PC Alpha 20 Dev Diary

[[email protected]]

lore of the game is that we are bout 30 to 50 years into the apocalypse

Okay let me ask a question. Where the @%$# has the " Survivor been for 50 years?

If it is 50 years later... Why isn't the hummer exposed to the elements become nothing but rust?

How can you have the skill to build a mini bike from scratch and not be able to fix a hummer engine?

 

[faatal]

If I had the option between the Jeep I have drove a dozen times or being able to drive a military hummer or Army tank.

I would pick the military options.

Of course you would and so did everyone else years ago. Those vehicles are now trashed and gone, leaving you with roadside junk and stuff you build yourself.

In any event, it is a game and it is designed for fun, not realism. I can pick apart this or any other game, but I'd rather ignore the nonsense of, in this case, zombies and just play the games or watch the movies they are in.

 

[[email protected]]

Well it doesn't matter I found a mod that does just what I wanted. 

It has a massive list of cars and truck.

 

[khzmusik]

I did read the Release notes. Other than the guns and drone.  Everything else is reskins or visual improvements. No new tools. No new traps. No new vehicles.   

IMHO that is utterly ridiculous. The new RWG system is awesome, they've added hundreds of new POIs, there is a hugely expanded shape system, they've added tools that make it much easier to mod the game, etc.

Even the "visual improvements" - like the improved grass, or the more immersive weather - swamp whatever fleeting enjoyment I could get out of driving a reskinned vehicle or wielding a new weapon model. Especially since new vehicles or weapons add very little to the actual gameplay - new weapons would shoot like the current weapons, vehicles would drive and hold inventory like the current vehicles. To me those have the same degree of importance as adding new zombie models: definitely nice to have but doesn't add all that much once the novelty wears off.

 

[Aldranon]

Mods are perfect for people wanting a new or different experience.

TFP knew right off that people are different and like different things.  So they made mod'ing a "relatively simple" endeavor.  Some Mod's are huge efforts however.

The vanilla game looks GREAT to me!  I will most likely play for a few hundred hours before I look to the mods (the good ones will be ready).

 

[stallionsden]

Okay let me ask a question. Where the @%$# has the " Survivor been for 50 years?

If it is 50 years later... Why isn't the hummer exposed to the elements become nothing but rust?

How can you have the skill to build a mini bike from scratch and not be able to fix a hummer engine?

Tied up by the misses. Why where have you been.

Where the zombies come from.. why do we have zombies for since your looking at realism. No such thing as zombies. 

A survivors wouldn't know how to use a m16 so how all of a sudden the survivor learn to use it at all.

The hummer is dead.

Haven't seen a hummer in vanilla at all tho so where is this hummer... 

Well it doesn't matter I found a mod that does just what I wanted. 

It has a massive list of cars and truck.

There have been mods for many alphas that have added these lol. 

 

[[email protected]]

A survivors wouldn't know how to use a m16 so how all of a sudden the survivor learn to use it at all.

Really? The survivor can't use an M-16 machine gun. But can immediately build Hogwarts. What the @%$#? 

 

[stallionsden]

Really? The survivor can't use an M-16 machine gun. But can immediately build Hogwarts. What the @%$#? 

Really so there are hummers in the game... show me.. not a mod either. 

 

[[email protected]]

so there are hummers in the game.

There are cars, Trucks, Jeeps, moter cycles and troop transports.

When Neebs Gaming built the tower of death there was a hummer in the thumb nail.

 

[stallionsden]

There are cars, Trucks, Jeeps, moter cycles and troop transports.

When Neebs Gaming built the tower of death there was a hummer in the thumb nail.

So you saw a mod a streamer had modded into his game hahahahahaha

 

[madmole]

I did read the Release notes. Other than the guns and drone.  Everything else is reskins or visual improvements. No new tools. No new traps. No new vehicles.   

Dude, it's so much better than A19. 1000's of new building shapes, vehicle mods, new primitive pipe guns, massive balancing changes, zombies spawn, biome difficulty and improved loot/game stage in harder biomes. Cities have more zombies. I could go on and on about how you can just get lost in random gen now. I could tell you how immersive it is, but that is something you will just experience for yourself. I could argue about all kinds of things, but at the end of the day the build just feels amazing in ways that release notes can't describe.



 

 

[[email protected]]

So you saw a mod a streamer had modded into his game hahahahahaha

The people who run Neebs gaming Swear to god. They don't use Mods.

 

[khzmusik]

There are cars, Trucks, Jeeps, moter cycles and troop transports.

And, why didn't you jump for joy when these were added to the game as non-drivable vehicles? Why didn't you create an account at that time just to praise TFP, rather than create an account now to swear at them for not adding them as drivable vehicles?

I can hazard a guess. It's because those vehicles are little more than new models that did the same thing as the sedans that have been in the game forever. You loot them, you wrench them for parts, they have possibly a different amount of storage in which to put your gubs while you're looting.

If they made them drivable vehicles, how would that be any different? You'd drive them like you drive the jeep or motorcycle, probably have a bit more storage, a bit higher fuel consumption, a bit lower top speed compared to the motorcycle.

But the basic gameplay wouldn't be affected very much, any more than it was affected when the vehicles were introduced as non-drivable. Different stats but nothing new for the game loop.

IMHO that's not even comparable to the other stuff that made it into the game. The new POIs themselves add more than that.

EDIT: I should be clear, I would also love to see drivable versions of these vehicles. It would be neat. But if that never makes it into the game, the proper response is "oh well" and a shrug.

