PC Alpha17 Feedback after 40 hours.

Something you love to provoke in your path to discredit any criticism.
I think the problem is that most of the player that are expressing what in their opinion is currently wrong with the game really focus on what they think is wrong rather than throwing a cookie in your mouth every here and then. The critical posts are typically so long packed with good feedback focussing on what's missing - what's typically not mentioned is what those players think went right. So maybe you read between the lines to get that cookie sometimes.
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Generally what I see in the critical posts is just a lot of infantile pouting, ad hominem attacks and general douchebaggery. You can give me a diamond worth a million dollars but if you've stuffed it inside a moose poop don't expect me to thank you for the moose poop.

 
OR, an easier way that doesnt require any change to the games code, only have the materials for the tier you want in your inventory .
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Too tedious for large builds and mistakes still happen. Trying to repair steel spikes around a concrete wall and you accidentally upgrade the concrete to steel when you miss the spike. You also have to constantly swap out materials and it's just a needless hassle when some simple xml changes fixes it. Not to mention - I simply don't like things like upgrading or repairing concrete with a nail gun - ruins immersion to even see it. While I call it a downside - I actually like the fact that more of the tools are useful this way. The way it is now - once you get a nail-gun most all other tools besides wrench are pretty useless.

 
Is this in 199 or coming in the next update?
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Internal build was up to 202 last night. Not sure if they cooked another one today. The changes would be in the new update. Not sure when that will be coming.

 
Where did I trash someone’s opinion? You’re just continuing to make stuff up again. Please tell us again that your source says that what everyone is playing right now won’t show up until 2019....
This report was from someone with 40+hrs in the game and had a mixture of likes and dislikes. I didn’t say a word about his criticism or his praise. I just told him it’s a good example of great feedback which it is. He didn’t get angry about his dislikes and didn’t make false unknowable assumptions about the intentions of the developers like you often do (or just flat out make up sources). Anyone who read the OP and thought it was all rainbows and unicorns needs to read it again.

It was very constructive.
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Your first statement is a bare faced lie, its currently 24th of November and I said no A17 until 2019 was what I was told, now if A17 S T A B L E drops before xmas you'll have proven that wrong, why don't we wait and see who is right there Roland ...

My second statement was that it was a mess, and that was over a month ago, well duh, look at what landed, I will take that one I think.

Additionally i did not mention anything about people showing up or not showing up, i can quote the exact words if you like but then thats what you want because you banned for saying it the first time and would just use that as an excuse to ban me again.

And fyi I have given positive feedback on many points already for A17 such as the POI design, that does not take away from all the broken rubbish.

 
Very even handed
You trash everyone complaining about a whole host of things with long posts about how wrong they are but when a guy says he likes it then its ''great feedback''

Definitely a fair approach there Roland
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I clearly can see you 2 dont like each other but dont drag down this thread into the mud please. If you have some beef with roland take it to the PMs.

 
My thoughts exactly. The good feedback is actually the one that challenges your views, not the one that gives you a little pat on the back - if you are aiming for improvement that is.
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Constructive criticism is always a positive and welcome. If it is in complaint form criticism is not a positive and easily dismissed. Study how the OP made his points, write about anything you don't like in the same way and it will be taken in a positive way. Notice how Roland, fataal, and Mad Mole all responded to the OP? Try it!

 
I like the idea of restricting upgrades to certain tools by material- accidental upgrade is a pet peeve of mine, too. Carrying multiple tools is a pain, but what about a (higher-level) recipe that allows you to make a "tool kit" that contains everything in one slot- but you select the specific tool to use via radial menu?

Hard-boiled eggs are a pain early game. I'd love to see a recipe for scrambled eggs- two eggs in a cookpot, make the gains about like two HB.

 
Where did I trash someone’s opinion? You’re just continuing to make stuff up again. Please tell us again that your source says that what everyone is playing right now won’t show up until 2019....
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Alpha 17 isn't out yet Roland. 37 days left and ticking.

That person claimed A17's development was a mess, what 2 months ago? After playing the experimental, I would say a "mess" is an understatement. It's literally killed multiplayer.

 
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More feedback.

Infection is absolutely deadly during horde night. Getting infected means losing most of your stamina, on top of having increased stamina costs for everything, a deadly double dipping combo. You never know whether or not you'll actually get infected, so unless you keep chugging down antibiotics (And even then) you can suddenly become completely incapable of fighting back.

