PC Alpha 21 Dev Diary

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Riamus said:
That doesn't seem right, though.  If the items are in POI and can be added to POI in the editor, you are going to see them in many more places in the game than if you put them in your base.
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I was puzzled by that point too. POI creators are going to put those advanced assets into POIs. It is hard for me to say if POIs will use them in greater density than player bases. I have certainly seen some impressive player bases that bogged the game down when you got near them.

However, POI creators might have some advantages, such as the Prefab Editor showing us the vertices and triangle counts. Many designers are already aware that certain objects cost more than others, such as vehicles.

 
Riamus said:
That doesn't seem right, though.  If the items are in POI and can be added to POI in the editor, you are going to see them in many more places in the game than if you put them in your base.  Besides, we can build things in our bases that are far more taxing (bulletproof glass and trigger plates, for example).  And unless we go crazy with those, they really don't have much impact.

I think allowing us to use them if we want without needing to use the creative menu would be a good thing.  Besides, not everything currently only available in the creative menu is high poly.  After all, we can make a barrel on fire, but not a plain barrel and I doubt that plain barrel (or group of four) is high poly.  And, in the end, if we can do it with creative menu, all you are doing by not allowing them in the main game is forcing people to use the creative menu and the result is the same whether the items are added normally or through the creative menu.

So it sounds like a good reason, but doesn't really hold water.
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Imagine a player crafting 100 high poly deco blocks and placing them all next to each other.

On top of that place several light sources on them.

FPS will start taking a hit.  It snowballs pretty quickly.

In my opinion this is more important in multiplayer where unrestricted high poly placement leads to poor performance for others.

Not saying it will never happen since optimization is ongoing, but probably not a priority until all other core features are in.

 
bdubyah said:
See, this I disagree with completely. There is no reason whatsoever that the game should indicate that any enemy is now dead. That should be on the player to know or find out. I am fine with a variety of options being available, but kill XP could go away and I'd be happy. You can leave crafting/looting XP, but the kill XP just makes it too easy to know if something died. And if they chose to remove the current style popup for it there is no reason some other mechanic should be added to take its place.
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The xp notification doesn't really matter in the long run. In my 0xp mod the notification never showed up but it was still very apparent when zombies were dead for good because there was a death scream and animation that was different than when they were simply knocked back. So I removed the death stuff and made it so that they always just did the knock back animation whether it was because they were dead or because they were knocked back and it became truly ambiguous. Adding to that a variable timer for how long zombies would recover and there was no telling if they were finally dead or not.

But now TFP has invested not only in special death sounds, and animations, but also in gory final hits that really make it clear. WIth all that investment into signs of final death I doubt they would ever remove it all just so we have that ambiguous worry about whether they are down for good or might get back up again. Madmole has even said that he likes knowing at the time of the final hit that it is the final hit. 

The point is that with all the tells added to the game the xp notification is not the only way you would know.

ROCKGENERATION said:
Can someone explain the chunk reset option to me. What it exactly entails and why its default set to off. Thanks
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A chunk that has not been visited by a player in X days and is not protected by a claim block or a bedroll is reset to how it was when it was first generated at the creation of the world. At first it was set to 15 days for default but after then there was a bug where the setting "disabled" meant the timer was disabled instead of the feature being disabled. This cause chunks to reset the moment the player left it and everyone experienced what it was like to have their progress reset when not expecting it.

After that the bug was fixed and the default was changed to off. lol

 
Roland said:
The xp notification doesn't really matter in the long run. In my 0xp mod the notification never showed up but it was still very apparent when zombies were dead for good because there was a death scream and animation that was different than when they were simply knocked back. So I removed the death stuff and made it so that they always just did the knock back animation whether it was because they were dead or because they were knocked back and it became truly ambiguous. Adding to that a variable timer for how long zombies would recover and there was no telling if they were finally dead or not.

But now TFP has invested not only in special death sounds, and animations, but also in gory final hits that really make it clear. WIth all that investment into signs of final death I doubt they would ever remove it all just so we have that ambiguous worry about whether they are down for good or might get back up again. Madmole has even said that he likes knowing at the time of the final hit that it is the final hit. 

