Guppycur
Hunter
Once you invite the govt into your house, you can't get them to leave.
At any rate, this seems to be sorting itself out so fingers cross this thread dies.
-
If you have a mod, tool or prefab, please use the Resources section. Click Mods at the top of the forums.
Compo Pack TOS "Addition"
- Thread starter KhaineGB
- Start date
- Status
At any rate, this seems to be sorting itself out so fingers cross this thread dies.
zztong
Hunter
Right, though what was the permission granted? If a designer granted permission to include their POI in the CP, did they envision somebody taking the CP and making an Alt-CP? That's hard to say. Like you say, nobody is going to court over this, but if Alt-CP folks want to avoid the possibility of bad Public Relations with a POI designer, asking for permission would seem wise.
My fingers are crossed.
KhaineGB
Hunter
I've currently got permission from at least 4 people who submitted stuff to CP to update and include their POI's in the pack.
Krunch is helping as well and has obtained permission for others. I need to compile a list later.
Speaking of @zztong I think some of your POI's are in here so I'll have to see if you've updated and then request perms from you too
Krunch is helping as well and has obtained permission for others. I need to compile a list later.
Speaking of @zztong I think some of your POI's are in here so I'll have to see if you've updated and then request perms from you too
Last edited by a moderator:
Annihilatorza
Refugee
Speaking from real world experience generally anything you make while working for a company you don't own it.
All the POI ever made for 7D2D belong to the TFP and only them, it does not matter if you spent 1000 hours on it, you still used their assets to make it.
All of sudden saying you own the Combopack and no one is allowed to use it unless you say so, is very against the sprit of this community.
What this will mostly like lead to, is all the people that made POI and were included in the CP will withdraw their permissions to CP to use their POI in it.
Is it exactly what happed to Mod Nexus.
All the POI ever made for 7D2D belong to the TFP and only them, it does not matter if you spent 1000 hours on it, you still used their assets to make it.
All of sudden saying you own the Combopack and no one is allowed to use it unless you say so, is very against the sprit of this community.
What this will mostly like lead to, is all the people that made POI and were included in the CP will withdraw their permissions to CP to use their POI in it.
Is it exactly what happed to Mod Nexus.
Its simple, you are welcome to use it for what ever you want to use it for, except for sales and exploitation ect ect
zztong
Hunter
I'll send you a note, but for the public...
As of release ZZ008, the POIs in my modlet are covered by the GPLv3. My intention was for folks to be able to take them, use them, modify them, whatever. Because of the nature of the GPLv3, if you do modify them, your modifications to them must also be covered by the GPLv3. That doesn't mean your entire project is bound by the GPLv3, just your changes to my POIs, should you choose to distribute them.
I do appreciate it when folks notify me they're using them.
LordCorellon
Refugee
What a way to kill the CP and give the middle finger to the Overhaul Creators.
We all LOVE to download several different things to make our game more enjoyable than Vanilla. We see people saying "I LOVE MULTIPLE DOWNLOADS" every single day...<Sarcasm-off>
Everyone knows whats going to happen. CP will be phased out, and a new collection of POI's will emerge in a new Combo Pack to take its place. Do you honestly think the Overhaul creators are stupid??? As we've seen with the opening post, its already happening!
Players are loyal to the overhauls they enjoy and support. This slight will not be forgiven easily, if at all! This was a stupid move, and I for one cannot see the logic behind it other than vanity and ego.
We all LOVE to download several different things to make our game more enjoyable than Vanilla. We see people saying "I LOVE MULTIPLE DOWNLOADS" every single day...<Sarcasm-off>
Everyone knows whats going to happen. CP will be phased out, and a new collection of POI's will emerge in a new Combo Pack to take its place. Do you honestly think the Overhaul creators are stupid??? As we've seen with the opening post, its already happening!
Players are loyal to the overhauls they enjoy and support. This slight will not be forgiven easily, if at all! This was a stupid move, and I for one cannot see the logic behind it other than vanity and ego.
forgebench
Refugee
This will be the beginning of the end of CP.
If the TOS is too restrictive then other modders and overhaul creators will just collect it in a new package that doesn't have the "exclusives" and distribute that. CP has done this to themselves by not separating the exclusives into an add-on modlet, and that's the only way that CP can now stay relevant - if they immediately change those to a modlet.
I'm looking forward to Khaine's version. All I play is DF anyway.
If the TOS is too restrictive then other modders and overhaul creators will just collect it in a new package that doesn't have the "exclusives" and distribute that. CP has done this to themselves by not separating the exclusives into an add-on modlet, and that's the only way that CP can now stay relevant - if they immediately change those to a modlet.
