PC Alpha 18 Dev Diary!!

[meilodasreh]

Well obviously I don't know what's going on under the hood with GS leveled enemies, but if it's largely a stats thing then the enemy stats could dynamically shift based on the level of the player that they are currently targeting, rather than who spawns them

That wouldn't be enough. What if there's more than one player targeting the same Z simultaneously?

It would have to be that the code checks who's bullet (or club, whatever) takes the actual hit.

I'm not a programmer, but it sounds to me like a hell of real-time calculations, because the hitpoints/damage dealt to the Z would have to be constantly checked and adjusted, according to the player's level who is hitting the Z at the current exact moment.

Again, no deep knowledge in coding here, but sounds complicated to impossible.

 

[Hek Harris]

I really think if you have say 10 or less MFs by the 20th you should release anyway. I think that's manageable for the experimental build of an alpha. Delaying for another 2 weeks for that number would be pretty silly IMO, pretty unnecessary. Again this is going to be an experimental, the only way someone can access and play it is if they sign up for it in the betas tab.
If you're worried about people complaining regardless of experimental status, you can try what Project Zomboid does. When you release the experimental build, make it only accessible with a passcode on steam, and make the passcode literally say something like "IAcknowledgeThisIsntFinished". Put that passcode in a disclaimer paragraph in your announcement on steam, boom. If you drill it in to your audience they'll remember, I can't say Project Zomboid has ever had a problem with unreasonable experimental testers.

There is another solution: wait patiently for developers to decide when their baby is ready to be served with the right vegetables and spices ^^.

 

[sillls]

The problem is level 200 dude drives through on his motorcycle and some guy on foot behind him gets to deal with the high level enemies that spawned in his wake.

Couldn't you make it so higher level zombies despawn once the higher level player leaves the area?

 

[Laz Man]

If I could do it all over again I'd have thrown out the diggable terrain. Alpha 1 could have had static Unity terrain, a simple water plane, ran 30% better, used way less ram, console wouldn't have been so beat down, allowed faster vehicles, looked as good as 18's terrain does now, (Minus the Justin talent) and we wouldn't have wasted energy on mining, cave systems, multiple versions of trees, etc. Mining could have been mining POIs with respawning nuggets like rust/skyrim/subnautica with a nice model. We'd anger 10% and gain 200% new players that don't give a ♥♥♥♥ about deformable terrain and buggy water.
At some point we might release a static terrain option for 7 days just to see the performance gains. IMO most people would run it for the performance gains and better pvp, none of this wimpy underground base business, fight like a man like in TWD. You don't see those guys living in caves/mines.

What may have made us great has also slowed us down and kept us indy looking/performing. I think mining is ok but its not part of the secret sauce, we'd still have mining it just wouldn't be ugly 3d mining. At this point we'd kind of solved it mostly but it could have saved us a lot of time and headaches, allowing us to focus on cool stuff like we are able to now.

You make a good point. I would probably still be playing and creating custom POIs even minus the static terrain. On the flip side you would probably lose some players who love the mining aspect. Perhaps it would have been better to save deep mining and underground threats as an expansion pack to the main game so it gets proper love and attention where right now it seems like an afterthought or hinderance.

 

[KavasMasta]

I thought they lasted all night. Its possible they got chopped up or destroyed. If they don't last all night, then its fine, I'll just have to start looting them in between killing or let it despawn.

Those are som really terrible choices to make. 1.) leave your base and get rewarded for surviving a 7 day horde 2.) play like a normal base defense and lose 80% of the rewards. (either by despawn or destroying the loot).

You sure you cant have a mechanic so that the land claim block just loots the bags in its area or something? (of course i know easier said than done)

 

[CannedSmeef]

There is another solution: wait patiently for developers to decide when their baby is ready to be served with the right vegetables and spices ^^.

True, I'm doing that already. But I think there's a certain point of compromise where adding two extra weeks of dev time for just a few MFs seems like a waste of time. Also no one's considering that no matter how polished your baby is there will be bugs at launch. There are too many PC/Mac/Linux (is it on linux? not sure) setups to take into account, it's inevitable that a chunk of people are going to have problems at release. Less MFs help, yes, but it's important to keep in mind that a true bug free launch is kind of impossible. I think even the most unreasonable, demanding consumers understand that. Especially when they have to activate the alpha in the beta tab.

 

[Dreyseth]

That wouldn't be enough. What if there's more than one player targeting the same Z simultaneously?It would have to be that the code checks who's bullet (or club, whatever) takes the actual hit.

I'm not a programmer, but it sounds to me like a hell of real-time calculations, because the hitpoints/damage dealt to the Z would have to be constantly checked and adjusted, according to the player's level who is hitting the Z at the current exact moment.

Again, no deep knowledge in coding here, but sounds complicated to impossible.

That would be a mess, but you misread my solution.

I suggested adjusting enemy stats based on who they are attacking, not who is attacking them. This makes a very big difference, as you have pointed out. Very trivial to code.