Update: Game crashed while we were driving the jeep and it is now nowhere to be found. There's an icon on the compass but not the jeep, and my girlfriend ended up halfway accross the map after rejoining. Not very nice.

 
My thoughts exactly. The good feedback is actually the one that challenges your views, not the one that gives you a little pat on the back - if you are aiming for improvement that is.
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I personally found the post a good example of constructive criticism because it made me think about the game a different way. The OP did this by explaining get in detail how he plays, what he liked and what he didn’t like. I’ve read your post, MoldyBread’s post, and some of the others and none of them had the same impact me. First and foremost it’s not clear to me how you play the game. Do you play PVE or do you play PVP? How many players are on the server you regularly play on?

 
I personally found the post a good example of constructive criticism because it made me think about the game a different way. The OP did this by explaining get in detail how he plays, what he liked and what he didn’t like. I’ve read your post, MoldyBread’s post, and some of the others and none of them had the same impact me. First and foremost it’s not clear to me how you play the game. Do you play PVE or do you play PVP? How many players are on the server you regularly play on?
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I've made offers to Madmole/TFP staff to come play on a well-ran, large PVP server with a Discord channel on at least three separate occasions over the last 3 years. The goal being to take a few hours, play with a crew, go on some raids, fight a bit, and view the larger server builds and awesome mods that people have come up with. A lot of the big PVP servers actually have tons of player built communal areas (arenas, central trading, banking, vending areas) because the admins usually can't PVP and fill their time with creative construction. It's always been crickets from them, and I wouldn't even know where to go to show it to them now. The changes they have made have killed the ability for 90% of that. I'm a firm believer that they don't want to understand how people enjoy the game, unless it's to confirm their bias in the forums. They just want to "make" the game they want. If I had to bet, I would put money on it that Madmole isn't even playing A17 experimental in his spare time. I bet he's playing Fallout or some other action RPG.

 
A17 needs a lot of work. Horde OP on bases. 1st Horde night had Cops, Spiders, ect. and they went through concrete like it was butter not good. Stamina sucks. Should not be based on FOOD.

 
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I've made offers to Madmole/TFP staff to come play on a well-ran, large PVP server with a Discord channel on at least three separate occasions over the last 3 years. The goal being to take a few hours, play with a crew, go on some raids, fight a bit, and view the larger server builds and awesome mods that people have come up with. A lot of the big PVP servers actually have tons of player built communal areas (arenas, central trading, banking, vending areas) because the admins usually can't PVP and fill their time with creative construction. It's always been crickets from them, and I wouldn't even know where to go to show it to them now. The changes they have made have killed the ability for 90% of that. I'm a firm believer that they don't want to understand how people enjoy the game, unless it's to confirm their bias in the forums. They just want to "make" the game they want. If I had to bet, I would put money on it that Madmole isn't even playing A17 experimental in his spare time. I bet he's playing Fallout or some other action RPG.
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I feel for you. Game has massive pvp potential. From my time on the forums, I have seen little interest/focus on the PVP area. This has not been a surprise to me though since they have mentioned several times their focus has primarily has been around small group interactions (ie 8 player coop).

It would be awesome to see the developers give proper attention to PVP at some point as I think that will be the tipping point that catapults the game from cult classic to mainstream popularity and success.

 
I feel for you. Game has massive pvp potential. From my time on the forums, I have seen little interest/focus on the PVP area. This has not been a surprise to me though since they have mentioned several times their focus has primarily has been around small group interactions (ie 8 player coop).
It would be awesome to see the developers give proper attention to PVP at some point as I think that will be the tipping point that catapults the game from cult classic to mainstream popularity and success.
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I so wish bandits were in the game and zombies had guns. There were A16 mods that had all that, it functioned, and it was so much fun.

Now, we just have zombie jackhammerhands.

 
I so wish bandits were in the game and zombies had guns. There were A16 mods that had all that, it functioned, and it was so much fun.
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I don't know about zombies with guns but I enjoyed having bandits and survivors.

 
I don't know about zombies with guns but I enjoyed having bandits and survivors.
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It's intense. It also highlighted the desire to be stealthy, because mobs would reveal your position to nearby players by chasing, shouting, and shooting at you. I wish I had the mod name. There were sniper zombies, rocket launcher rare zombies, ak47 zombies, pistol zombies, shotgun zombies, and they all dropped some of their own unique varieties of loot/special server event related items.