I'm looking forward to Khaine's version. All I play is DF anyway.
zztong
Hunter
I hope it isn't that bad. It really seems to me like a jumble of hasty communications and actions.
I don't personally see another CP emerging, or at least not one as comprehensive as the CP, mostly because of the volume of work involved. Stallionsden is an effective shepherd for a massive number of POIs. Bringing all those A19 POIs up to A20 was a massive effort. And, the CP tries to bring them all up, not just a selective collection.
I doubt the TOS are intended to be a middle finger to anyone. Its more likely that there are a number of interests to be balanced. Stallionsden is a reasonable dude, and I think should be given the benefit of the doubt until such time as he's been able to adequately explain his position and make whatever adjustments are needed to the TOS.
Roland
Community Moderator
Hey Guys! Just a reminder to keep things civil regardless of any anger or outrage you might feel. We would like to keep this thread open so that the official CompoPack thread doesn't become the place where people go to discuss and vent.
I want to take a few moments to clarify the guidelines we all agree to abide by in the modding forum for the good of the community as it applies to this particular scenario.
1) Terms of use are only effective from the date they are posted and when a dispute occurs we go by the "last edited" date wherever it is posted. If terms of use are not posted, then permission to use as open source content is assumed.
2) Permission to use, once granted, cannot be revoked.
Traditionally going back almost a decade, prefabs have always been uploaded with the intent to share them freely with the community. I don't think it ever occurred to anyone to add terms of use to a prefab that was shared because of the intent of sharing it. Prefab authors predominately want to know that their creations are popular and highly regarded by the community. That isn't to say that someone cannot attempt to protect the asset they are sharing and adding a terms of use to their asset. In that case, the same rules stated above would apply. If a dispute arose between content authors over the use of CP we would go by those rules.
@Guppycur is concerned that we will have to add new rules regarding prefab collections that would make things more restrictive. I think as moderators (some of us modders as well) we are pretty united in wanting to keep the traditional convention of sharing prefabs without demanding express permission-- intact. Its kind of our culture. I wouldn't mind hearing from the community what you all think would be the best way to word things in order to help people resolve disputes but also to keep the sharing and building of collections of POIs open and non-restrictive. On the one hand, Stallionsden's choice is a driving force to encourage people to make new compilation packs. But on the other hand, as a community we shouldn't expect Stallionsden to do all the work of maintaining and updating hundreds of POIs for new Alpha releases and just benefit freely from his work. There has to be a balance.
Lastly, keep in mind that we are getting closer to the day when TFP will flip the switch for Steam Workshop integration at which point the method by which people share and add community content into their games is going to change radically from what we are currently doing. "Compopack" will likely be a legend that old-timers make references to chats and forums but simply a myth for all the newbs who will be browsing and pointing and clicking whatever mix of POIs they want sorted by "most popular"....
I want to take a few moments to clarify the guidelines we all agree to abide by in the modding forum for the good of the community as it applies to this particular scenario.
1) Terms of use are only effective from the date they are posted and when a dispute occurs we go by the "last edited" date wherever it is posted. If terms of use are not posted, then permission to use as open source content is assumed.
2) Permission to use, once granted, cannot be revoked.
Traditionally going back almost a decade, prefabs have always been uploaded with the intent to share them freely with the community. I don't think it ever occurred to anyone to add terms of use to a prefab that was shared because of the intent of sharing it. Prefab authors predominately want to know that their creations are popular and highly regarded by the community. That isn't to say that someone cannot attempt to protect the asset they are sharing and adding a terms of use to their asset. In that case, the same rules stated above would apply. If a dispute arose between content authors over the use of CP we would go by those rules.
@Guppycur is concerned that we will have to add new rules regarding prefab collections that would make things more restrictive. I think as moderators (some of us modders as well) we are pretty united in wanting to keep the traditional convention of sharing prefabs without demanding express permission-- intact. Its kind of our culture. I wouldn't mind hearing from the community what you all think would be the best way to word things in order to help people resolve disputes but also to keep the sharing and building of collections of POIs open and non-restrictive. On the one hand, Stallionsden's choice is a driving force to encourage people to make new compilation packs. But on the other hand, as a community we shouldn't expect Stallionsden to do all the work of maintaining and updating hundreds of POIs for new Alpha releases and just benefit freely from his work. There has to be a balance.
