PC Alpha 18 Dev Diary!!

[FA_Q2]

Who needs those (except bow) when they start the game?

No one

How many times have you used those first 3 frames and the campfire. In 2K hours, i bet I have used the campfire you create at the start less than 5 times and have literally never actually used the first 3 frames you are forced to make.

The bedroll? I scrap that 100% of the time to make it into cloths and free the slot while I fond a home that needs a bedroll.

 

[Roland]

How do you know this though? What implies that this is a possibility?

There is no implication at all. Whenever you eat anything there is a little counter in a box that appears next to the stamina bar that counts up as your food value increases. You can clearly see it go up to the number 150 and stop when your maximum stamina is 100. If you were to improve your max stamina to 130 then the little box will count up to 180 and stop as you eat.

It literally happens the moment you eat so the tie-in between eating and that number increasing has got to be obvious even without explanation.

 

[NukemDed]

the opening quests are like a minigame to me. how fast can i get them done this time.

come on guys. the quests are easy and you could ignore them. after a while you most likely tick them off thru whatever it is you are doing anyway.

 

[Hek Harris]

I removed the essential of the tutorial quest from xml file. Just craft a stone axe and yeah you've got 4 points. I think the 4 points, or maybe more, should be given when we create a character. And the premade characters should have their points already dispatched. Very easy for Clint.

 

[Dimpy]

The bedroll? I scrap that 100% of the time to make it into cloths and free the slot while I fond a home that needs a bedroll.

...? The bedroll scraps into plant fibers, and you'd free up an inventory slot placing it down anyway.

 

[FA_Q2]

There is no implication at all. Whenever you eat anything there is a little counter in a box that appears next to the stamina bar that counts up as your food value increases. You can clearly see it go up to the number 150 and stop when your maximum is 100. If you were to improve your max stamina to 130 then the little box will count up to 180 and stop as you eat.
It literally happens the moment you eat so the tie-in between eating and that number increasing has got to be obvious even without explanation.

No, Roland - that counter that appears (and then goes away) is only really clear because we have played this game so much. The bar that sticks out and the one that the player is focused on goes to 100. I can easily see how this mechanic would not be clear at all to a new player. There is a LOT that is not very clear to the new player.

 

[Roland]

No, Roland - that counter that appears (and then goes away) is only really clear because we have played this game so much. The bar that sticks out and the one that the player is focused on goes to 100. I can easily see how this mechanic would not be clear at all to a new player. There is a LOT that is not very clear to the new player.

That counter is brand new in A17. Never before has there been in this game such a thing for me to see my fullness going above the max stamina. No amount of playing before A17 could've prepared me for that counter. But when I first saw it appear immediately after eating and then appear again immediately after eating again I knew exactly what was going on.

Are you talking about new players as in completely new to video gaming altogether?

What we need are actual new players to weigh in instead of members of the Newbie Advocacy Group (NAG).

 

[Gazz]

How do you know this though? What implies that this is a possibility?

The journal entry about food / drink / survival.

 

[Roland]

The journal entry about food / drink / survival.

Wrong! That is nowhere near "implication".

 

[Drithyl]

I'm still unsure of why instead of discussing changes to the tutorial or how necessary it is, TFP doesn't just make it so each of the tutorial's stages checks your inventory/equipment for the already existing item. If it exists, clear that stage.

No need to change the tutorial, no need to make it optional (it'll eventually get cleared anyway, if it annoys a player he can remove it from the quest tracker), no need to reorder it. Made the bow before the actual bow tutorial stage? Cleared!

 

[Kalex]

It would just be a minor inconvenience. If zombies could climb frames then maybe it would be more interesting.

Shouldn't spider zombies be able to climb them?

 

[Roland]

It would just be a minor inconvenience. If zombies could climb frames then maybe it would be more interesting.

This is the best solution in my mind. It would also make frame blocks have even MORE utility for building.

Builders would be even happier and those who see them as an exploit would be happy with the balance.

 

[Krizzen]

Two questions:

1) Will we get food/water indicators back on the HUD permanently in A18 or ever?

2) Are there plans to add difficulty presets?

