PC Alpha 19 Dev Diary

[Laz Man]

Just roleplay the parts of the castle that cannot blend together. I tell myself it's the part of the castle that has decayed. All castle do haha.

I agree.  There are definitely ways to work around it or through it...

Sometimes half the fun/challenge is finding a way to make it work.  Makes it feel more rewarding.

Edit: I think I have an idea now lol...

 

[madmole]

I still do not really like how many parts it requires to make a tool or weapon when they are usually already gated by a recipe you have to find and steel. 

Like on my one world I am like over level 30 and have 8 intel and 4 in robotics and I can not even make a junk sledge yet, lel.  I could do 5 parts, but not 15 or whatever it costs yet, heh.  RNG ftw.  I have 3 traders now so I guess it should not be much longer. 

Not really a big deal though.  The build is really good, I just make sure I start off specializing in something that does not require RNG.

Everything requires RNG though. You should be swimming in parts if you put the work in. Are you level 30 because you are mining and building? Or level 30 because you are shooting and looting? Obviously the looter shooter will have way more parts than the miner/builder.

 

[RhinoW]

@madmole Any plans for fixing the jittery ADS of weapons? For example the ak goes forward and back with a red dot sight installed.

 

[Toban]

I agree.  There are definitely ways to work around it or through it...

Sometimes half the fun/challenge is finding a way to make it work.  Makes it feel more rewarding.

Edit: I think I have an idea now lol...

Indeed. Finding a way around it is part of the fun.

 

[Gromit]

Yeah the solution is mod it, we provide what is needed to survive, and then some but we have no desire to kitchen sink the whole system for the 2% vanity fort guys.

Is that 2% from the data you've acquired so far? I would have expected the number of builders to be much higher than that.

 

[FileMachete]

Question.

A while back there were some comments about building/adjusting things for a 30-50 hour game. And recently meganoth mentioned similar hours.

Wondering if those hours had general targets as to player progression? Level x, generally wielding Tier x Qual x for their main weapon, etc.

Reason I'm asking is I've passed 35 hours (90min days), as a miner/builder, lvl 31, no Combat Perks, sporting a qual 1 Ak(bought) & Pistol(toilet). I know my progression was slowed by my own choices, curious what 'normal' progrssion might be.

 

[Nugetti]

Is that 2% from the data you've acquired so far? I would have expected the number of builders to be much higher than that.

I'd be really curious to see some of the data they've managed to gather so far. Not to pick on TFP but just out of general interest.

 

[Laynie]

I'd be really curious to see some of the data they've managed to gather so far. Not to pick on TFP but just out of general interest.

When we play on the family server, only my hubby likes to build. We are 4 players normally. I know that doesn't answer your question, but for us, its 1 in 4. Me my kid and brother in law like different things too. Me and my kid (not a child) like killing zeds, my brother in law farms like it's his job and my hubby build huge buildings. When we played with 8 ppl on the server, my hubby was still the only builder.

 

[EggsAisle]

Robotic parts are plenty common, you either haven't played long enough or you have got bad RNG. We already have something similar, the perk that gives you additional choices for rewards. I don't like rewards being specialized because there are no decent high end medical items so Jen would become the useless trader to do quests for, and everyone would flock to Hugh for his guns.

The plan is to game stage the rewards to stay ahead of loot by a few levels so the rewards are better than what you could find, but not game ending, until game end.

Hey, thanks for hearing me out! I don't know too many game designers willing to chat with forum-goers, so I appreciate it.

My robotics shortage could be rough RNG, I just noticed it because I have 15-20 for just about every other weapon, and like 50+ military armor parts. 

I see what you mean about Jen. Maybe unshackle the rewards from the trader's specialty, so Jen could give gun quests? But if that's not the direction you have in mind, I understand that too. Thanks!

 

[Gromit]

I'd be really curious to see some of the data they've managed to gather so far. Not to pick on TFP but just out of general interest.

Yeah, I'd be interested as well.

Modding doesn't look very complicated for the features I want so I'll likely just mod in the building features I want.

 

[hiemfire]

I'd be really curious to see some of the data they've managed to gather so far. Not to pick on TFP but just out of general interest.

I'm interested in the data but leery of how some will cherry pick and try to twist it to "make their point". I think it'd be best if TPF chose to keep the info close to chest.