Lastly, keep in mind that we are getting closer to the day when TFP will flip the switch for Steam Workshop integration at which point the method by which people share and add community content into their games is going to change radically from what we are currently doing. "Compopack" will likely be a legend that old-timers make references to chats and forums but simply a myth for all the newbs who will be browsing and pointing and clicking whatever mix of POIs they want sorted by "most popular"....
forgebench
Refugee
TypicallyDrunk
Refugee
In either case CP won't go anywhere. We will figure it out. It's not all that hard to edit the poi list and drop what you want in it. Whatever the reason it's sad to see it in this position. If I was in Khaines shoes I would simply add links to contact Stallions team over every media possible. Same with ever other overhaul mod. Sometimes you have to make enough noise for it to be worth considering another solution... I'm sure with the combined base of all the overhauls it would be hard to ignore. Probably downright irritating?
For better or worse?
KhaineGB
Hunter
I've got a PM I need to reply to, but haven't had a chance. Been too busy.... ooof... what a day.
It appears the TOS was intended for CP specific POI's. As in, they were made for this iteration of CP rather than being community POI's that were contributed.
So... yeah. I am not sure how to react right now.
It appears the TOS was intended for CP specific POI's. As in, they were made for this iteration of CP rather than being community POI's that were contributed.
So... yeah. I am not sure how to react right now.
Putting mods/prefabs etc behind a 3rd party proprietary launcher with a restrictive TOS is actually pretty messed up.
Do TFP really want this to be a thing? I'm surprised the their own TOS doesn't grant themselves rights to the mods and prefabs to keep them accessible to everyone.
Do TFP really want this to be a thing? I'm surprised the their own TOS doesn't grant themselves rights to the mods and prefabs to keep them accessible to everyone.
Last edited by a moderator:
Had a look at the 7days EULA and any user created content already includes terms to give TFP license to them, furthermore you wave moral rights thus there's no need to even attribute peoples mods or prefabs back to anyone. I wonder what's stopping people ripping out the prefabs and distributing via this forum to be honest.
FranticDan
Survivor
I submitted my prefab (The Spencer Mansion from Resident Evil 1) in A19. To my knowledge, they made a few "balancing" changes that I was semi ok with.
My secrets that I dotted around the mansion were intact and players who found my secrets were rewarded for it!
In A20, they completely butchered my passion project, most of my secrets are either nerfed or removed. For example, one secret you were rewarded with 2 secret stashes, now you are rewarded with concrete blocks.
The loot room is another issue, for some reason, they decided to have the loot room in my super secret location where less than 1% of players will ever find it. This super secret originally lead the player to find signs to tell the player the location of a treasure chest, which was also nerfed to a large weapons bag.......
So, here's my ToS!
You're welcome to use my mansion on the condition that any changes that are wished to be made are run by me first, and if we can't come to an agreement to the desired changes, then I don't permit use of baby.
Translation: The current butchered version of my mansion in CP48 breaks my ToS
Any overhaul modders out there that would like the Spencer Mansion in their overhaul mods are welcome to contact me.
If you want to see the completed envisioned version of the Spencer Mansion, it has its own standalone mod on the launcher called The Spencer Mansion Incident.
My secrets that I dotted around the mansion were intact and players who found my secrets were rewarded for it!
In A20, they completely butchered my passion project, most of my secrets are either nerfed or removed. For example, one secret you were rewarded with 2 secret stashes, now you are rewarded with concrete blocks.
The loot room is another issue, for some reason, they decided to have the loot room in my super secret location where less than 1% of players will ever find it. This super secret originally lead the player to find signs to tell the player the location of a treasure chest, which was also nerfed to a large weapons bag.......
So, here's my ToS!
You're welcome to use my mansion on the condition that any changes that are wished to be made are run by me first, and if we can't come to an agreement to the desired changes, then I don't permit use of baby.
Translation: The current butchered version of my mansion in CP48 breaks my ToS
Any overhaul modders out there that would like the Spencer Mansion in their overhaul mods are welcome to contact me.
If you want to see the completed envisioned version of the Spencer Mansion, it has its own standalone mod on the launcher called The Spencer Mansion Incident.
FuriousRamsay
Refugee
I really hope we keep all of this as simple as possible.
If content was originally openly shared by an author with full distribution and modification rights then anyone taking over the work should be bound by the original intent of the author.
It doesn't matter how much additional work was included in the modification of something original. You either accept that your additional work will be bound by the original intent or you have two options:
- don't do the work
- do you own from scratch and decide on your own terms
If content was originally openly shared by an author with full distribution and modification rights then anyone taking over the work should be bound by the original intent of the author.
It doesn't matter how much additional work was included in the modification of something original. You either accept that your additional work will be bound by the original intent or you have two options:
- don't do the work
- do you own from scratch and decide on your own terms
- Status