PC Demo zombies damage is stupid...
- Thread starter Haxoonie
- Start date
Ghostlight
New member
If you are just starting to experience them, you are probably seeing a half dozen per horde night, coming one at a time. They are not - and never were - an issue at that stage. It's when you get 30 and they come a half dozen at a time they got out of hand.
That said, you will probably wonder what all the fuss was about. They got nerfed hard and now are not much of an issue as long as you are careful. Now that you can kill them to prevent the explosion once triggered (used to be you couldn't stop it), and chain reaction explosions no longer occur (they kill other Demolishers when they explode now without triggering them), they are much easier to handle.
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RestInPieces
New member
There are many TD games out there in which you have to shoot at enemies yourself, like in the Dungeon Defenders or Sanctum series.
As for demos... I just wish they weren't so gimmicky... both theme and gameplay-wise.
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Ghostlight
New member
I don't consider those game where you do stuff yourself to be Tower Defence in the true sense. Dungeon defenders is a prime example: not only do you run around fighting the enemies yourself, but you need to run to the places where you want to build your towers and do so manually. That is not Tower Defence in the true sense, where the player is a disembodied entity that is purely passive and towers can be built more or less anywhere.
Roland
Community Moderator
Amazingly, not one person has attempted to say that this game is tower defense in the true sense. We are saying that it has Tower Defense elements to it. Dungeon Defenders is certainly a hybrid game with one aspect being tower defense. If you can’t agree to that then there can be no conversation as your definitions are too narrow and ours are too broad to ever find agreement.
Adam the Waster
Well-known member
i call these games with so many elements
"Hybrid Elements" sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't
but 7DTD has Survived those Mutations
I hate those demo bastards as much as anyone, but they're a much needed injection of challenge for base builders. My crew's old kill tunnel from A17 made horde nights faceroll back then but has required several bits of revision...part of which is tactics on our end.
My biggest pet peeve with them is all that armor...not so much that they have it as it is to obtain countermeasures. I primarily stick to shotgun, which is useless on demos without slugs...which require a specific magazine to be able to craft. Don't luck out and get the mag? Have fun running away or switching to other weapons. Not that I'm married to the shotgun, mind you, but I prefer to leave the rifle rounds to friends since that's their main gun. But I keep some on me just to handle demos.
My biggest pet peeve with them is all that armor...not so much that they have it as it is to obtain countermeasures. I primarily stick to shotgun, which is useless on demos without slugs...which require a specific magazine to be able to craft. Don't luck out and get the mag? Have fun running away or switching to other weapons. Not that I'm married to the shotgun, mind you, but I prefer to leave the rifle rounds to friends since that's their main gun. But I keep some on me just to handle demos.
RestInPieces
New member
The general TD concept is trying to prevent pathing enemies with traps/towers/etc from reaching something. Yes, if we want to be specific, those games have extra elements on top, but their whole gameplay revolves around the above. 7DTD fits the bill of having TD elements, but it has to adapt them with voxels and everything else, so a cluster♥♥♥♥ of problems is expected. The concept of being able to skip any part of the game you want (or "my playstyle" as people fallaciously called it), makes those parts meaningless, creating even more confusion. Thankfully they seem to be getting away from that and paying more attention to balance lately.
Well, it's not impossible to both challenge the player and make something that at least fits more with the theme or involves more interesting mechanics than pop-a-mole. Everyone should be a base builder btw (as well as anything else).
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Boidster
New member
<Luke Skywalker>Every word of what you just said is wrong.
I'm kidding, though I disagree strenuously (it's not good for my heart) with the idea of "my playstyle" being fallacious on its face. Why should any of us give two spits how another person plays? Why should any of us, even in large groups, get to decide which ways to play are legitimate and which are not? This applies to any game, IMO, but doubly so in an open sandbox game. TFP builds a world and some rules for living in it. Go do it however you want! And let others do it however they want. "Everybody should be a base builder"? Ow, the disagreement is too strenuous, and I type this as someone who has always and only played as a pretty typical trap-encircled-base builder, standing on iron bars trying to kill them before they get to me.
(Co-op teams obviously are a slight exception since you'd want everybody on the same page about how you're going to survive.)
Not a boomer, but old enough to remember watching that in reruns.
RestInPieces
New member
Typical boomer reply - you didn't even quote Yoda!
But seriously, it's not that simple - we were just talking about how the game is so much more than just a sandbox and if it doesn't give the player vital practical reasons to use, for example, its building/TD elements, they automatically become "unnecessary" and, briefly put, that's one of the reasons one sees the occasional "the game is a shooting grinder" thread, because the elements of the game can't be disconnected from each other. TFP decide obviously, and they have been actually (and thankfully) working towards this goal, e.g. with perks/recipes lately and hopefully with the improved weather/disease system in the future.
Anyhow shouldn't have stoked these fires - let's talk about demos instead.
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Laz Man
Fun Pimps Staff
I agree, although there has so much angst about them, they are definitely needed to keep the tension on later game. Do they need some more balancing? Probably and they will most likely be adjusted. For example, there is supposed to be Tier 3 weapons for all weapon types which may help even things out.
Ghostlight
New member
"A puppet am I"you didn't even quote Yoda!
Adam the Waster
Well-known member
but it makes sense Why they wear armor. their Military Ordnance. (AKA they work with Bombs/explosives) would you work with bombs without armor?
now about them i think they they should have a Weakness. "Like a turtle with a Hard shell, but low speed" the demolisher should be kinda slow due to his armor. and they should have a Easy leg cripple weakness so they could be "easier" to deal with.
or maybe Electricity can Disable the C4 but thats sounds a bit too OP.
but i think their kinda balanced and they are kinda fun to fight IMO. instead of just having to blow up zombies, you have to be careful or else you could have a big hole in your base. when a see a group i always get scared
now maybe later on the Alphas. maybe there could a Charging Zombie , a Long range sniper, Spiders could Be super Wall Jumpers?
cuz i and many people always want a challenge
Boidster
New member
<The Good Place Janet> Not a boomer.Typical boomer reply - you didn't even quote Yoda!
Alright. I will just leave an anecdote. There was a guy here a few months back who mentioned that he likes to play the game as a city renovator, cleaning up rubble, fixing broken buildings, smoothing the roads and planting grass and trees. I thought that was awesome. And if the game mechanics were to change such that he could not play that way - because he must instead be a base builder - then 7D2D would be lesser for the change.
Anyhow. Demolishers...what's up with those guys anyway?
canadianbluebeer
New member
That's "A puppet yam I"
-- Popeye Yoda.
Oh, I'm not advocating for the armor to be nerfed. I'd say your idea to have them a bit slower moving is sensible. Do agree that electricity disabling the bomb would be OP.
Just because the armor can be annoying doesn't mean I can't find ways to work around it (since there are plenty).
Adam the Waster
Well-known member
Oh lol my bad
All good. I didn't exactly convey my sentiment that well in my first post. If anything, the more annoying part of the armor is how some of the means to counter it (namely the AP rounds and slugs) can be a pain to obtain if RNGesus seems you unworthy, but that's a separate issue from the demolisher's themselves.