canadianbluebeer
New member
by day 80 I'm making them in 10k or more batches across 6 chem stations and 6 workbenches.
Of course, I do tend to overdo things.
PC Alpha 19 Dev Diary
- Thread starter madmole
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Of course, I do tend to overdo things.
Oh, you poor poor man. So you specced into shotguns crafting perk and now it is completely useless (EXCEPT FOR THAT TOTALLY USELESS 100% DAMAGE INCREASE!!!!!!!!!!).
Onarr
New member
I have to disagree. This of course is personal opinion, but I find agility severely lacking. PoIs are not well designed for stealth - closet zombies, neccessary jumps, trigger events etc. Agility weapons also appear harder to find. And finally it has no utility perks that would improve resource gain.
Benefit I see is that it is most effective build for clearing high tier PoI. There it shines. I guess for higher difficulities as well. But honestly I have never went agility build from the get go. Which is shame, because pistols are my favorite weapon.
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Kalen
New member
STyK_
New member
Exactly how l feel about agility and having to invest in strength and fortitude to be self sufficient. Intel and perception feel this too I'm sure. I mean I can see one but both. Only way to balance that would be to give it it's own tree make making them cheaper then investing 3 into strength and 3 into fortitude, actually 5 after the perks you want, but I'm sure you guys don't want to do that.When Madmole played his strength build for the first time he didn’t like having to invest in a different attribute to raise cooking....
Edit: Make a pacifist class, Soccer mom, and put the master chef and living off the land there. At least then its under one tree making it cheaper. You'd need more to fill it out to suit that class but it would balance things out.
Vending machine in the working stiffs didn't work again, 4th time in a row. Bug? On purpose?
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Phoenixshade35
New member
Im waiting to see what happens with the ai, like right now its working great, don't get me wrong, but having them attack the weakest point to get to you almost feels like an exploit, my last horde they simply bunched up and were easy to kill cause of the weak point, i hope someday the zombies get coded to simply attack player made blocks in general for some real damage, i rarely have to repair anything on my horde bases
You find seeds and seed recipes in loot. If you don't because of specific settings that never were mentioned here (
) then relying on perks is obviously the better strategy. Balance is right, you just need a setting to get only 25% out of perk bonuses to be balanced again.
Blake_
Captain Obvious
We've talked about this. I'm sure data shows strenght is ALWAYS chosen to some degree, while other attributes might not. Not a perfect system, but at least It's cheap. Like a socc... alright imma head out.
STyK_
New member
0 seeds end of day 7 two hour days but now your going to say its my settings and shame on me for picking them. What ever it takes to defend whats already implemented.You find seeds and seed recipes in loot. If you don't because of specific settings that never were mentioned here (
I am making it work but it would be a hell of a lot easier being fortitude or strength your making those classes easy mod.
it was an idea, didn't say it was the best one but neither is what is currently in place
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STyK_
New member
its the pathing. It would be more realistic to have them spread out hitting your base from all sides which you can make happen initially by sealing your base and having a uniform defense but as soon as that breaks they bunch up. Its AI difficulty scroll bar solution I've been pushing, destruction over pathing to the weakest point.
They are going to say its a tower defense game at the end of the day. To many people like just setting up an easy defense and having them all walk right in from one way. You maximize kills and xp, don't waste any zed lives setup correctly. Self-control and self-imposed handicaps are going to be the easy solution. I do my best to be ready to fight from all sides cause thats how I would have liked the game to be. All goes back to challenging yourself
.
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Laz Man
Fun Pimps Staff
Thats pretty cool. Sounds like a neat design and also efficient dev time if you guys can pull it off. I personally don't mind waiting on bandits if the end result are player characters and bandits having some type of cohesion instead of being completely separate things...
...which may also allow for more emergent MP gameplay as players and npcs could potentially look very similar and have unexpected encounters...
Edit: hopefully better then the UMA stuff that didn't work out...
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Jost Amman
Well-known member
Exactly!No, it's because you require immense strength to lift the frying pan, to stack the plates, and to carry the pot of boiling water from one side of the kitchen to the other.
Spoiler
Phoenixshade35
New member
oh i know, like my last horde i forgot to upgrade one block, so it was the weakest point, we all forget, i had my back to the one side where i could easily be hit and they still went for that point, i know pathing and its perfect for when u are in a poi, turn around and smack your infected, but horde night should be more random, they are frenzied, yes to your location but still frenziedits the pathing. It would be more realistic to have them spread out hitting your base from all sides which you can make happen initially by sealing your base and having a uniform defense but as soon as that breaks they bunch up. Its AI difficulty scroll bar solution I've been pushing, destruction over pathing to the weakest point.
