PC Alpha 21 Dev Diary

[Matt115]

Spoiler

I have suffered this too. Actually I am on lootstage 300+ in a war3zuk AIO  and been playing for weeks and I still can't find welder schematic. I cannot make HD bullets. Its a nightmare.

I just want to be able to find anything random because that would be the reality. Loot stage actually annoys me. I would at least like to have the option to ignore loot stage. I am not against change though but that is only because I am a modder so no matter the outcome I can play my way.

I don't like gamestage idea to but well nothing can be done

 

[LordCorellon]

Not going to apologize for what I'm about to say.

What you are doing here is not the 7 days to Die MULTIPLAYER game you created.

This will turn your game into a single player sandbox game. You are removing alot, if not most of the "teamwork" aspect your game got its greatest strength from.

You are erasing this. You are erasing the "working together" and frankly I would not be surprised AT ALL that the old comments that you want 7 days to die to be just a "loot and shoot" and remove building from it entirely.

Thats the way you are going. If thats what you wanted, finish 7 Days to Die, get it out of alpha, and go make a new project and STOP DESTROYING THIS ONE!

Your fans love this game, love the job all the mod makers are doing, (frankly the mod makers are whats keeping this game alive BTW)

Now you are throwing it all away after 20 ALPHAS to make a brand new game that is totally different from the vision you started out with.

This isnt progression, this is regression. This is dismantling the game YOU BUILT for a new game that should be separate from 7D2D.

This is one change you should not be making, and you damn well know it!

 

[Red Eagle LXIX]

I'm going to comment.

I don't like that I have to learn to build a robotic sledge to upgrade from a Pipe Baton to a Stun Baton (seriously, what?).   Stun Baton should come before Robotic Sledge from a logical progression perspective.  I gather it is likely just one of those gameplay choices but since everything is being redone, worth mentioning.

Also, Robotics adds up to 144 out of 100. 

Sorry couldn't help point out the bug in the screenshot.  To Be Fair I didn't notice it, someone mentioned it on Steam. 

 

[Tmodloader]

New crafting system looks excellent, much better than the current system. 

 

[hiemfire]

Also, Robotics adds up to 144 out of 100. 

I don't think the progression to each schematic unlock is sequential, ie finishing the previous schematic's tiers before you can unlock the next. Looks more like it is overlapping with the first portion of the progress fraction indicating how many points gained so far and the second indicating how many need to be accrued in total to unlock the displayed tier of the schematic.

 

[Tmodloader]

I have to admit: the crafting overhaul makes me pretty nervous. The current system works great because the majority of the key recipes (basic weapon for your tree, forge, bicycle, wrench, first aid bandages, etc) are all easily accessible and you can grab them with minimal investment. This means that with zero luck / RNG, you can get the basics set up. I always start a place from scratch in every new world and this is critical to me. With a minimal amount of luck to find a couple components to make the forge, I'm all set in a new world.

I'm afraid that the new system could potentially fall into the "progression blocked by RNG" trap where you can't make a key item because you haven't been lucky enough to find it. I still have war flashbacks to the A15 era Calipers. I distinctly remember a world where it was day 150+ and nobody on the server could make any bullets because we never found them. We were swimming in materials but no calipers to actually make anything with them. Our server admin eventually stepped in to give everyone some from the creative menu. 

How will the new system work to prevent this from coming back to the game? 

The current system is honestly terrible, do you really use crafting beyond a few points in the game? I don't. I play on delete inventory on death and looting and questing is still the only way to play. Crafting is nearly useless currently so unless you just hate crafting in general, it is not great. Not to mention using your abilities to unlock recipes feels like a huge waste when you can find the same recipes in looting right now. Considering the 100 skill levels for crafting stuff, I doubt you'll end up rng blocked with the abundance needed for those numbers.

 

[Matt115]

Not going to apologize for what I'm about to say.

What you are doing here is not the 7 days to Die MULTIPLAYER game you created.

This will turn your game into a single player sandbox game. You are removing alot, if not most of the "teamwork" aspect your game got its greatest strength from.

You are erasing this. You are erasing the "working together" and frankly I would not be surprised AT ALL that the old comments that you want 7 days to die to be just a "loot and shoot" and remove building from it entirely.

Thats the way you are going. If thats what you wanted, finish 7 Days to Die, get it out of alpha, and go make a new project and STOP DESTROYING THIS ONE!