The point is that with all the tells added to the game the xp notification is not the only way you would know.
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True, but it's the worst and most blatant. If there is a small cluster of zombies it can be easy to miss certain sounds or animations. One on one it's pretty easy, but that's not a big deal. It's when you potentially have more than one knocked down and others still coming at you it can get tricky to navigate.

I certainly don't expect TFP to undo what they've been working on, but a simply toggle option for at least kill XP would be nice. And about those gory deaths, any new ones coming?

 
Yeah, poor ol' Steve is the only cool one in a20. Lol. So are there more now? I figured it would've been something to show off.

 
Im gonna go ahead and assume that "done when its done" means not anytime soon and stop asking cause it annoys us lol.

Makes me a little sad as I have some fond memories of playing a new update around christmas time and can say that even with mods im getting a lil bored lately.

Would love to see you guys be able to add holiday events to the game, giant santa zombie who drops christmas canes we can pop in the mouth for a buff or two idk.

 
Laz Man said:
Imagine a player crafting 100 high poly deco blocks and placing them all next to each other.

On top of that place several light sources on them.

FPS will start taking a hit.  It snowballs pretty quickly.

In my opinion this is more important in multiplayer where unrestricted high poly placement leads to poor performance for others.

Not saying it will never happen since optimization is ongoing, but probably not a priority until all other core features are in.
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I understand that a player can build something that causes poor performance.  That is already true and that is the point I was making.

Yes, it can cause problems on a server and I think the server admin can put in place rules for their server, such as that if your building causes significant last to others, a warning is issued to tone it down and failure to comply will cause you to be banned from the server.  I see no problem leaving such things in the hands of server admins if it becomes a problem.

As mentioned, players can already do this.  Just place as hundred bulletproof glass blocks and you will start seeing problems.  Can it be abused? Sure.  But if a player is having performance problems in their own base, I don't think they will want to keep it that way.  I think the percent of people who would abuse this is very low.

If the devs think it is too much chance for abuse, then they can put in a maximum number of those blocks in a chunk and can provide notification to the player when using the items that there is such a limit due to performance problems.  This could then be a setting in the game.  Single player can disable it.  Servers can set it to whatever they feel is best for their players.  It is a win for everyone.

At worst, all the basic items that are not high poly should be added, such as the barrels I mentioned.  I for one prefer to keep items in containers that make sense - water in the water dispenser, gas in a gas barrel, beer in the wooden wine casks (close enough for beer barrels), etc.  Having certain items disabled/hidden is more annoying to me than if I were to experience performance problems.  I have a feeling many would say the same and if playing on servers would prefer to have these items available and then just find a better server if they have too many problems on a given server.

 
Could do a building limit thing like ARK has for certain things. Tag all of the more expensive blocks and scan the area when placing them. If there's too many don't allow more until some are removed. Could have a setting for it where you can increase/decrease the limit.

Or, just let players do as they want. If they lag their game that's on them. Servers can monitor their own players.

 
Roland said:
But now TFP has invested not only in special death sounds, and animations, but also in gory final hits that really make it clear. WIth all that investment into signs of final death I doubt they would ever remove it all just so we have that ambiguous worry about whether they are down for good or might get back up again. Madmole has even said that he likes knowing at the time of the final hit that it is the final hit. 
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I do like the "finishing moves" and am definitely not for removing them.  However, they don't happen 100% of the time.  It is certainly gratifying when it does happen.  But when it doesn't happen, I also like the ambiguity.

Maybe one mod could be to scramble the pain and death sounds in sounds.xml.  That would really keep people guessing when the death sound plays and the zombie comes back for more!

 
I love the XP notification, because I find it 'gamey' and rewarding. XP is another resource and that feedback is very appreciated by me and my team, and it's easier to see than the xp bar while fighting (which doesn't really matter). That said, I do see why it would be a problem to fully experience the survival-horror part of the game, as knowing when a death happens is a bit lame for the immersion aspect. 

I suggest putting several elements of the HUD as optional, specially that one.

 
RipClaw said:
I can imagine applications where this indicator would be helpful for experienced players as well.