 
Good post. I've already made acid more abundant and I'm lowering bicycle INT req to 4. You'll still have to scrounge up a workbench at a trader to craft it, but I find working stuff in POIs too.
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Nice to hear that. You know when you missed something the past Alphas in the moment you try the feature. Love the bicycle. Awesome work.

 
Internal build was up to 202 last night. Not sure if they cooked another one today. The changes would be in the new update. Not sure when that will be coming.
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Do you know when the bike int 4 change will be? I didnt see it in the 208 update notes. Maybe I missed it?

 
I'm "only" on day 24 in my game and going at it solo, so a little less far along, but most of what you wrote mirrors my experiences.
Before I sum up my criticisms, I have to say that TFP really exceeded my expectations with this build. Hats off to the team, it's obvious that a lot of work was put into this update and although I still think the EA update/information cycle leaves a lot to be desired, at least the payoff is quite big this time around. I haven't been this absorbed by a game in a while, nicely done.

My current game is my third attempt at A17e, the first two were cut short by multiple deaths and feeling behind the curve too much to continue. For this one, I went back to Navezgane (initial two were RWG). Settings/difficulty were mostly standard, aside from marking airdrops because I felt I needed the help :) So far, I've only died once, and it wasn't even on a Blood Moon (got swarmed in some dusty attic).

My criticisms so far

  • I got lucky with iron tools from traders/WS crates, so I'm unsure if the current forge gate is bad, but it feels like the reqs could be lowered a bit. Iron tools aren't that powerful without perks invested anyways.
     
     
  • Bicycle should either be easily lootable or craftable from scratch (once materials have been found). It makes exploration so much more enjoyable, without being so fast as to render distance moot.
     
     
  • Mods are great, too bad the progression.xml is still such a mess. Have to add most of them manually, in addition to the saw table and chem station.
     
     
  • Currently the only viable way of leveling up is by fighting zombies. Mining and crafting need an XP buff to make them more worthwhile activities. Zombie XP could be scaled down a little to balance it out. I'm currently seeking out hordes just for the XP, and whacking slow conga lines in the head gets old. Variation in XP would be neat!
     
     
  • RWG towns look better than ever thanks to the huge variation in POIs, but the landscape is a patchy mess of forest and burned forest, which is annoying to navigate and soon becomes boring. No problem with having only one desert and snow biome in the South and North, but we need more reasons to actually go there in RWG. Skyscrapers and wasteland seem to be missing in action. Needs more high risk/high reward areas imho.
     
     
  • Quests are mostly pointless, as OP stated. Too much travel time for laughable XP (killing two zombies nets you more) and lackluster items as rewards too often. Running through a POI dungeon is a much better reward all by itself. Maybe if quests had a better chance for rare but critical loot as reward (even relatively early on)? I.e. beakers, acid, seeds, mods/schematics. (EDIT: seeing rewards up front would help!!)
     
     
  • Zombie/horde AI is obviously an improvement over A16, but needs serious tweaking for better immersion and more dynamic horde nights.
    - Non-BM hordes need to go for your "last known position" rather than locking on and navigating straight to the player.
    - Bloodmoon hordes need varied pathing/intelligence: right now the best/only strategy seems to be exploiting their GPS pathing by deliberately leaving a hole in your defenses so they all come through an easily set up kill zone. It feels like cool, immersive bases aren't viable because the zombies will always target the weakest spot all together anyways.
     
     
  • Loot is way too saturated with low quality guns. I've started scrapping pretty much every one I find, just so I can easily get the ammo and a few mechanical parts. I was swimming in dukes at the end of the first week just by selling guns that felt like game changers in A16. I get that the mods now make the difference, but it would be nice if finding guns still felt exciting. Especially if pre-modded guns were a possible find (would obviously have to be rare).
     
     
  • Lighting is very pleasing in general, but day/night transitions are way too abrupt and during the night there seem to be sudden shifts in global illumination.
     
     
  • Please fix the night vision goggles, the A16 implementation was fine!


That's it for now. Hopefully this was of some use!
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This is much better feedback than what OP said IMO.

 
lights on the 4x4 truck

just wanted to add in addition to the night vision goggles not working as Hrod land mentioned

that the head lights on the 4x4 truck do not seem to work also

(was playing in creative mode)

 
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