Your fans love this game, love the job all the mod makers are doing, (frankly the mod makers are whats keeping this game alive BTW)

Now you are throwing it all away after 20 ALPHAS to make a brand new game that is totally different from the vision you started out with.

This isnt progression, this is regression. This is dismantling the game YOU BUILT for a new game that should be separate from 7D2D.

This is one change you should not be making, and you damn well know it!

I agree about even bigger focus on looting with every new alpha

 

[Deceptive Pastry]

My main concern with this is, there are plenty of people who enjoy playing this game like minecraft. Mine, craft, build. Often times in multiplayer one or more players gravitate toward that role because that is what they like doing. If you have perk weighted looting, the looters will be bringing back less loot that the rest of the team can actually use, forcing the base builders to either go looting or progress slower. The variable shape blocks were an incredible addition, but then this just seems like another step toward looter shooter and away from more of a sandbox survival game.

But then, I still think the best system is a combined system of LBD + LBL like in say Undead Legacy. You get XP just for doing the thing, but you also find +1 skill books to supplement. And LBD is never coming back so...whatever. I'll probably just mod it out like many other changes.

 

[schwanz9000]

I don't think the progression to each schematic unlock is sequential, ie finishing the previous schematic's tiers before you can unlock the next. Looks more like it is overlapping with the first portion of the progress fraction indicating how many points gained so far and the second indicating how many need to be accrued in total to unlock the displayed tier of the schematic.

Correct. That column shows the current number of magazines read vs how many you need to unlock the next quality level.
As you can see here, I have fully unlocked the pipe baton with 10 magazines. Reading one more will give me the ability to start crafting the robo sledges

 

[Roland]

I'm going to comment.

I don't like that I have to learn to build a robotic sledge to upgrade from a Pipe Baton to a Stun Baton (seriously, what?).   Stun Baton should come before Robotic Sledge from a logical progression perspective.  I gather it is likely just one of those gameplay choices but since everything is being redone, worth mentioning.

Also, Robotics adds up to 144 out of 100. 

Sorry couldn't help point out the bug in the screenshot.  To Be Fair I didn't notice it, someone mentioned it on Steam. 

You don't have to use the robotic sledge. Its just that you will learn how to craft them. I'm betting the reason is that Madmole wanted something in between a pipe baton and the stun baton that will make it obsolete. This grants you time to play with the pipe baton at the highest level before you cast it aside and start playing with the stun baton. 

I don't think the order of the recipes is supposed to reflect one recipe leading to the next logical invention derived from the work done on the previous one.

 

[Roland]

This will turn your game into a single player sandbox game. You are removing alot, if not most of the "teamwork" aspect your game got its greatest strength from.

You are erasing this. You are erasing the "working together" and frankly I would not be surprised AT ALL that the old comments that you want 7 days to die to be just a "loot and shoot" and remove building from it entirely.

One thing I'm learning in a big way is that not all teams work together in the same way. The change is barely going to register as a disruption in how my group functions.

 

[Matt115]

One thing I'm learning in a big way is that not all teams work together in the same way. The change is barely going to register as a disruption in how my group functions.

I was thinking about MP and... maybe 8 players server idea was bad. I mean it is like TNT - concept was good but it create unespected....  situations. Maybe if 7DTD was designed to play in max 4 players there woudn't be so many problems - i mean not about technical stuff so much but more about community - a lot of people complaining that they want to play in more people ( 30-50 ) so if this game was designed for less players i think most people would play mostly with close friends only because "make a deal" who is doing what would be much better. 

 

[Telly G]

my concern is more with bandit range attack.
1. is its gun range gonna be as soon as they see us and able to snipe us at ranges greater than our own? such as they arent even rendered and we got sniped?

2. will they have infinite ammo? that gets unbalanced.

3. what will their accuracy be like? i mean are they always gonna hit?

4. wait, they were just shooting at us, I killed the little f* but he doesnt have a gun on him? wtf?  played a few games like fallout where this happened. broke immersion.

on weapons and armor in general.

bandits are human too, they will try for every advantage, does this mean bandits weapon, armor, and tools may have mods already in them?