For example, the level designers could design particularly dangerous POIs for players who want a challenge. Instead of making these buildings obvious, players can use this feature to identify these buildings. 
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Eh. I’m still not buying the idea of it. Just seems rather unnecessary, and I agree with other posters who say it adds clutter to the UI. I do like the idea of customization of the UI, so I hope something like that is added too.

 
meganoth said:
You are right that a death indicator is useful, but there is definitely no **need** for it. You may like it that way, but the fact that zombies have this way of playing dead in the middle of the fight should tell you that it was intended that you have to guess, make sure with another hit or always stay a bit away from fresh corpses. Since I have bad peripheral vision I still mostly get the accidental benefit of having to cope with un-dead undead 😉

For TFP the XP display seems to be more important than to keep players guessing, I don't think they will change the xp display. But there are many players who like this guessing game for the same reason they like feral mode.
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bdubyah said:
See, this I disagree with completely. There is no reason whatsoever that the game should indicate that any enemy is now dead. That should be on the player to know or find out. I am fine with a variety of options being available, but kill XP could go away and I'd be happy. You can leave crafting/looting XP, but the kill XP just makes it too easy to know if something died. And if they chose to remove the current style popup for it there is no reason some other mechanic should be added to take its place.
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It's a matter of convenience.One of the responses from the game to the player's action.This is a trifle, but the comfort of the game consists of such trifles.The lack of a murder indication suggests that the game is from the 90s - early 2000s, when you just shot and did not feel any return from the game.Just cardboard targets.
I've been playing with this little thing for over a thousand hours.And this little thing added a drop of comfort every time.If this little thing is removed, then every time it will be a drop of irritation, which will become a bucket of irritation after another thousand hours.
Hiding HUD elements is not so hard, and I think it's important to take the time to do it so that everyone can configure it as they feel comfortable.This is the main message of my text.
Arguing about playing styles doesn't make sense.Everyone will choose for himself what is closer to him and it is good when the game allows you to play it in different ways.

7000 hours spent in 7D2D said:
Im gonna go ahead and assume that "done when its done" means not anytime soon and stop asking cause it annoys us lol.

Makes me a little sad as I have some fond memories of playing a new update around christmas time and can say that even with mods im getting a lil bored lately.

Would love to see you guys be able to add holiday events to the game, giant santa zombie who drops christmas canes we can pop in the mouth for a buff or two idk.
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It's a little strange to read such a message.It's always been fun for me to watch how before the release of a new alpha, the current one turns into a pumpkin for people.
When the game becomes gold, people will stop playing out of habit in a year waiting for an update?

 
RipClaw said:
@Vedui has made a video about that feature. I think he can explain it better than I can.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNwvz-VZmd0
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Thanks yeah that was very helpful, I agree in the video on the proximity of chunks. I think thats what I am most confused on. What actually constitutes a chunk and where you need to be to visit one. Is the gas station its own chunk or does it include more areas. Do I need to step inside, if the underground area is edited on and i dont go down there will it restore. etc. etc. I can imagine this is ambiguous for many POIs and I hope they clarify the parameters a little further other wise I think this setting will be less useful. 

I really enjoy this feature for cars and a few other things. Its seriously a nightmare after a certain point when you've set a base up and more or less conquered the bordering town and roads and there are just no vehicles for miles in any direction for you to loot anymore. Makes things start to feel a bit barren too.

 
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Blake_ said:
I love the XP notification, because I find it 'gamey' and rewarding. XP is another resource and that feedback is very appreciated by me and my team, and it's easier to see than the xp bar while fighting (which doesn't really matter). That said, I do see why it would be a problem to fully experience the survival-horror part of the game, as knowing when a death happens is a bit lame for the immersion aspect. 

I suggest putting several elements of the HUD as optional, specially that one.
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I agree. On a side note, I miss the old level up sound and the old bloodmoon sound. They gave the game a more rewarding feeling and sounded gamey.

I'd also like to touch base on this new level up by reading system. Not much has been mentioned about what happend with the actions (perks) like parkour, using a bow, using mining tools, hunting, running etc...

With the new level up by reading system for crafting, a perfect compliment to it would be a level up by doing system for anything that involves actions. This hybrid system would balance the game very well. 

Even the pimps admitted that the issue with the level up by doing system when it was originally implemented was the crafting aspect. But since that is fixed now with level up by reading, it will work again. 

Please give this hybrid system idea some thought and consideration. Many players out there would welcome this with open arms. 

Undead legacy is very popular and uses a LUBD system. 

Thanks

 
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