PC Can we be a little more careful with EXP -> Stable pushes???

meganoth said:
The other problem of not taking "modding" bug reports needs some consideration as well. Bug reports from modded games should still be ignored, sure. But bug reports of modded xml that should work but doesn't, maybe even with reference to the c# code where the  bug is? Well, that is a different cup of tea. Because I suspect that library code is largely in a beta state now (instead of being the focus of redesigns and rewrites) fixing those bugs would not be fixing temporary code anymore and would have to be done eventually anyway.
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It depends.

In most cases you have A Regular Player report a bug from his modded game.
There is no way to tell what version, variant or configuration of the mod he's using or what "improvements" he may have made to it even if the name of the mod is stated.
Tracking a "bug" like that is a complete waste of time and testers have work to do.

OTOH: Modders have reported many valid bugs because they do understand what's going on - even if the bug only surfaces in the very specific conditions of their mod.
That's why we tell people to report that in the mod's topic. If a modder finds a bug that would also occur in the vanilla game then that's a wholly different category.

 
Gazz said:
It depends.

In most cases you have A Regular Player report a bug from his modded game.
There is no way to tell what version, variant or configuration of the mod he's using or what "improvements" he may have made to it even if the name of the mod is stated.
Tracking a "bug" like that is a complete waste of time and testers have work to do.
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Yes, I specifically said this category should be ignored.

Gazz said:
OTOH: Modders have reported many valid bugs because they do understand what's going on - even if the bug only surfaces in the very specific conditions of their mod.
That's why we tell people to report that in the mod's topic. If a modder finds a bug that would also occur in the vanilla game then that's a wholly different category.
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Ok, Neither KhaineGB it seems nor myself did know that you take such bug reports now. Some alphas ago I still heard a modder complain that such bug reports were not accepted and I haven't heard about a change in policy (though I tend to forget a lot that was said years ago)

But thats good to hear. @KhaineGB : You read that? Report away and if a tester were to reject your report on those grounds you can point to this official stamp of approval from Gazz.

 
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Yup, seen and remembered. If I found anything that's a base game bug, but can be exposted via modding, i'll make sure it gets passed on.

Like SellableToTrader=false showing no sell price on items, even if you can BUY them. ;)  That's been a bug for ages.

 
KhaineGB said:
Yup, seen and remembered. If I found anything that's a base game bug, but can be exposted via modding, i'll make sure it gets passed on.

Like SellableToTrader=false showing no sell price on items, even if you can BUY them. ;)  That's been a bug for ages.
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and reported as well :)

is on the KI list at aprox line 104 (just confirming its on the ki list)

 
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Awesome, also found a vanilla example of that too for reproduction.

Minibike. It's set to false (so you can't make and sell it) but it is in the trader list.

 
meganoth said:
I would be on Rolands side here but for one little detail: The fact that the last stable version in steam is not available by name but is selected by "opting out of all betas". Because of this players playing the mod with latest stable version automatically get updated to a new stable version and are left with a broken mod.
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Someone installing a mod should have it in another directory.  If they are smart enough to manual install they should install in that way themselves.  If the use the mod launcher that sphereii made it will do that for them.  That way they don't get a download that breaks their game.  So this is not an issue if they do it the correct way.

KhaineGB said:
This.

It is ESPECIALLY true with third party server hosts who often just update the server on the clients behalf and do not offer a rollback service. Even modded ones.
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Does not sound like these servers are modding friendly if they auto update and should be avoided for this reason.  For the client side of it (as I said to another post) if a mod is installed right it should be done in a different directory.  Then it would not get an update automatically and they could update once the modder has released a tested update.  We don't have steam workshop yet so there is not reason for them to install mods directly to their steam installed 7 days.

 
Anabella said:
Does not sound like these servers are modding friendly if they auto update and should be avoided for this reason.  For the client side of it (as I said to another post) if a mod is installed right it should be done in a different directory.  Then it would not get an update automatically and they could update once the modder has released a tested update.  We don't have steam workshop yet so there is not reason for them to install mods directly to their steam installed 7 days.
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You'd honestly be surprised how many hosts do it. It's scary

 
Okay guys I think we might be overreacting on this. Now I understand if we did some code changes for 19.6 b8 that we should have kept it in experimental for longer but the change that happened was changing the width of two labels and the position of a label in the twitch window. This was to fix an overlap with the twitch status and the cooldown timer. There was no hidden C# change at all. Just an xml change to windows.xml. 

Changed xml.PNG

 
KhaineGB said:
You'd honestly be surprised how many hosts do it. It's scary
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Then they need to find ones that don't do that.  I make sure that all my modded games are that way. I don't want them running an auto update for two reasons. One the mod might not be ready (or I have to make special changes to config files) and two it might be a change that has issues/bugs that would stop me from playing.  Sure have had enough of the latter happen with games like Ark. 

 
I rent a bare metal server so I can fully control it, but I know that's not for everyone. :D

Prime said:
Okay guys I think we might be overreacting on this. Now I understand if we did some code changes for 19.6 b8 that we should have kept it in experimental for longer but the change that happened was changing the width of two labels and the position of a label in the twitch window. This was to fix an overlap with the twitch status and the cooldown timer. There was no hidden C# change at all. Just an xml change to windows.xml. 

View attachment 20697
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You sure about that? Because i've got 2 C# patches that worked in 19.6b7 which now don't. One straight up crashes the main menu so hard that it doesn't even load the GUI (works if the patch is removed and DLL recompiled), second is AI-based and only triggers if the entity that uses the AI spawns (have removed the entity for now as it's non-critical)

 
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Please do not leave us lurkers hanging after you figure it out.

 
Honestly? I probably never will. I got a clean DMT, a clean 19.6b8 and it STILL does it with code that works in 19.6b7.

And I have absolutely no idea why.

 
Well this has been an interesting conversation... 

I agree with everyone. :)

... K, have you tried just that dmt code by itself against 19.8, without the other bits and pieces? 

 
Jost Amman said:
I'd also factor in the fact that mods, Darkness Falls and the others, according to all the posts I read on Steam, are the biggest reason why the game is still played today in such big numbers by the community.
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This is possibly the biggest elephant in this thread. I'd love to know how many players are running a completely un-modded version of the game. It's an amazing game, one of my favorites of all time actually, but mods improve it and give it longevity. So, a bit of heads up (respect) for the modders seems like a good idea.

 
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fabulux said:
This is possibly the biggest elephant in this thread. I'd love to know how many players are running a completely un-modded version of the game. It's an amazing game, one of my favorites of all time actually, but mods improve it and give it longevity. So, a bit of heads up (respect) for the modders seems like a good idea.
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Where did you see here that modders were treated with lack of respect?

 
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