Difficulty presets have been amazing in games like Factorio and Kerbal Space Program. The amount of options in 7DTD are fantastic as they are right now, and it's no problem for me to adjust the game for myself. However, new players would benefit greatly from a sort of guided difficulty, but still being able to adjust things. It makes a great starting point and helps set the tone for how you guys intend the game to be played at different skill levels. It also makes a great reference point for the community (i.e. "I always play on Hard but with zombies always run set to off")

 

[n2n1]

Not at all. the discussion was about nerdpole and how removing it would only cause the players to build two rows of frames and switch between them. then you posted the video saying that Gazz probably never played with running zombies. so i said that you could also avoid this running zombie by building the structure shown in vid without nerdpoling and that it wouldnt change anything.

but maybe i missunderstood you. you wanted nerdpole to be removed right? so you showed a vid of somebody nerdpoling. that confused me. if the person playing in the vid wasnt able to nerdpole, he could've solved the situation exactly the same with 2 seconds more effort.

BUT i then said, that if you're gonna kill zombies by building such mini-poles for everyone of them, you probably shouldnt play with running zombies..

EDIT: i mean, whats the point of them running, if you always hide on top of a mini pole you just constructed?

Ah! there it is....i understand now . Thanks.

Yes your point of view - makes sense. But i still wanted to try to solve the problem by improving the game mechanics - by limiting (disable "nerdpoling"). This is like the prohibition which is "backward running".

After all, this is the same type of problem solving.

When I watch the video, he's not hiding up there. On the contrary. He hit the zombie with his club. With the raised position he only gained an advantage in the fight. Hiding would mean that one does not move.
And when I consider that he suffered from hunger and food poisoning and was encumbered, that was the tactically wisest decision he could make.

Yes, on this server hard rules, there the situation forces to move.

Perhaps the example was not the best, but in this videos they constantly use "nerdpoling".

It is because of the exploit - they tighten the nuts with the rules to have at least some challenge.

Wiser would be not to pull the zombie in the first place but yes i get what you‘re saying. But why showing this to strenghten the argument to remove nerdpoling (where this all started)?

if you do not thin out the ranks of running zombies - there will be a moment when they will all chase you and then you will not help any "hidden"/"Wise" tactics.

Looking at the video, I'd say the problem is that the zombie didn't target the bottom frame.If he did, there would be no more exploit.

Yes, but removing "nerdpoling" is a technically simple task, rather than an additional AI code, so this idea seemed very attractive to me.

 

[Roland]

I'm still unsure of why instead of discussing changes to the tutorial or how necessary it is, TFP doesn't just make it so each of the tutorial's stages checks your inventory/equipment for the already existing item. If it exists, clear that stage.
No need to change the tutorial, no need to make it optional (it'll eventually get cleared anyway, if it annoys a player he can remove it from the quest tracker), no need to reorder it. Made the bow before the actual bow tutorial stage? Cleared!

+1 Excellent QOL solution with the starter quest and the functionality is already there because in the gathering part of each quest if you already have enough mats it counts it as completed and doesn't force you to harvest more.

 

[Dark_Corvid]

I've pushed it to the front though. Everyone is complaining for no reason. Its stone axe, club, bow, pants, shirt, frame, campfire, trader now. 1 arrow, 1 frame.

This will be my last post about the tutorial as I don't intend to be a pain and continually bring up the same issue.

The clothing portion of the old tutorial quest seemed to do a check once it was the active phase as to whether the player had the clothing equipped, then check off the steps without requiring recrafting.

Similarly, if each step checked the players inventory, belt, and equipment slots for the items, the quest line could check off steps the player may have completed 'out of order'. It might not work for the upgrade block step but would streamline the tutorial for those in the know who, for whatever reason, do the steps differently.

I have encountered situations, such as spawning in an RWG town with zombies in close proximity, that necessitate crafting in a different order than the tutorial demands.

 

[n2n1]

It would just be a minor inconvenience. If zombies could climb frames then maybe it would be more interesting.

Is very lacking of a spider which climbs the walls...

Joel already said that nerdpolling was already discussed in the past by TFP, and they decided to not remove it. Why you all keep tryharding?

I didn't know that.

It must have been a long time ago - and i was playing at that time instead of writting here.

 

[hotpoon]

Someone hasn't played Skyrim, which IMO has amazing stealth.

I have played Skyrim. Oblivion too. Not sure what gave you that impression?

 

[RipClaw]

Shouldn't spider zombies be able to climb them?

The old spiders could climb them but the spiders in A17 are more like frogs.

 

[n2n1]

This isn't lush Skyrim (which also doesn't have heavy grass until you mod it), its AZ after bombs dropped.

Thanks. But I asked about a technical problem.

Design is design. Some mods even make the sparse grass.

Although.... in such conditions - the grasses is growing better, and from radiation - even better.