PC Alpha 18 feedback and balancing thread

[HungryZombie]

I don't believe you're confused in the slightest. I believe you're trying to play a game of semantics and "gotcha" of which I have no interest in playing. If I'm wrong, I apologize.
Do you share the belief that eating 10 food items each having a 4% chance to give you food poisoning equates to a 40% chance of getting food poisoning?

That belief is what was being contested. Not what you're now proposing.

I do not agree that eating 10 food items a day will not give you a 40% chance of getting food poisoning. However I do agree that eating 10 items each with a 4% chance of giving you food poisoning will give you a better opportunity to get food poisoning than just eating 1 item a day.

This is what everyone you and others are disagreeing with and making sticky notes about. I think people are not communicating correctly here and are talking past each other.

You can agree or disagree that it is a problem or not. That is not important. What is important is that people who are giving negative feedback are doing so based on the very true fact that the more food you have to each each day with a 4% chance each of giving you food poisoning almost guarantees that you will get food poisoning sooner or later.

 

[meganoth]

Does your finger ever get tired from pushing up your glasses and raising your hand in the front row of the class?
The devs are grown ups, they can determine what they will or won't answer on their own, they don't need your help.

As someone who is on both sides of bug reports in my day job I simply know how time consuming and annoying this back and forth on bugs is. For me it is like seeing a slanted picture on a wall must feel to an orderly housekeeper

The other reason was: Since I knew it might be some time before Fataal would read this thread again (in the christmas holidays) I wanted to make sure we got a good answer the first time. Because I was curious about the answer myself.

 

[Adam the Waster]

ik this is a bit off topic but.

i was talking to trader jen and when i didn't find anything i want for sale and i stopped looking, she said. "sorry iv never heard of a stimpak.."

just thought it was funny. also love the new voice, so my idea that she was a chain smoker is out of the window. lol

 

[UnkelRick]

I do not agree that eating 10 food items a day will not give you a 40% chance of getting food poisoning. However I do agree that eating 10 items each with a 4% chance of giving you food poisoning will give you a better opportunity to get food poisoning than just eating 1 item a day.
This is what everyone you and others are disagreeing with and making sticky notes about. I think people are not communicating correctly here and are talking past each other.

You can agree or disagree that it is a problem or not. That is not important. What is important is that people who are giving negative feedback are doing so based on the very true fact that the more food you have to each each day with a 4% chance each of giving you food poisoning almost guarantees that you will get food poisoning sooner or later.

Fair enough. It seems a sticky could do wonders. There are plenty of work arounds for food poisoning -vitamins, canned food, perks.

Of course you're bound to get it at some point, and the sudden need to consume even more food could mean you just get it again and have to eat even more. You could even get it a 3rd time...

That's pretty "bad luck" though, and it seems to be more a matter of "what if?" than a matter of it actually happening to people enough to be a real problem.

In other words, I see more people lamenting at the possibility, than I see it truly happening repeatedly.

That's just my take though. It's only happened to me once early in the first a18 experimental and it just wasn't that big a deal to me. I had to leave my mine and run home to get more food. I adapted accordingly and it hasn't happened since. Maybe I'm just lucky. Had i been low on food it might have been a different story, but hoarding food is survival-101 IMO, and food is rather abundant in my experience thus far so hoarding it hasn't been an issue.

If it truly is a common, excessively nagging issue maybe a cool down could be implemented?

 

[GOLDORAK]

Hello

I haven't been playing for a while but I'm back at it. I run version 18.2 (b5) and I'm having difficulties gardening. I have 2 separate gardens. One for the food and the other one for the rest. For this poste let's call them Garden A and Garden B.

Garden A is normal

It has patatoes, pumpkins and mushrooms all tight next to each other

Garden B is messed up. Same dirt/mud, same ground but on the other side of the house.

I can seldom align 2 seeds next to each other.

Example: Yucha, coffee, aloe vera

I use farm plots and for the last resort I spaced the plots one square each so they don't touch.

So what happens is the seed gets removed as soon as I plant it.

Any idea of what I'm doing wrong?

EDIT: I have tried and used GOOGLE and the forum search engine to find an answer but I haven't manage to find anything.

 

[Roland]

When planning ahead and calculating your probability of getting food poisoning at least once after x trials the probability does get higher the more times you plan to do it. So if you plan to eat 10 charred meat in a row there is a higher probability that you will get food poisoning at least once than if you only ate 1 or 2. If you plan to eat 100 charred meat there is a very good probability that you will get sick at least once.