 

[Onarr]

There is no need for a sticky, if people like it, and talk about it, it will stick itself.

Sorry but how am I supposed to react to such argument? No topic stays constantly on top, no matter how popular it is. Then new topic emerges, but it is already without prior builds. Purpose of sticky is to have all of it at one place. There is already sticky topic for seeds, why not builds? 

 

[Tmodloader]

The plan is to game stage the rewards to stay ahead of loot by a few levels so the rewards are better than what you could find, but not game ending, until game end.

Will you be setting up each tier of quests to have a minimal tier of rewards? This would make there be an incentive to challenge yourself with higher tier quests early instead of just grinding out low tier quests as long as you can.

 

[madmole]

Is that 2% from the data you've acquired so far? I would have expected the number of builders to be much higher than that.

We're not considering any data from experimental, since it is mostly hardcore players.

Question.

A while back there were some comments about building/adjusting things for a 30-50 hour game. And recently meganoth mentioned similar hours.

Wondering if those hours had general targets as to player progression? Level x, generally wielding Tier x Qual x for their main weapon, etc.

Reason I'm asking is I've passed 35 hours (90min days), as a miner/builder, lvl 31, no Combat Perks, sporting a qual 1 Ak(bought) & Pistol(toilet). I know my progression was slowed by my own choices, curious what 'normal' progrssion might be.

I don't think there can be a normal. Actually you gain tons of experience mining/upgrading, so I don't really see that as slowing things down much.

 

[pregnable]

Everything requires RNG though. You should be swimming in parts if you put the work in. Are you level 30 because you are mining and building? Or level 30 because you are shooting and looting? Obviously the looter shooter will have way more parts than the miner/builder.

Well I meant to mention that.  I think I am on day 12 or 13... the way I play I usually power level, so maybe the balance is right. 

Nah, you can kinda bypass RNG with certain builds. 

That build I start strength and get miner and motherload asap, and I use the stone axe as melee.  I find the trader and do quests if they are not stupid far away and then have a cobblestone base good enough for the 7 day horde before the start of day 2. 

Then I make a blunderbuss and iron fire axe(for a melee weapon, when I can) and start questing during the day and building and digging at night. 

I also will take points in intel for cement mixer and forge and start spamming concrete asap. 

 

[Daruma]

Alright. I had to say something at this point. 

I game on PC and console. I own and enjoy the game on console. I will not be purchasing it on PC until TFP becomes a little more responsive to the community that supports their work.

To create a game that is obviously centered around building and then lambast people who enjoy that aspect of the game is a little childish. I find the "2% vanity builder" stat to be highly suspect. I mean, c'mon - the very first description of the game I read, written by TFP, described it as a "voxel based zombie survival game." It really sounds like your feelings are a bit hurt over the fact your user base isn't playing the game exactly as you would like them to. Are you developing a game for others to enjoy, or for yourself to enjoy vicariously by dictating play styles that you don't (for some strange reason) agree with?

I think you're alienating a good portion of your fans at this point. Its a little ironic criticizing that style of play with a handle like 'madmole'. And to push the responsibility off on modders to "fix" what is obviously shortcomings in the core game itself is a little ridiculous. 

As I said - I love the game. I'd love to see it get to a place on PC where I could purchase and enjoy it for what I wanted it to be and what it was initially described as. Its just not there unfortunately. As I heard posted on a separate forum...if I wanted a standard FPS zombie game where the focus was on zombie hunting and looting, I have many other, more polished options. 

 

[madmole]

Hey, thanks for hearing me out! I don't know too many game designers willing to chat with forum-goers, so I appreciate it.

My robotics shortage could be rough RNG, I just noticed it because I have 15-20 for just about every other weapon, and like 50+ military armor parts. 

I see what you mean about Jen. Maybe unshackle the rewards from the trader's specialty, so Jen could give gun quests? But if that's not the direction you have in mind, I understand that too. Thanks!

They send you to whatever POIs are near. THe reward groups are identical per trader.

Sorry but how am I supposed to react to such argument? No topic stays constantly on top, no matter how popular it is. Then new topic emerges, but it is already without prior builds. Purpose of sticky is to have all of it at one place. There is already sticky topic for seeds, why not builds? 

