PC Balancing SP

I really like doing stuff through sliders rather than hard coding buffs / nerfs. It makes total sense for sandbox games like this or Ark and many other games in the genre.

So no to a buff / nerf but yes to more sliders as we are all different and want different things from the game.

An xp multiplier slider seems the logical choice.

 
There is already an XP multiplier option in the game. We can set it to as low as 25%(or is it 50%?) and as high as 400% (the standard being 100%).

However, as mentioned before, player level will correspond to the gamestage so in SP, its not exactly ideal for the player to level up too fast. We don't exactly want to be fighting ferals and irradiated often when we don't have the gear or weapons for it. Hence, an option to increase the skill points gained per level instead would probably be better. It also will have some benefits for MP in that server hosts can choose whether they want to have that option as well. Like for example, players who play as a duo only but would like to have more choices available so they'd be able to play with skill point gain of 2 per level instead of 1.

 
Well I do agree to a degree lol The shared experience is a boon to MP... But I do play SP much more than MP. For me I always get one chef, one physician, one cardio, one healing factor, one huntsman, living off the land, one headshot... A few into tyrannosaurus... Then a at least 1 lucky looter and salvage operations. I usually reserve guns for horde nights so the one headshot goes a long way. With the ability to make things gated, I see no choice but to go intel and 'miner.' Much of the distribution goes into miner and motherload. Many games are get stuff to make stuff and get more stuff to make better stuff... With the ability to make better things (forge, bike, minibike, etc.) gated, for me its better to do that then to spend early points into headshot. Since I'm very good with a bow I rely on it virtually all the time. I only see the biggest difference with one headshot. For me I mean once I get or am able to make an iron pick and then a wrench, its virtually game over. For me - because many places aren't beneficial to loot early in the game, a bike is an extremely important tool to have. Especially if I can ride to the next town and find the working stiff's, or shotgun messiah... That's better than having to spend a long time running there... Situational knowledge is an important part of the game too. Needless to say that with a minibike I can traverse a great deal of the map, going from town to town to find working stiffs, shotgun messiah's or that great looting POI...
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I do the same thing. In fact most people seem to build their tree this way,either upgrading sledge hammer,bleeding or some ranged gun by mid game. I totally forgot there is a perk for using less stamina when running..

To make things worse I think lucky looter outperforms adventurer . No matter what I do I always seem to spend too much effort for too small rewards. If I level adventurer twice I double the chances of finding a decent item (increase options from 2 to 4) but the amount of loot I'd get simply from leveling looting twice is incomparable. I basically find cans,mods ,rare tools and weapons way too often and they can sustain me for the next building looting. In the meantime quests would require me to run back to the base to get some experience and loot I'd get anyway from killing zombies and looting the next building.

 
Hello guys and girls,I was thinking that SP seems kind of weak compared to MP. What I mean is playing single player rewards less experience and is much more challenging than playing MP.

The MP gameplay is vastly different compared to the SP. In MP you can choose what kind of class you want to be,either the leader (so you max intelligence),the farmer (you max endurance),the miner (you max strength) the sniper (you max agility) and so on.

In SP however you either follow a certain path or you die. The more SP games I play the more I realise there is generally only one most efficient build which is headshot perks>> stamina perks >> scavenging perks >>mining perks >> intelligence perks

In MP experience is shared to gain multiple levels in a go. You can clear multiple houses and huge buildings in a day but in SP this is almost impossible until very late game..

The fact that in MP you share experience without penalties is unfair for the SP experience. Splitting the loot in MP is easy since you clear multiple areas .

That reminds me of meepo in DotA where in the past versions one could split farm lanes and get many more levels ahead of his enemies making the game easier early game.You wouldn't lose gold neither experience and you'd essentially split farm which is very similar to what happens on 7d2d. You literally gain multiple levels based on the amount of people you have in a group. You can even split people to multitask while clearing a few houses.

I don't know what to suggest as a change. I really enjoy SP and have many lag related issues with A17 than I did in A16. Even if I do join a MP server I will mostly remain alone because I don't trust people destroying my property when I'm not looking (this happened at least two times in the past).

Should MP experience gain get nerfed? Should SP get buffed? Should I just up the experience gain on SP and have the same effect? I kind of find it cheating .

Share your thoughts!
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Please don't ever suggest nerfing MP, it is in a very terrible state already as it is.

To my long 6 years of playing this game I can certainly say single player is anything but more challenging than multiplayer, if you are a new player it may appear that way on the surface, but once you become decent and learn how the game works, how the AI works, single player is honestly still childish in terms of difficulty. I published several videos just showing how easy horde night was on even the hardest difficulty, without a base with only the first 7 days to prepare, I can still fish those out if you want to view them for educational purposes.

