whether it is ridiculous or not.

 

[Scyris]

Question: When we talk about Modding through XML. In A16 mod developer overwrite some default XML with their modification. Will that be what we do in A17? I mean I see one of biggest issue with having more than one mod in game is because Mod developer overwrite default XMLs where as to me better approach is if they make a copy of their version of XML in their Mod folder, and when that mod is chosen it get picked the XML from Mod folder if not then use default. Somewhat what a Wordpress or other site themes do. This way We can run more than one mod without having to reinstall or make copy of game using Mod Launcher like tool.

Be nice if they'd copy how bethesda does it, it means you'd not have to touch the base xml files at all, other than the UI ones. Would make importing graphics easier too. But this is a feature for more closer to release version than now. As it is now you can mod most things but graphics easly. I use notepad++ to edit xml's makes it extremly neat and tidy.

 

[CplCritter]

How is noone responding to this?

AND what are all these arguments of "realism"?

Carrying 500 Lumber isn't realistic. BUT CARRYING LUMBER IN SMALL QUANTITIES IS.

Falling on a haybale and getting no fall damage isn't realistic. BUT FALLING INTO A MASSIVE HAYBALE BREAKS YOUR FALL.

Swapping a scope from a M-4 with tactical railing a hunting rifle is unrealistic, but because attaching the scope to another M-4 with tactical railing is realistic, all weapons mods should be interchangeable?

As a guy who knows plenty about weapons and has shot everything from a beretta to a 50 cal attached to a humvee and was a 240G gunner for years, what would be immersion breaking is switching an extended pistol clip to use as an extended magazine in an AK. Same with hunting rifle to AK.

I get your point, but as two people who know a lot about weapons, I do see it from the other side which is where the mods come in to accommodate multiple tastes and opinions. We let the devs do what they do and we adapt mods to our play style... end of story.

 

[crazywildfire]

But now you wont have enough skill points to level up everything. Maybe they forgot about solo players, maybe not. But now to you have at least the same inventory from A16 you will have to sacrifice some points twice, what means that will be many. Those points earlier will be missing a lot, once you cant stay always looting with half of your inventory to survive because this cost time. Its not about edit xml files too.. Its a coming change, so b4 it comes to A17, they can rethink about this..

As of right now in A16 you don't get enough points to level up everything so nothing as far as that has changed. They have not forgotten about single player. Single player has always been the main focus of the game. (Unless I missed something that they changed their minds about this). You start with 2 less slots then it is now. Assuming you have to level up in something to be able to spend on the first upgrade you can do naturally without spending points unless you want but you don't have to. Once you get whatever it is you got to do to level up you spend the points once not twice to get some more slots. Not sure yet how many the first time will give but I would imagine it will be more then 2 slots. So you spend once and you get more slots then you have now. This is all assuming this is how it is until they either tell us or we find out when it is released we really don't know how it fits in and works. All we know is you can spend points to gain bigger backpack.

As you said before you have to spend perks to get more slots and that takes away from something else you could spend points in. As I said that is a choice and I think based on what they have been saying is one of the points. They want you to make the choice not just hand everything to you.

 

[KingSlayerGM]

I understand all the words we have used. I still say that Yes, a long menu for some things is ridiculous while it isn't for others.
It would completely depend on exactly how big a menu you are talking and what the actual menu was for to decide whether it is ridiculous or not.

Maybe now you understand why a 'yes' sometimes isn't enough to offer one's opinion.

 

[Scyris]

I think you would have to do it as 2 separate mods, because in a17, single player and multiplayer are the same thing. Single Player just means you're the only one logged into the game at that moment.
- - - Updated - - -

As someone who dislikes bullet sponges as an easy solution to difficulty, I approve this message. Another possibility could be adjusting the XP curve so it takes longer to level up on higher difficulty settings. Or you could have increased game stage based on difficulty settings.

I prefer my zombies old school, easy to kill with a headshot, near unkillable otherwise, thou you can disable them to the point they can't even move by blowing arms and legs off. I really with 7dtd zombies were more numerious but also had alot less health than they do, but body/arm/leg shots only do 20% of your normal dmg. I mean the zombies aren't that great graphically, I really don't get how more can't be spawned. Dying light zombies, can take a few melee headshots, but one gunshot or arrow to the head puts most of them down instantly. I'm also not a big fan of these tanky enemies. Alot of devs mistake higher health=diffculty. When in reality it just makes it tedious. I got used to it, but a gunshot to the head should put most zombies down on nomad diffculty.

 

[zWolfer]

As of right now in A16 you don't get enough points to level up everything so nothing as far as that has changed. They have not forgotten about single player. Single player has always been the main focus of the game. (Unless I missed something that they changed their minds about this). You start with 2 less slots then it is now. Assuming you have to level up in something to be able to spend on the first upgrade you can do naturally without spending points unless you want but you don't have to. Once you get whatever it is you got to do to level up you spend the points once not twice to get some more slots. Not sure yet how many the first time will give but I would imagine it will be more then 2 slots. So you spend once and you get more slots then you have now. This is all assuming this is how it is until they either tell us or we find out when it is released we really don't know how it fits in and works. All we know is you can spend points to gain bigger backpack.
As you said before you have to spend perks to get more slots and that takes away from something else you could spend points in. As I said that is a choice and I think based on what they have been saying is one of the points. They want you to make the choice not just hand everything to you.