That being said....each time you eat a meal your % chance of getting sick is exactly 4%. If it is my fortieth piece of meat the game does not "remember" the last 39 and adjust the probability. It is still just 4%.

It is the difference between planning and playing the odds of future actions vs what you are doing in the present as an independent action. Some people are going to think about the last 20 meals they've eaten and be paralyzed with fear to eat that 21st meal because they think they are due for vomiting even though the meal they are about to eat is simply 4% just like each individual prior meal was.

Casinos and lotteries LIKE people to focus on the projected increased probability of winning by gambling more often. They would much rather people focus on those numbers than the independent probability of each ticket actually being a winning ticket.

 

[zWolfer]

The thing is:

You get a bad luck once, then you will have to eat a lot to recover from poisoning but your chances to get sick again will be higher and higher than before. So eating to recover from poisoning eating is not the answer and you can get caught in a sickness loop forever.

I tell if you didnt get poison a single time, luck you, but a lot of players did, and not once (you can check the 7dtd group in facebook for that).

For those "solutions told", we wont consume/have a vitamin each time before eating and we wont do looting all day in game searching for vitamins or canned food because we want to enjoy all features the game has, wasnt it supposed to be in a crafting survival game? But even if we do looting all day its still a chance to not find canned food or vitamins at all. Also if we do quests, sell items or do anything to get coins and spend them in machines to buy food, it still makes farming, hunting and cooking almost useless, because if we get poisoned with homemade food, we can get sick again and not only once but even more times when trying to recover from the first one, so why would we take that chance? Consuming a food that can make we poisoned and consuming all food we have, but still dangerous? Its forcing us to go for canned food, what makes those (farming, hunting, cooking) really bad choice.

All I want is farming, hunting and cooking good again.

 

[mr.natural]

When food poisoning was introduced I pointed all this out and it boiled down to you have to put one or two points in Iron Gut perk.

The idea of food poisoning is not bad, it just needs tinkering imo.

 

[bdubyah]

Maybe just add a buff along side food poisoning that either removes the chance of getting sick again or lowers it.

I put one point into Iron Gut in my first play through. Never got sick once and I was right around day 35. I even had to eat a few sham sammiches to get by and never got sick. *shrug*

 

[meilodasreh]

...maybe a cool down could be implemented?

I think that would just be another "workaround" for the whole food spoilage thing being not thought/brought to a proper end.

Here's what I would love to see (and i guees TFP are working into that direction because the parts are already there):

Food will spoil after some time, and there will be the possibility to can can your own food. (hehe...can can...funny)

The spoilage system was already mentioned to be planned, and

why else should there be a recipe for you to craft empty cans???

It can't be too hard to code that fresh meat will spoil after maybe 2 days, while eg potatoes or corn will last longer.

A canning device could be a little workstation, or an addition for the chem station (just like anvil for the forge), or it's just that one empty can is part of the recipe.

Then let it be related to a perk so that you have to "learn" how to properly close the cans.

Then cook your stuff inside the can and there you have your own 0% poisoning, long lasting food.

I would really love that because it combines two facts i like: Having my own lovely little roof top farm, plus the great "oh my there is a deer between the trees, look how cute and lovely and...tasty...it looks...BANG" moments...

...and then make my own canned meat stew rations.

That I think would fit perfecty into the survival aspect to the game. At first you have to deal with starvation or the possibility of getting sick. Later on you have other problems...

By the way I have always stored my raw meat in a seperate box because it feels so disgusting when the piles of raw meat are placed right next to the other stuff in my regular food box :smile-new:

 

[meilodasreh]

Crack a Book headquarterspaper room.... seriously, none of the rolls of paper give paper? just wood painted white? can you please fix this. that room was GAH!

Zombies peed onto it, so it's all gummed up into one single log (if you look closely it's not white but has a slight yellow tune) :nod:

 

[beerfly]

Zombies peed onto it, so it's all gummed up into one single log (if you look closely it's not white but has a slight yellow tune) :nod:

Ugh, I touched these with my fingers once.

Anyway, Happy New Year, everyone, wish you all the best.

 

[Snekser]

can we get a command to reveal the whole map? i usually use a poi as a base and having to move all my stuff around because the city i was in just ran out of lootable pois or the traders are miles away is painfull :upset:

 

[beerfly]

can we get a command to reveal the whole map? i usually use a poi as a base and having to move all my stuff around because the city i was in just ran out of lootable pois or the traders are miles away is painfull :upset:

Exploring is important and really good part of the game, why removing it ?

