PC Alpha 19 Dev Diary

[Annihilatorza]

this is unbelievable!

guarinteed this stupid food drain is the dumbed down cop out version of what MM told us months ago how parts of the car would wear out and we’d have to repair it or if we hit something there could be a critical malfunction we would need to repair. 

but when it came time to actually do it they said nope. Let’s just have their food drain instead if using a vehicle—- way easier!!

come on!  Just do a proper food spoilage system instead of using all these weird and lame bandaids to fix the food survival problem in the game. 

candy in a vending machine is nothing to brag about. Having food spoil and crops die and using electricity for fridges to preserve food is something to brag about. 

if my car consumes food can I consume petrol!??!

On page one the first post of this topic Madmole posted that:

Vehicle Update - pushed to A20

• Vehicle Mods
  
• Vehicle break down and collision system
  

The new ISS system alone will change the way eating and drinking works.

I want the zombies to be able smell the food you are carrying again unless its in a tin can or another kind of seal container.

You should try driving for 18 hours straight, through the night on bad roads at 40 mph or less because any faster and you will die, while there are pot holes the size of your head, all the while you are carrying live cargo.

It makes you both physically and mentally exhausted.

I am waiting to see how this new system works and give it a fair chance before I leap to conclusions and fly off the handle.

There is so much that is been added I will wait and see how everything goes.

 

[quyxkh]

Anybody care to provide a brief explanation on the niche appeal towards Linux and, more importantly, while it's still around?

It's difficult to convey the feeling of actually owning your own computer to someone who's never experienced it.  

If you've got the attention span for it, read Stephenson's In the Beginning was the Command Line, starting at the "GUIs" section (before that is now-utterly-unnecessary background material for people who've never seen a computer).

 

[Marinxar]

Vehicles got some attention the last two days:

Added vehicle driving increases food consumption (added vehicles.xml foodDrain (normal,turbo), driving tag and _vehicleFood cvar).

Fixed SDTD-12623 Vehicles remember the player velocity when falling. (a19 bug)
Fixed vehicle physics not transferred when client or server took control (stuck gyrocopters).

Fixed vehicle engine would not stop if broken.

Added players exiting vehicles retain most velocity.
Added vehicles keep full velocity when driver exits and no wheel on ground.

Changed: Driving a vehicle adds 25% to your base food/water drain that you normally lose just standing around. Sprinting a vehicle adds 60% (minibike) to 40% (gyro) of the food/water drain that you would have while sprinting on foot. (Gazz)

Yes, driving vehicles in the dirty, rundown, apocalyptic world now consumes food.

I really like this . 

Honestly took me a few moments going back and forth, but thinking about it, it will add a lot to the late game, and won't have much impact in early game. It increase the necessity for cultivating food.  Yet, with good planning and thoughtfulness this will in no way be debilitating . 

 

[Onarr]

I challenge you to drive a car down a beat up gravel or dirt road and see how easy it is. My wife and I did last year in a rental car and it was tense. Rock noise, bumping up and down, trying to not hit the big dips that might damage the car. That constant alertness and stress was definitely using calories.

Decaying old roads are not like the streets you are driving on now.

Now the gryo would not fall into that category, but I'd think sitting on a metal frame, looking down at the world with wind blasting you in the face and trying not to crash into something, would be equally stressful.

This is stupid. what purpose does it serve? You will essentially punish player for using vehicles. You can frame it however you want, but that is how it will feel. Especially stupid is that it is blanket solution, so there is no gameplay to decrease this consumption. And even if there was, how are you going to communicate this concept to players? It only brings frustration, nothing else. 

 

[Ryfyle]

This is stupid. what purpose does it serve? You will essentially punish player for using vehicles. You can frame it however you want, but that is how it will feel. Especially stupid is that it is blanket solution, so there is no gameplay to decrease this consumption. And even if there was, how are you going to communicate this concept to players? It only brings frustration, nothing else. 