Here is an example why MP is harder.

1. You are NEVER safe from other players, even after you log off.

(With Zed, you log off and you don't worry about it till you log back on)

(HOWEVER, you can log off in MP to avoid horde nights, which on their own are inconsequential overall if you ask me, they turn to be more of an annoyance than an exciting feature)

{The only difference depending on server life, is how "Open" most everything will already be from other players, but also be destroyed as well, good building locations may already be taken, and you could hunt for a while to find a good base location while only finding death from a sniper shot or a turret )

2. You will need to learn how to strategically build your bases to out-wit would-be raiders, that means MANY strong layers of building materials (Reinforced Concrete/Steel/Polished Steel) Clever traps, turrets, hidden secret areas to put backup gear in case you are raided successfully by others. You will also have to carefully plan your layout within the 1 claim block (If that's still a thing )

Against Zed you may only need 2 layers, and don't need to fortify every single block in your claim, just the ones zed can reach, but against players you will need to create an enormous amount of resources very quickly to protect your base and your belongings.

A player that wields a weapon is more lethal than a zed mindlessly chasing you. lol also when you die you lose all your stuff and cannot recover them since players usually loot you.

 
@OnlyMeia They are talking about PvE, not PvP. From what i see there is way more PvE than PvP servers. PvP will get it´s own treatment from TFP after or shortly before release. The focus is now on SP/Coop.

 
@OnlyMeia They are talking about PvE, not PvP. From what i see there is way more PvE than PvP servers. PvP will get it´s own treatment from TFP after or shortly before release. The focus is now on SP/Coop.
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Usually when we discuss SP vs MP its PVE vs PVP since the main focus for MP is PVP, if you played it you would know that, but I get what you're saying for PVE oriented MP servers.

Also in regards to "PVP getting its own treatment" its been over 6 years, I think we can stop using that same silly excuse to leave the PVP'ers with empty bottles of content.

Most all of the Kick starter promises are already fulfilled but TFP keep reinventing the wheel, Most of us that have been waiting already stopped playing, or migrated to play other games, which when you think about it, is a failure when a game has great potential for something and its ignored for the same cookie cutter contributions every update, causing the players to leave the game... the idea should be to keep all your players playing, not run off all but 1 demographic.

 
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Usually when we discuss SP vs MP its PVE vs PVP since the main focus for MP is PVP, if you played it you would know that, but I get what you're saying for PVE oriented MP servers.
Also in regards to "PVP getting its own treatment" its been over 6 years, I think we can stop using that same silly excuse to leave the PVP'ers with empty bottles of content.

Most all of the Kick starter promises are already fulfilled but TFP keep reinventing the wheel, Most of us that have been waiting already stopped playing, or migrated to play other games, which when you think about it, is a failure when a game has great potential for something and its ignored for the same cookie cutter contributions every update, causing the players to leave the game... the idea should be to keep all your players playing, not run off all but 1 demographic.
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"the main focus for MP is PVP"? Don't confuse your own bubble with the world.

There is a group of people you can't see if you just look at open servers: People playing private games on rented servers or even hosted on a machine of one of the players. We players can not measure the relative size of this group of PvE MP players to PvP players. Even TFP would know only a lower bound of that number. PS: My "bubble" consists of 4-5 players that are all in this group, we only play non-public.

You have a choice: Don't believe TFP that they will look at PvP after release of the game. Then what are you still doing here? Or believe them, then yes, your patience will be tested. As you say, "MOST" kickstarter promises are fullfilled, in other words there are still some missing. Until bandits are in you probably won't see 1.0 (which means 2020 for sure). After that a version 1.1 PvP would need at least another half year. So 2021 might see the PvP overhaul and not even that is guaranteed. Accept it now and you won't be constantly disappointed.

 
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"the main focus for MP is PVP"? Don't confuse your own bubble with the world.
There is a group of people you can't see if you just look at open servers: People playing private games on rented servers or even hosted on a machine of one of the players. We players can not measure the relative size of this group of PvE MP players to PvP players. Even TFP would know only a lower bound of that number. PS: My "bubble" consists of 4-5 players that are all in this group, we only play non-public.