If you ever played modded with hostile NPCs they're either cannon fodder even with a gun or they'll blow your head off three times on day one. Though I doubt you'll be encountering bandits armed with high grade guns on day one.  They'll drop bags like anything else, but the drops that bandits drop in bags could be modified to be more sensible, more weighted towards weapon mods and parts and things like that. 

 

[Telly G]

I'm not sure how to feel about the fifth total revamp of gear progression. What was wrong with the current system? 

(Gear Progression)

 

[meganoth]

The miner and builder do have to deal with screamer hordes. And wandering hordes. Slower progression in their weapons would make this harder for them. So if they wanna be prepared properly they need to go looting more. Wich is not the part of the game they enjoy the most.

How much gun crafting are you all doing in A20? Just imagine A20, but without a way to craft guns. Would they even notice?

Now lets say A21 is just A20 with more opportunities for crafting guns.

In A20 you would find a grey AK and then using it for 5 days and then find a blue AK,

And your miner would get a grey double barrel and get the blue double barrel after 5 days, same as you.

Now in A21 you would inbetween craft a yellow AK on the third day and use that for 2 days until you find the blue AK. Same progression but smoother, less abrupt changes. While your miner would still only get the grey and then the blue.

So assuming your miner guy got through A20 alive, why wouldn't he get through A21 alive?

------------------

Naturally I don't know if this is how it will be in A21. This is just one possible way it could play out, but I would think in this case it would not make your miner suddenly panic and go out looting.

Another possible way would be that they make weapons drop much more seldom in loot so crafting is the normal way to get guns, then you would be right that your miner might have a new problem. They did deny though that other parts of the game were changed, so I think this possibility is less likely.

The whole problem with this change is that you are forced to play in a certain way. And the freedom how to play is one of the key ingredients of this game. It´s the one thing that let´s people play together that have different interests when gaming. Take that away and a lot of people will be unhappy. Just wait how this will be received by people when it releases, you can be sure it will be a huge s-storm. Propably as huge as A17 death penalty.

I think you are forgetting that gun-crafting was an inconsequential feature up to now and you seem to assume that nobody will be able to live without it in A21.

 

[Laz Man]

I'm not sure how to feel about the fifth total revamp of gear progression. What was wrong with the current system? 

See Mega's response below.

 

[Blake_]

@faatal, I have a bunch of questions.

1.Are there any new vehicle mods planned, like bigger storage, mounted weapons, solar pannels with batteries for ditching fuel  or cool stuff like that?

2. Is there anything you can tell us about POI triggers like trap doors or things that might be relevant when bandits are in?

3.Any word on expanded New Game options like 5%-10% loot ranges, or 240/480 min days and the like? What I mean to ask is if we can expect some love there in the future.

4. Do you know if hostile npcs will protect air drops in the first iteration?

5. What are you working on at the moment?

6. May I ask you to consider a short video of the naked White Afro guy someday? I found the character quite deep and engaging in all his gameplay appearances. He needn't be revealing any feature. His presence is enough to shine upon us the light of the Jiggling Hair church.

Thanks in advance !

 

[Gamida]

I remember getting a purple stone axe, a purple pipe shotgun and a purple wooden club on day one with just a twist of the wrist. Not only that, the trader sold me a used cigar to boost my amazon store chances.  I did 6 POI that day and I had 1 point in Lucky Looter, but still, never again did I encounter such  odds in a game. I spent all the good karma in a playthrough. Lately, I find paper. Lots. 25% loot is an amazing experience. I wish there was a lesser loot chance option, like 5%. That's true survival struggling.

Have you ever thought of going into the xml file and adding the 5% loot option yourself? I pop in there and "tweak" a few of them myself Nothing like it lol

 

[Roland]

I wish there was a lesser loot chance option, like 5%. That's true survival struggling.

I believe the number is rounded down to the nearest whole number after the modifier is applied so at 5% every container would be empty. Just simulate the setting by never opening anything.  

 

[Latheos]

One change I'd really like to see come down the pike (especially with the revamping of the crafting tree altogether) is for the way materials are required. It makes very little sense to me for a low tier item to use *less* materials than a high-tier one. I would expect (based on IRL experiences) that as a crafter gets better at making things, they would require fewer resources to make items, not more. The system as it exists now seems quite backwards, and I'd really like to see this addressed at some point. For the record, modding it to work the opposite of the current system is not really an option. I've spent more than a little time trying to do just that.