 

[Snekser]

Exploring is important and really good part of the game, why removing it ?

it would help a lot to have the option even if it's let's say a cheat. As far as i know there are some people who've been asking for this before, such as poi designers.

 

[beerfly]

it would help a lot to have the option even if it's let's say a cheat. As far as i know there are some people who've been asking for this before, such as poi designers.

I know, yeah. You can use the preview tool ingame for rwg and get a good look at the maps, do you know it ?

 

[spud42]

The thing is:
You get a bad luck once, then you will have to eat a lot to recover from poisoning but your chances to get sick again will be higher and higher than before. So eating to recover from poisoning eating is not the answer and you can get caught in a sickness loop forever.

I tell if you didnt get poison a single time, luck you, but a lot of players did, and not once (you can check the 7dtd group in facebook for that).

For those "solutions told", we wont consume/have a vitamin each time before eating and we wont do looting all day in game searching for vitamins or canned food because we want to enjoy all features the game has, wasnt it supposed to be in a crafting survival game? But even if we do looting all day its still a chance to not find canned food or vitamins at all. Also if we do quests, sell items or do anything to get coins and spend them in machines to buy food, it still makes farming, hunting and cooking almost useless, because if we get poisoned with homemade food, we can get sick again and not only once but even more times when trying to recover from the first one, so why would we take that chance? Consuming a food that can make we poisoned and consuming all food we have, but still dangerous? Its forcing us to go for canned food, what makes those (farming, hunting, cooking) really bad choice.

All I want is farming, hunting and cooking good again.

dude you have just had a Maths teacher tell you you are wrong. are you incapable of learning or are you so closed minded you just will not listen to what you have been told?

on a side note. i found and installed the water purifer mod so its great for drinking murky water as it stacks to 125. curiously i havent had food poisioning since. all i eat is grilled meat and cans if i find them.. im on day 60. either there is an unforseen effect on food poisioning or ive been on the 96% of no food poisioning every time i eat...

 

[meganoth]

Fair enough. It seems a sticky could do wonders. There are plenty of work arounds for food poisoning -vitamins, canned food, perks.
Of course you're bound to get it at some point, and the sudden need to consume even more food could mean you just get it again and have to eat even more. You could even get it a 3rd time...

That's pretty "bad luck" though, and it seems to be more a matter of "what if?" than a matter of it actually happening to people enough to be a real problem.

?

It isn't really bad luck but to be expected. If you go the naiive route in the early game and try to eat lots of charred or boiled meat after you just got food poisoning, you will get food poisoning again in about a third of the cases. (The correct calculation: 10 foods boil down to a chance of 1-0.96^10 = 0.335 of getting food poisoning)

But there are better ways to insure you can refill your stamina after food poisoning or don't get poisoning at inopportune moments. For example:

*) Always keep a stack of canned food or at least one vitamin for emergencies at home.

*) In the base: Either eat a vitamin. Or eat cooked food first and fill up with canned food

*) If not in the base eat mostly canned food, or keep a vitamin with you. Risk low stamina before you eat so you get the most from the vitamin (if you are low on vitamins).

*) Never eat cooked food without a vitamin while in a quest

Now these example rules are for the player to discover through playing the **survival** game. It is the duty of a survival game to get careless players into oh-♥♥♥♥ moments, and the proposed debuff after getting food poisoning would really make food poisoning totally ignorable. There is at least one forum poster who called for removing vitamins because he thinks they are useless and food poisoning can be ignored easily because he finds plenty food.

 

[spud42]

you get a map of the world when you generate it... if you want to cheat take a screenshot or two of the map. you will know where the biomes are and where the big towns are...

what i would like to see in the map screen is the ability to zoom out further so i can see the whole map that i have uncovered on screen and not have to drag the map around to see where i havent explored yet.

 

[zWolfer]

dude you have just had a Maths teacher tell you you are wrong. are you incapable of learning or are you so closed minded you just will not listen to what you have been told?
on a side note. i found and installed the water purifer mod so its great for drinking murky water as it stacks to 125. curiously i havent had food poisioning since. all i eat is grilled meat and cans if i find them.. im on day 60. either there is an unforseen effect on food poisioning or ive been on the 96% of no food poisioning every time i eat...

Im not wrong, you are. Sorry, but you need a better math teacher. Eating 10 in a row you have a higher chance and everyone is saying that, this is a fact. Even if 10 is not 40%, still a higher chance. You are the only one disagreeing, so you are wrong and close minded. bye