I think it was Iron Gut or Slow Metabolism that controls food bar decay. However your right, it does seem to be a way to punish people for using vehicles. Imagine If you can drive over a few pot holes IRL you have enough stamina to compete in the Iron Man Triathlon  in 7 DTD.

 

[Jost Amman]

This is stupid. what purpose does it serve? You will essentially punish player for using vehicles. You can frame it however you want, but that is how it will feel. Especially stupid is that it is blanket solution, so there is no gameplay to decrease this consumption. And even if there was, how are you going to communicate this concept to players? It only brings frustration, nothing else. 

Dude, before throwing around stupid this and stupid that you could still give your feedback when A19 comes out and you actually get to play with it.

You know... like REAL feedback, not biased banter on something you can only make a wild guess on. 

 

[Ryfyle]

Dude, before throwing around stupid this and stupid that you could still give your feedback when A19 comes out and you actually get to play with it.

You know... like REAL feedback, not biased banter on something you can only make a wild guess on. 

We have actual percentages. We can make models with these figures. We will have to bring 2 stacks of stew before we even think of looking at a Minibike. It's a pointless penalty for having a vehicle and excess food.

 

[Marinxar]

Dude, before throwing around stupid this and stupid that you could still give your feedback when A19 comes out and you actually get to play with it.

You know... like REAL feedback, not biased banter on something you can only make a wild guess on. 

Spot on .

With every major change you get people with knee-jerk reactions to it. Hell, I been there couple times myself in the past, but especially TFP have taught me to try something before jumping to conclusions.  

 

[beHypE]

We have actual percentages. We can make models with these figures. We will have to bring 2 stacks of stew before we even think of looking at a Minibike. It's a pointless penalty for having a vehicle and excess food.

Wait what lmao.

Please go ahead and make models and predictions because all I can see is you overexaggerating stuff to make a case for your point of view. Let's take the highest value of 60% of added food drain on the vehicle, with the worst vehicle : the bicycle.

The bicycle has a sprint sprint of 10 blocks and I believe (this may be wrong) the sprinting speed is 5 blocks. That means you'll spend 2 times less time on a bicycle to get anywhere compared to sprinting, while also "only" having 60% of the drain. 

Basically, if you really think you need 2 stacks of stew to go somewhere with the worst vehicle in the game, that means going there by foot would have taken you around 7 stews... that's a hell of a trip bud.

 

[Gazz]

I don't know what "percentages" they think they have but I do know that I went over the balancing sometime Fri/Sat.

And no. I'm not discussing this in detail because some have clearly made up their mind already.

 

[Kanaan Brood]

I am really looking forward to ALL of the changes. Everything I am hearing is just going to add to all of the stages of the game. Early, mid and late stages are going to be a lot more interesting. I'm looking forward to new strategies for all of it. Great work gang. Cheers

 

[Jost Amman]

We have actual percentages. We can make models with these figures. We will have to bring 2 stacks of stew before we even think of looking at a Minibike. It's a pointless penalty for having a vehicle and excess food.

Look, even if I don't agree with your knee jerking approach I'm not saying you may not have a point there... I'm just saying that theorizing about something and actually playing the game to get the feel of it are often two different things. Sometimes even when a plan sounds bad to you on paper it can still give great results when it plays out.

Also, as Gazz said, you don't have all the information you need to really understand the balancing behind it.

 

[FileMachete]

Just my .02 cents but were I in TFPs shoes I would consider the initial, 'knee jerk' reactions. Maybe just to consider different ways to 'message' it.

I doubt many will argue against saying that there are a lot of folks who do, 'judge a book by it's cover'. And once judged, are reluctant to re-examine.

So while this is an assumption, I do expect that TFPs will maintain a somewhat 'rational' food consumption hierarchy. Something like;

Least consumption to greatest:

1) standing still

2) walking

3) driving any gas powered vehicle

4) riding bike

5) auger mining

6-7-8) fireaxe/pickaxe use / melee fighting / running

(certainly open for some debate. just off the cuff assuming 5 minutes continuous activity)

The pothole (pardon the pun) to avoid is something like winding up with a player who pedals a bike 2 klicks using far less food than someone who drives.