We don't have time to decide what is stick worthy or not. If it is important to you book mark it. Same thing as a sticky without us having to manage it.

Will you be setting up each tier of quests to have a minimal tier of rewards? This would make there be an incentive to challenge yourself with higher tier quests early instead of just grinding out low tier quests as long as you can.

You will have to graduate to the next tier like now, but when you do, you might have access to lower tiers yet instead of it being mainly current tier with some random low ones.

 

[SittingDuck]

The new arm looks awesome at the start... too bad you don´t see it again. Perhaps a wrist watch would be good to show that hairy arms off ^^

 

[madmole]

Alright. I had to say something at this point. 

I game on PC and console. I own and enjoy the game on console. I will not be purchasing it on PC until TFP becomes a little more responsive to the community that supports their work.

To create a game that is obviously centered around building and then lambast people who enjoy that aspect of the game is a little childish. I find the "2% vanity builder" stat to be highly suspect. I mean, c'mon - the very first description of the game I read, written by TFP, described it as a "voxel based zombie survival game." It really sounds like your feelings are a bit hurt over the fact your user base isn't playing the game exactly as you would like them to. Are you developing a game for others to enjoy, or for yourself to enjoy vicariously by dictating play styles that you don't (for some strange reason) agree with?

I think you're alienating a good portion of your fans at this point. Its a little ironic criticizing that style of play with a handle like 'madmole'. And to push the responsibility off on modders to "fix" what is obviously shortcomings in the core game itself is a little ridiculous. 

As I said - I love the game. I'd love to see it get to a place on PC where I could purchase and enjoy it for what I wanted it to be and what it was initially described as. Its just not there unfortunately. As I heard posted on a separate forum...if I wanted a standard FPS zombie game where the focus was on zombie hunting and looting, I have many other, more polished options. 

Dude I build cooler forts than 99% of the public. For the record I've tried to convince the team to make it possible to get coffee pots and more decor available, but the fact is most players just take over a POI, and they definitely don't use high polygon decorations. So I put my personal feelings as a decorative builder aside for the bigger picture that average players don't build vanity forts. A 2 second mod or CM gets you that, we are in alpha and don't have time to handle all the edge cases of letting players "have it all", as I explained the FPS would tank and 20 other problems.

It is a voxel game. We let you place voxels, not 14000 polygon coffee pots. 

We're alienating who exactly? The game has a higher review score than it has in years and sales are better than ever. Seems like we are on track if you ask me. We focused on building and crafting for years, and finally give guns a little love and not even 10% of the effort that went into building and somehow you view that as abandoning the builders? We still have great things to come to building. I like to build so its not likely we'll leave building as is, we have some great ideas to improve it, it is just a matter of somehow squeezing it on the roadmap, then bandits and other stuff gets pushed back, further, again and again. Eventually we have to save some @%$*#! for the sequel, we can't stay in alpha forever and someone is going to feel like they got screwed.

 

[JCrook1028]

Alright. I had to say something at this point. 

I game on PC and console. I own and enjoy the game on console. I will not be purchasing it on PC until TFP becomes a little more responsive to the community that supports their work.

To create a game that is obviously centered around building and then lambast people who enjoy that aspect of the game is a little childish. I find the "2% vanity builder" stat to be highly suspect. I mean, c'mon - the very first description of the game I read, written by TFP, described it as a "voxel based zombie survival game." It really sounds like your feelings are a bit hurt over the fact your user base isn't playing the game exactly as you would like them to. Are you developing a game for others to enjoy, or for yourself to enjoy vicariously by dictating play styles that you don't (for some strange reason) agree with?

I think you're alienating a good portion of your fans at this point. Its a little ironic criticizing that style of play with a handle like 'madmole'. And to push the responsibility off on modders to "fix" what is obviously shortcomings in the core game itself is a little ridiculous. 

As I said - I love the game. I'd love to see it get to a place on PC where I could purchase and enjoy it for what I wanted it to be and what it was initially described as. Its just not there unfortunately. As I heard posted on a separate forum...if I wanted a standard FPS zombie game where the focus was on zombie hunting and looting, I have many other, more polished options. 

So you're judging the game to be "centered around building" and you've never even played it? Yes, I mean what I said. Playing it on console is not even remotely playing the same game anymore.