You have a choice: Don't believe TFP that they will look at PvP after release of the game. Then what are you still doing here? Or believe them, then yes, your patience will be tested. As you say, "MOST" kickstarter promises are fullfilled, in other words there are still some missing. Until bandits are in you probably won't see 1.0 (which means 2020 for sure). After that a version 1.1 PvP would need at least another half year. So 2021 might see the PvP overhaul and not even that is guaranteed. Accept it now and you won't be constantly disappointed.
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The main focus for multiplayer weighs heavily on the pvp side, you should look at some statistics before blindly asserting insults towards another. you may have many more PVE servers that have 1 or 2 players, but you will find many servers that have so many players its become a common idea to donate to become white listed so you always have a server slot.

I know some of you do a quick search online and see all those PVE servers, and most of them have no players in them, mean while you can have 1 pvp server that has more players than nearly a dozen of those pve servers.

Look I've had this conversation with many people including TFP themselves regarding the sorry state they leave PVP in.

No, I don't have any faith that they will ever finish this game to the point they come out with a full beta release the many years it has been in alpha.

So many of you are always so angry when pvp gets mentioned, its rather funny. Look I don't think the PVP community wants full focus for it, but a few tweaks that would boil down to hotfixes, something someone could "Copy and paste" to fix a few of our issues, instead gets turned on deaf ears, and I think after the many years of waiting, we have very much a good reason to be unhappy about that, but you PVE giddies are all spoiled.

I've played this game since nearly release, Your opinion holds very little value to me. Quite the rhetoric in fact.

I've said this before, but to get back onto topic, if they want to balance SP they need more content and to stop stretching what we already have so thin by debilitating the player and locking all of those abilities behind perks and other inane requirements.

Content, Make more content, stop with the artificial difficulty.

 
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The main focus for multiplayer weighs heavily on the pvp side, you should look at some statistics before blindly asserting insults towards another. you may have many more PVE servers that have 1 or 2 players, but you will find many servers that have so many players its become a common idea to donate to become white listed so you always have a server slot.
I know some of you do a quick search online and see all those PVE servers, and most of them have no players in them, mean while you can have 1 pvp server that has more players than nearly a dozen of those pve servers.

...

So many of you are always so angry when pvp gets mentioned, its rather funny.
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Sorry if I insulted you, what was the insult? And where do you get that I'm angry?

Those statistics you talk about are not accurate at all. For example my server is not in that list you see when you start 7d2d. You can't see my server in any statistic.

 
Guys... Guys. GUYS!

A18 is around the corner, so let's wait for it, because some of your concerns may as well be moot at this point.

 
There is already an XP multiplier option in the game. We can set it to as low as 25%(or is it 50%?) and as high as 400% (the standard being 100%).
However, as mentioned before, player level will correspond to the gamestage so in SP, its not exactly ideal for the player to level up too fast. We don't exactly want to be fighting ferals and irradiated often when we don't have the gear or weapons for it. Hence, an option to increase the skill points gained per level instead would probably be better. It also will have some benefits for MP in that server hosts can choose whether they want to have that option as well. Like for example, players who play as a duo only but would like to have more choices available so they'd be able to play with skill point gain of 2 per level instead of 1.
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I agree in theory, though doubling the amount of points might be excessive, idk. At some point it does break the game by letting the player unlock everything very fast.

 
Late to the party, but quick replies are too easy..

Assuming added skill points would be the goal for SP; wouldn't an organic way to balance the difference between group sizes be granting at least some of them via loot? One POI gives, say 1-5 skill points, single player gets them all, a group of 3 gets "one each".

Oh, did I just describe the A18 book system? Sounds... plausible? :)

 
Late to the party, but quick replies are too easy..Assuming added skill points would be the goal for SP; wouldn't an organic way to balance the difference between group sizes be granting at least some of them via loot? One POI gives, say 1-5 skill points, single player gets them all, a group of 3 gets "one each".

Oh, did I just describe the A18 book system? Sounds... plausible? :)
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In the first moment yes. :smile-new: But:

Groups can clear POIs faster than a single player, so while he gets to read all 3 books out of one POI, the group has cleared nearly 3 POI's and found 9 books.

And it gets worse: Since a complete book set gives a special bonus and specific players need some books more than others, the group can distribute the 9 books to the players that benefit the most and already have learned books in that specific set.

 
Sure;

While I'm not convinced of the "equal speed to book cases" as a group of 3 - there's plenty of added overhead from the players coordinating and some added gamestage-difficulty even in the current implementation.

But, the group will always "as the bare minimum" have the option of splitting into three separate "single players" whenever that is more effective, so there's never going to be a way to really balance the situation.

But I think the coming book system won't in practice feel as unfair as the current one. (I've never even faced the issue myself tbh, I haven't stepped into a multiplayer-with-strangers in this game ever.. :) )

 
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