 

[Dimpy]

That wouldn't be enough. What if there's more than one player targeting the same Z simultaneously?It would have to be that the code checks who's bullet (or club, whatever) takes the actual hit.

I'm not a programmer, but it sounds to me like a hell of real-time calculations, because the hitpoints/damage dealt to the Z would have to be constantly checked and adjusted, according to the player's level who is hitting the Z at the current exact moment.

Again, no deep knowledge in coding here, but sounds complicated to impossible.

It's easy. All there needs to be is two lines of code that say something along the lines of "DamageTaken *= (1 + PlayerLevel/100)" and "DamageDealt *= 0.9^(playerLevel/10)". More damage taken, less damage dealt the higher level you are. But doesn't that completely undercut the whole notion of progression? :cocksure:

 

[CannedSmeef]

It's easy. All there needs to be is two lines of code that say something along the lines of "DamageTaken *= (1 + PlayerLevel/100)" and "DamageDealt *= 0.9^(playerLevel/10)". More damage taken, less damage dealt the higher level you are. But doesn't that completely undercut the whole notion of progression? :cocksure:

There isn't really a solution to this problem other than for the lower level to wait for the 200 level to leave the area so the zombies can despawn. It's a caveat of multiplayer games.

 

[Blake_]

Static terrain wouldn't change any of it. We already have magically respawning POIs for quests.

Wrong. Empyrion terrain sux. 7dtd has complete control over digging sections. Empyrion does not. The main reason I play 7dtd is because of the blocks.

I don't mind the performance drawbacks.

 

[beerfly]

Roland, your smilies keep dying man, at least leave them some water or something.

None of them will see A18 in that rate.

 

[FA_Q2]

I think he meant increasing the decay timer now that horde lasts all night so we can get our loot at the end.
- - - Updated - - -

that was meant for the electric fence. unless the wire for electric fences clip through blocks?

Yes they do. Wires are not a block - they go through anything and are not effected by anything.

 

[Dreyseth]

It's easy. All there needs to be is two lines of code that say something along the lines of "DamageTaken *= (1 + PlayerLevel/100)" and "DamageDealt *= 0.9^(playerLevel/10)". More damage taken, less damage dealt the higher level you are. But doesn't that completely undercut the whole notion of progression? :cocksure:

Yes, but you're missing the goal with your solution.

Madmole's concern was the multiplayer scenario where a high level player spawns a high level enemy which then targets a low level player.

If the enemy hit points and attack damage dynamically scale down, the higher level player would still maintain their advantage over the lower level player.

 

[bishopsbourne]

My journey would come to an end without the mine craft aspect. 3250 hours for what it is worth. it simply isn't comething I could play the game without.

 

[beerfly]

My journey would come to an end without the mine craft aspect. 3250 hours for what it is worth. it simply isn't comething I could play the game without.

Don`t worry, game will keep going further without removing underground. It`s just ideas.

 

[Morloc]

If I could do it all over again I'd have thrown out the diggable terrain. Alpha 1 could have had static Unity terrain, a simple water plane, ran 30% better, used way less ram, console wouldn't have been so beat down, allowed faster vehicles, looked as good as 18's terrain does now, (Minus the Justin talent) and we wouldn't have wasted energy on mining, cave systems, multiple versions of trees, etc. Mining could have been mining POIs with respawning nuggets like rust/skyrim/subnautica with a nice model. We'd anger 10% and gain 200% new players that don't give a ♥♥♥♥ about deformable terrain and buggy water.
At some point we might release a static terrain option for 7 days just to see the performance gains. IMO most people would run it for the performance gains and better pvp, none of this wimpy underground base business, fight like a man like in TWD. You don't see those guys living in caves/mines.

What may have made us great has also slowed us down and kept us indy looking/performing. I think mining is ok but its not part of the secret sauce, we'd still have mining it just wouldn't be ugly 3d mining. At this point we'd kind of solved it mostly but it could have saved us a lot of time and headaches, allowing us to focus on cool stuff like we are able to now.

You're a bad man....a VERY bad man!

-Morloc

 

[Roland]

If I had it to do all over again I would've bought this game during the kickstarter instead of off of steam during Alpha 6...

 

[CannedSmeef]

If I had it to do all over again I would've bought this game during the kickstarter instead of off of steam during Alpha 6...

I got this game around Alpha 7, back when each alpha brought a cool UI change to the loading screen telling you about all the new additions. I miss that screen.

 

[Dreyseth]

If I had it to do all over again I would've bought this game during the kickstarter instead of off of steam during Alpha 6...

If I could do it all over again I would become a Streaming sensation and have access 3 days earlier

 

[Erik Louden]

If I had it to do all over again I would've bought this game during the kickstarter instead of off of steam during Alpha 6...

I think I read 3 sentences of the kickstarter page for 7DTD before thinking "Hell ya!" and opting in.