And might be worth noting that this is just a new piece to a larger puzzle they're working on.

If TFPs manage to make 'food', as a broad category, actually 'fun' then they be wizards!

Yet certainly it won't come easily, so I'm expecting, & ok with, some redos/rebalancing/changes. (think wolves. anyone expecting them to remain so weak?)

 

[canadianbluebeer]

I'm going to just wait and see:

A) how the food consumption works out when actually playing,

B) above know that TFP can/will tweak it if need be,

C) knowing *I* can tweak it if need be.



until then, non-issue.  (and I'm outta popcorn darn it!)

 

[Gazz]

As so often people are freaking out over their own imagination.

And then they wonder why "the Fun Pimps never tell us anything!"

 

[SnowDog1942]

I don't know what "percentages" they think they have but I do know that I went over the balancing sometime Fri/Sat.

And no. I'm not discussing this in detail because some have clearly made up their mind already.

Sprinting a vehicle adds 60% (minibike) to 40% (gyro) of the food/water drain that you would have while sprinting on foot. (Gazz)

Yes, driving vehicles in the dirty, rundown, apocalyptic world now consumes food.

Gazz, i think these are the percentages people have in mind.

Tell me they are no longer right, please

 

[Adam the Waster]

As so often people are freaking out over their own imagination.

And then they wonder why "the Fun Pimps never tell us anything!"

i mean you're not wrong

but imo. its best to tell people things that are a bit odd. yeah people will complain but its best to know before people get really mad when they play it

people could also give suggestions as well!

 

[meganoth]

Would you care to elaborate, please? Will Vultures catch you in any vehicle during horde night and deal an insane amount of damage or what does that mean?

By the way, while I am writing in this topic already, it is worth to start new topics for following two bugs (in Alpha18)

- campfire sound remains even if the campfire has been slacked (happens to forges as well sometimes)

- marksman rifle bug where I have around 80 bullets in the magazine that can be used without another reload (instead of 8 bullets I should have with the mag extender mod)

or are they known already?

Alpha 18 won't get updates anymore. A18 bugs are good material to tell your grandchildren about, print on newspaper you want to use as toilet paper or incorporate into conspiracy theories. . And if you find bugs, this thread is definitely not the place to post them. There is a Bug Report section and there is a General Support section.

<snip>

When Apples OS went to version 10 it was (and is) running Linux instead of their own proprietary OS. That they'd been developing since Apple was started.

iPhones & Androids & Chromebooks are all running Linux. Google runs on Linux.

<snip>

Small correction: Apple OS is based on BSD which is sort of a cousin to linux with many similarities but a totally independant development history. IPhones as well don't run linux.

 

[Perlin_Worm]

Aboot the whole vehicle/food thing... What I am scratching my head about is vehicles have their own consumption mechanic which is damage/repair and it's way under utilized. Vehicles take practically no damage no matter how hard you drive it. Whouldnt it make more sense to tweak that mechanic instead of plugging it into the food system?

Perfectly willing to try this change, but just sayin..

 

[FileMachete]

And then they wonder why "the Fun Pimps never tell us anything!"

or, just possibly, it could be what we _are_ told?  :classic_biggrin:

"You can pet bears now" "To pick up landmines, use a wrench. Trust me."

---

& not for nothing Gazz, but while Groundhog Day was/is a most excellent movie, 'membering that to some of these forum comedians could get nuts! :spit:

(which I'm looking forward to! It's too quiet around here... :shocked: :suspicious: ) <all in good fun of course :biggrin1: > <n, sry, gettin my emogie on...ha! :hippie: >

Small correction: Apple OS is based on BSD which is sort of a cousin to linux with many similarities but a totally independant development history. IPhones as well don't run linux.

True. Bad writing/editting on my part. Was trying to not get too far into the weeds; should've made a broad, flame sparking, definition of " *nix " being a glob to contain all System-V/BSD/SUS/Linux/etc OSes.. though the 'Unix' history is fascinating, it's also so disfunctional it makes reality tv seem cozy & normal..