Its not 2 less slots.. Its 2 less inventory lines.. so 16 less inventory slots.

 

[Scyris]

Its not 2 less slots.. Its 2 less inventory lines.. so 16 less inventory slots.

I hope not, as the base inv in a16 is way to small as it is. I'll be modding that quick so it starts at the base a16 size.

 

[crazywildfire]

Its not 2 less slots.. Its 2 less inventory lines.. so 16 less inventory slots.

Ok so I based what I said on the info that was posted and not thought to much of it. You are right it is not going to be 2 less slots. But with that said I don't think they are counting the hotbar as slots. I believe and could be wrong that they are going by the backpack for when you pull the menu up and that has 32 slots in it. So you will lose 5 slots and not 2 slots. Yeah that could make things a little more harder then just 2 less slots. But either way it doesn't change anything else that I was saying. Only thing else to add from what I was saying is you will probably be right about the first spend on the perk. My guess is it will have 3 levels to spend in it. The first time will put it back to where it is now in A16 and then the 2nd time will start adding the extra from what it is now. So yes you will probably have to spend in it twice before you get more then it is now.

 

[Gnomaana]

Its not 2 less slots.. Its 2 less inventory lines.. so 16 less inventory slots.

It is ONE less. They added a NEW line and the bottom two are greyed out to start so NET LOSS OF ONE LINE.

Sorry for the caps but I've posted this before and no one seems to have read it or the wording on page one.

 

[Viktoriusiii]

Swapping a scope from a M-4 with tactical railing a hunting rifle is unrealistic, but because attaching the scope to another M-4 with tactical railing is realistic, all weapons mods should be interchangeable?

while i would welcome a more realistic weaponmod configuration, that is a smaller one, since weaponmods are weaponmods... with a bit of tinkering i bet you can attack nearly any scope onto other rifles.

But not beeing able to remove them, when (in previous alphas and in reallife) you can dismantle the whole gun into parts and rearrange them has no basis in reality.

 

[The Batman]

All you need is the brass anyways. But ehhh. How bout some news or video?

-batman doesn't cough.

 

[Aldranon]

Thanks,
I love to look at game mechanics and figure out how the world would work if those mechanics were the physics (and meta-physics) of the world (which they are, but some story helps me). I really love 'You were the Duke of Navezgane" you mentioned, that would be great.

I would love something between 'Dead is Dead" and "Go pick up your backpack" for a death penalty.

How about: Yes your last body is dead, but start a lvl 1 character, near where you last character died, in the same world so you can find the backpack, use what the last player made, and keep the forts he made but the Day counter is still ticking. Could be rough.

But if your were originally "The Duke", it would explain why supernatural forces are trying to permanently kill you as you are also supernatural and a threat to "Them".

 

[crazywildfire]

It is ONE less. They added a NEW line and the bottom two are greyed out to start so NET LOSS OF ONE LINE.
Sorry for the caps but I've posted this before and no one seems to have read it or the wording on page one.

Lamo, nope haven't seen the first page in a few days now. Someone was on vacation and didn't think to much about it getting updated

So based on this and that. The start of the game from what it is now you lose one line and that is 8 slots. You probably will spend the first perk to get the next line that will put you back to where it is now. Then another time to get the last line. Spend points to get 8 slots. Spend more to get 8 more slots. Or deal with 16 slots plus hotbar and spend points in other things first. It is all about making a choice and yes the size I was referring to is different but the points I was making about them wanting us to make choices is still the same.

 

[Roland]

Hey...I updated the OP two days ago...while on vacation.

You start with three rows of 9 slots so that is 27 slots for the math impaired.

Every time you purchase a rank in your Strength attribute it unlocks a slot (or maybe two-- still on vacation so can't check). Thanks to the extra line they put in you can unlock an additional 18 slots for a total of 45 slots once your strength is maxed out.

 

[Gnomaana]

Lamo, nope haven't seen the first page in a few days now. Someone was on vacation and didn't think to much about it getting updated
So based on this and that. The start of the game from what it is now you lose one line and that is 8 slots. You probably will spend the first perk to get the next line that will put you back to where it is now. Then another time to get the last line. Spend points to get 8 slots. Spend more to get 8 more slots. Or deal with 16 slots plus hotbar and spend points in other things first. It is all about making a choice and yes the size I was referring to is different but the points I was making about them wanting us to make choices is still the same.

This is also on the first page:

+Strength Attribute affects inventory size 7/24/18

So it sounds like it doesn't sound like a Perk you have to spend points on. I assume your strength will go up as you play the game?

Edit: Or even better, what Roland said while I was typing this. Lol

 

[ParadiseLostUK]

as fun as keeping up with the dev diary can be, I'm going to watch Game of Thrones now as there's less bile and conflict... :highly_amused: