PC Alpha 19 Dev Diary

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Dimpy said:
Which MM opinion are you refering to?
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Yes, between killing your accomplishments and inventory tetris of swapping mods I can't see it as anything but adding more grind to slow people down. There is nothing wrong with reaching end game. The hordes grow in numbers/difficulty and players have enough stuff to worry about late game, time is precious- Madmole/mole of Mad
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Demandred1957 said:
Think the majority of people need to learn self control then..
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I read this statement over and over again here but sorry guys, that is an utter bs "argument".

It is the developers' decision whether one can avoid horde night on a vehicle or not. It is the developers' decision whether one can sit on top of pop&pills hospital for consecutive horde nights without any repairing in between and being save or not. If they decide that their game is not meant to be played like that they have to find a method to make these things not work anymore.

The game is called "7D2D" with reference to horde coming every seventh day. If a player decides not to switch horde nights completely off there should not be any way of avoiding horde completely without any preparation. And it is the game designers' task to ensure that. Not the players' who should impose imaginary rules on themselves.

Surely, there should be a lot of things left to a player's own devices since it is an open-world game after all. Some strategies turn out to be more easy or effective than others and players can choose between them. But not a single choice should be as game changing as avoiding horde unpunished or game changing in another way. Another example: If you are able to nerd pole without any effort to a POI's main loot that is game changing as well and should not be possible from a game design's perspective. 

 
Demandred1957 said:
Think the majority of people need to learn self control then..

If something is a "exploit" and they know it, then they can just not do that....

Kinda like whoever it was posting that they dbl dip on the poi quest resets all the time, but find it boring and a cheat and want it removed....

I couldn't believe someone would post something that dumb..

If you think it's a exploit to run away (also called a tactical retreat) then don't do it...

If you think it's a exploit to hide from the horde then don't do it..

All you are doing is limiting how players can play the game.

Personally, I think if you are not playing Permadeath/Dead is Dead, then you got no right to ask for the game to be harder to play/or make it impossible to avoid the horde.
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TFP's aim is to close any super cheesy loop holes on survival. Stun locked bears, driving safely from hordes with zero effort are good examples where we need to resolve it. You can't expect a player to use self restraint.

 
PoloPoPo said:
The game is called "7D2D" with reference to horde coming every seventh day. If a player decides not to switch horde nights completely off there should not be any way of avoiding horde completely without any preparation. And it is the game designers' task to ensure that. Not the players' who should impose imaginary rules on themselves.
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The grind to get the vehicles is itself the "preparation" for the horde..

Also parking it nearby full of gas, and fully repaired.

All of those things take time, and should not be trivialized.

 
Demandred1957 said:
Think the majority of people need to learn self control then..

If something is a "exploit" and they know it, then they can just not do that....

Kinda like whoever it was posting that they dbl dip on the poi quest resets all the time, but find it boring and a cheat and want it removed....

I couldn't believe someone would post something that dumb..

If you think it's a exploit to run away (also called a tactical retreat) then don't do it...

If you think it's a exploit to hide from the horde then don't do it..

All you are doing is limiting how players can play the game.

Personally, I think if you are not playing Permadeath/Dead is Dead, then you got no right to ask for the game to be harder to play/or make it impossible to avoid the horde.
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That doesn't work for multiplayer. Self-control can't be the answer for everything and everyone. If a world doesn't have set rules and a way to enforce them there will be people who will exploit for no another reason then their own self-interest or harm someone else's, some people just want to see the world burn.

 
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PoloPoPo said:
I read this statement over and over again here but sorry guys, that is an utter bs "argument".

It is the developers' decision whether one can avoid horde night on a vehicle or not. It is the developers' decision whether one can sit on top of pop&pills hospital for consecutive horde nights without any repairing in between and being save or not. If they decide that their game is not meant to be played like that they have to find a method to make these things not work anymore.

The game is called "7D2D" with reference to horde coming every seventh day. If a player decides not to switch horde nights completely off there should not be any way of avoiding horde completely without any preparation. And it is the game designers' task to ensure that. Not the players' who should impose imaginary rules on themselves.

Surely, there should be a lot of things left to a player's own devices since it is an open-world game after all. Some strategies turn out to be more easy or effective than others and players can choose between them. But not a single choice should be as game changing as avoiding horde unpunished or game changing in another way. Another example: If you are able to nerd pole without any effort to a POI's main loot that is game changing as well and should not be possible from a game design's perspective. 
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This is pretty much how I feel about it.

It is our job to decide what is too easy and what seems like a reasonable tactic to survive. Everything has a time/material/item cost to it.

It is fine to further self impose/role play restrictions beyond vanilla, or mod it, or mess with settings but the stock vanilla game should be an increasing challenge to survive each 7 days. Of course we give tools and loot and perks to keep up with or exceed that challenge and a variety of ways to do it. What methods you use are up to your play style and there will always be debates about which are most effective, what feel cheesy, etc.

 
madmole said:
This is pretty much how I feel about it.

It is our job to decide what is too easy and what seems like a reasonable tactic to survive. Everything has a time/material/item cost to it.

It is fine to further self impose/role play restrictions beyond vanilla, or mod it, or mess with settings but the stock vanilla game should be an increasing challenge to survive each 7 days. Of course we give tools and loot and perks to keep up with or exceed that challenge and a variety of ways to do it. What methods you use are up to your play style and there will always be debates about which are most effective, what feel cheesy, etc.
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Speaking of "cheesy", will the spider zombie's hitbox or attack pattern be adjusted or whatever so that they don't attack a block and have most of their body stuck inside it? :)  Perhaps they could simply stand back on all fours and swing at it with one of their arms. Trust me, having to deal with a spider zombie with its head and most of its torso embedded in a solid block is a little annoying, I'm not going to lie.

 
@MM

i'm currently on day 79 and i've noticed that i got a 5 bear horde after me hmmmm.. i haven't ever gotten that is that new or something? because it was a nice but unpleasant encounter  😅

 
MechanicalLens said:
Speaking of "cheesy", will the spider zombie's hitbox or attack pattern be adjusted or whatever so that they don't attack a block and have most of their body stuck inside it? :)  Perhaps they could simply stand back on all fours and swing at it with one of their arms. Trust me, having to deal with a spider zombie with its head and most of its torso embedded in a solid block is a little annoying, I'm not going to lie.
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didn't spider zombies used to walk like other normal zombies? but yes when they get stuck inside walls it can kinda be hard to get headshots at certain times

 
madmole said:
TFP's aim is to close any super cheesy loop holes on survival. Stun locked bears, driving safely from hordes with zero effort are good examples where we need to resolve it. You can't expect a player to use self restraint.
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Stun locked bears I can see.

That was kinda a glitch though, not really a exploit. But will have to say, think you over comped on that a bit. They also shouldn't be able to keep coming while getting shot in the face 15-20 times without slowing down like they do now.. Moderation..

But honestly, using the vehicle you earned by grinding for it doesn't seem over the top to me.

It's whole purpose is to move you at speed to a destination.

In this case, away from the immediate danger.

Again, if someone thinks thats cheesy, then don't do it.

Ain't nobody forcing you to play like that.

But I am being forced to play like how THEY want because of that change.

And it isn't hurting you one bit if players don't have restraint.

They already bought the game.

If you have more than 60 hrs into it, you as the player got your moneys worth and then some.

 
MechanicalLens said:
Speaking of "cheesy", will the spider zombie's hitbox or attack pattern be adjusted or whatever so that they don't attack a block and have most of their body stuck inside it? :)  Perhaps they could simply stand back on all fours and swing at it with one of their arms. Trust me, having to deal with a spider zombie with its head and most of its torso embedded in a solid block is a little annoying, I'm not going to lie.
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I'm sure we will fine tune that.

 
Adam the Waster said:
also!

sense i am replaying again! my game looks better! even though it on low settings! i can see details instead of Play doe! 

thxs TFP :)
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Have you tried geforce now?  Might be a good alternative for those with low performance systems.  My cousin previously couldn't enjoy 7d2d with us until he used it since a new PC was out of the question in the short term.

 
Demandred1957 said:
Stun locked bears I can see.

That was kinda a glitch though, not really a exploit. But will have to say, think you over comped on that a bit. They also shouldn't be able to keep coming while getting shot in the face 15-20 times without slowing down like they do now.. Moderation..

But honestly, using the vehicle you earned by grinding for it doesn't seem over the top to me.

It's whole purpose is to move you at speed to a destination.

In this case, away from the immediate danger.

Again, if someone thinks thats cheesy, then don't do it.

Ain't nobody forcing you to play like that.

But I am being forced to play like how THEY want because of that change.

And it isn't hurting you one bit if players don't have restraint.

They already bought the game.

If you have more than 60 hrs into it, you as the player got your moneys worth and then some.
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Why bother building a fort if a bicycle was all you needed to survive the apocalypse? We want players to build a fort. The vulture swarm might be temporary, once vehicle crits are in perhaps hitting a few zombies and your vehicle breaks down, then you are out in the middle of nowhere with nowhere to run, etc. That is the same thing but on top of dying you have to walk to your vehicle after the horde and repair it. Which one seems better? I kind of like the latter because with some skill you might evade them, but it wouldn't be nearly impossible like it is now. At the end of the day it is just a few pre A19 players complaining about it. Had you just picked up the game you'd just accept the fact that vehicles are not a good idea on horde night.

 
MechanicalLens said:
Speaking of "cheesy", will the spider zombie's hitbox or attack pattern be adjusted or whatever so that they don't attack a block and have most of their body stuck inside it? :)  Perhaps they could simply stand back on all fours and swing at it with one of their arms. Trust me, having to deal with a spider zombie with its head and most of its torso embedded in a solid block is a little annoying, I'm not going to lie.
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Normal zombie against concrete: Claw, claw, claw ...

Spider zombie against concrete: Claw, claw, bite, claw ....

 
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Laz Man said:
Have you tried geforce now?  Might be a good alternative for those with low performance systems.  My cousin previously couldn't enjoy 7d2d with us until he used it since a new PC was out of the question in the short term.
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nope! i have not updated anything! i just took a break from the game, came back and everything looked better and runs just as smoothed!

im not complaining :)

 
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