Now if they introduced something into the game that would change the game loop, that's another story. For example, other games have vehicles that you find in the world, but they can be fixed up and driven. It would change the game loop because the early game would be the part where you are mobile and drive around the world, then when you run out of resources (like gas) you can't use them anymore, and that's the stage where you start base building. Something like that would literally be a game changer. But it's not why you came here and swore about everything.

 

[[email protected]]

Why didn't you create an account at that time just to praise TFP,

When I was playing the game and saw a troop transport truck.

The first thing that came to mind was can I drive that?

When I could not I asked myself. " Why is this here? "

The troop transport truck didn't have camo clothes, helmets , guns or anything military in it.

I got a pick axe from the cab. Why does a troop transport  truck at a missile base have a pick axe in it?

 

[khzmusik]

When I could not I asked myself. " Why is this here? "

Please re-read my reply and ask yourself the same question about drivable vehicles. Why would they be there? What would that add to the game loop? Etc.

EDIT: That logic could just as easily be used as an argument for removing them from the game altogether. "If I can't drive them they shouldn't be in the game." Personally I would prefer that they stay, even if I could never drive them.

 

[POCKET951]

That would be a change since in A19 the increase in harvest return was +1 at rank 1 and +2 at rank 3 meaning it'd be capped at 4 per plant if there was no change.

A19 Living off the Land Rank 1

A19 Living off the Land Rank 3

I saw Alpha 20 living off the land on a stream. Rank 3 is Tripple the harvest, and if base harvest is +2, you should get 6 per seed

and its 50% to get a seed, my concern is if you get super bad RNG and you get a third back in new seeds.

is it 50% random, or is it pseudo RNG so that you will ALWAYS get a seed every other harvest

theoretically every other crop yields a seed, but RNG can be really fickle and brutal sometimes, even at 50%

like taking a look at 10 coin flips, ideally you would get 5/5, but I think something like 7/3 or 6/4 are both very possible. if you harvested 10 crops and only got 3 or 4 seeds back that would feel @%$#ty. but then maybe you would get 6 or 7

Idk, I don't like that negative/frustrating or annoying outcomes exist because you can get really unlucky sometimes and it just sucks

 

[Laz Man]

I saw Alpha 20 living off the land on a stream. Rank 3 is Tripple the harvest, and if base harvest is +2, you should get 6 per seed

and its 50% to get a seed, my concern is if you get super bad RNG and you get a third back in new seeds.

is it 50% random, or is it pseudo RNG so that you will ALWAYS get a seed every other harvest

theoretically every other crop yields a seed, but RNG can be really fickle and brutal sometimes, even at 50%

like taking a look at 10 coin flips, ideally you would get 5/5, but I think something like 7/3 or 6/4 are both very possible. if you harvested 10 crops and only got 3 or 4 seeds back that would feel @%$#ty. but then maybe you would get 6 or 7

Idk, I don't like that negative/frustrating or annoying outcomes exist because you can get really unlucky sometimes and it just sucks

Testers have tried the change and it is still possible to be sustainable when perked up.  Of course balancing is ongoing.  We will see where things land.

 

[khzmusik]

I saw Alpha 20 living off the land on a stream. Rank 3 is Tripple the harvest, and if base harvest is +2, you should get 6 per seed

and its 50% to get a seed, my concern is if you get super bad RNG and you get a third back in new seeds.

is it 50% random, or is it pseudo RNG so that you will ALWAYS get a seed every other harvest

theoretically every other crop yields a seed, but RNG can be really fickle and brutal sometimes, even at 50%

like taking a look at 10 coin flips, ideally you would get 5/5, but I think something like 7/3 or 6/4 are both very possible. if you harvested 10 crops and only got 3 or 4 seeds back that would feel @%$#ty. but then maybe you would get 6 or 7

Idk, I don't like that negative/frustrating or annoying outcomes exist because you can get really unlucky sometimes and it just sucks

I guarantee that this is going to be the biggest controversy about the A20 changes. I watched one streamer this weekend who went off on a five-minute rant about it.

Personally I like this change, because farming was OP. Once you set up a farm you had zero chance of ever needing food again. This system at least makes you work for it.

But even with these changes, getting the max perk means you get at least 6 "fruits" per harvest, which is enough to make one seed and have one fruit left over. So even if the RNG gods give you no seeds, you still have enough for a sustainable garden plus  one fruit. But statistically you'll get 1.5 seeds per harvest, which still allows you to grow your farm, gathering more and more fruits in the long run.

At the worst it will force you to supplement your food using the many, many canned goods you inevitably find in the world that you hardly ever use in late game. So I personally don't think it's anything to complain about.

EDIT: I do have one suggestion though - higher perk levels should give you a higher percentage of getting a seed back. So, with no perks there's a 50% chance of getting a seed back, while at the highest perk there's (say) a 75% chance. I think this would be reasonable and would also calm the critics who would complain that the perk isn't worth it.

 

[Blake_]

I find a20 significantly polished for an experimental. Issues that I could see making a bit of damage:

-Pipe bombs cost exactly the same as normal grenades. Unknown about the other explosives. Easy to fix.

-Generator quest shows 0/-1 on clients upon admin completion (p2p). 

- Buried supplies quests can be located at the exact same spot as a previous one (both multi and singleplayer, though significantly more common the more players are in a server picking buried supplies quests). Also happened in a19. Solution: buried supplies has to have a check across players that avoids repeating the same location as much as possible (until the world runs out of landscape )

 

[Aldranon]

My few hours of viewing some streamers have highlighted how fun the cities now are!

In the city, the first 24 hours you can find dogs and police.  Its deadly and you cant just run anywhere without some risk.

Outside the city is safer but its all risk/reward so cities are the thing IMO.  Will max out cities on my second play though.

Perfect game IMO.