They are going to say its a tower defense game at the end of the day. To many people like just setting up an easy defense and having them all walk right in from one way. You maximize kills and xp, don't waste any zed lives setup correctly. Self-control and self-imposed handicaps are going to be the easy solution. I do my best to be ready to fight from all sides cause thats how I would have liked the game to be. All goes back to challenging yourself
Jost Amman
Well-known member
The AI searching for the weakest point is part of the Tower Defense mechanic.
The point is you're supposed to exploit (to some degree) the AI pathing to build a base that funnels most of the zombies in one place and/or path.
The point is you're supposed to exploit (to some degree) the AI pathing to build a base that funnels most of the zombies in one place and/or path.
Phoenixshade35
New member
i know thats why i did say its working great, but imagine a total random ai, where you would see them hitting pois because it was in their way instead of walking around it, would make the world interesting, hell imagine coming across a hole that was dug because they "thought" something was down there, dumb zombies can be fun too lol
No, I just made some light fun of the fact that you mentioned your loot setting a bit too often. Actually I plan to use lower loot settings myself eventually. But first I want to wait until I'm sure the bugs with actual loot being less than the percentage suggests are not coming back.
But my OTHER point that your strategy has to be to buy perks instead of waiting for the loot when you decrease loot was me being absolutely serious. Lets assume the game is balanced at vanilla settings and going for the perk instead of waiting for the seeds to drop is just a decision between equal options. Then decreasing one of those options to be 4 times worse can't possibly be balanced anymore, quite obviously now buying the perk must be the tremenduously better option.
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pregnable
New member
Yeah, strength is really good, and probably does not really need heavy armor, cooking or either the sledge or club, heh.
Agility is kinda cool, not sure about balance currently, but being able to sneak really well without a base is a nice alternative. Random dog packs should probably not be able to zero in on you when you are sneaking though... not sure if they do. Parkour is amazing.
Intelligence is really strong, but does not have a starter weapon so its usually a second pick, and charismatic nature could use a change. I still like putting the last tier of barter as the last rank of charismatic nature.
Perception is kinda meh, but depending on the balance of the wrench skill it could almost be on par with strength. If you can harvest enough metal with it while questing, to build a base, you could follow the iron frame path of building. I tried it once and it was okay, but having to get clay was a little lame. Depending on the balance of metal pipes and stuff you get though, it could be really good, and wrenches are not bad weapons if you invest in it.
I am not even sure about fortitude. Definitely a lot of good stuff, but I usually do not grab much from it. I used to always rush farming, but now I go intelligence for building second. It is probably a perfect second choice for a baseless agility build, where you just run on foot all night fighting the horde. I was going to try a build like that, but too busy playing my str/intel build atm.
Agility is kinda cool, not sure about balance currently, but being able to sneak really well without a base is a nice alternative. Random dog packs should probably not be able to zero in on you when you are sneaking though... not sure if they do. Parkour is amazing.
Intelligence is really strong, but does not have a starter weapon so its usually a second pick, and charismatic nature could use a change. I still like putting the last tier of barter as the last rank of charismatic nature.
Perception is kinda meh, but depending on the balance of the wrench skill it could almost be on par with strength. If you can harvest enough metal with it while questing, to build a base, you could follow the iron frame path of building. I tried it once and it was okay, but having to get clay was a little lame. Depending on the balance of metal pipes and stuff you get though, it could be really good, and wrenches are not bad weapons if you invest in it.
I am not even sure about fortitude. Definitely a lot of good stuff, but I usually do not grab much from it. I used to always rush farming, but now I go intelligence for building second. It is probably a perfect second choice for a baseless agility build, where you just run on foot all night fighting the horde. I was going to try a build like that, but too busy playing my str/intel build atm.
STyK_
New member
Tables are better, mega crush actually exists and not just one to put up on the wall as a trophy. Actually found 2 at once in my tips vid at the stripclub, and a tier 1 toilet pistol, if only I had some 9mm on me.
I do every time, I was just pointing out its costs 10-12 points for any other class out side those two classes. With a pacifist class, not fighting for this just A solution, then everyone but that class has to put points in another tree to solve they're food problem. Then the pacifist class has to put points into another class for weapons cause it wouldn't have any. To me that's balanced. 'Charismatic nature' would make a good perk for that tree too, hell it could have 'from the shadows' too, I don't use it till endgame, its not really essential to the agility tree even on my settings.
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Jost Amman
Well-known member
For wandering hordes that would be fun I guess, but for the Blood Moon hordes it would be a disaster IMO.
Imagine having to plan a base that can virtually be attacked from every side! It'd be a builder's nightmare lol
It would be quite easy actually. Too easy. At the current damage potential of the zombies they could never breach a double concrete wall if every zombie attacked a different spot. So at a minimum their block damage has to be increased. Much damage all around the walls means that every horde night then needs 2 days of mining and boring repairs afterwards.
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