PC Alpha 18 Dev Diary!!

[Cazmyr]

Good morning all,

Was away on vacation for a week and have been stalking/ catching up. Lots of interesting reading here!

On food spoilage:

I would like to see this as long as working refrigerators came with it. If it is not something that TFP wants in the base game, I am happy to see it left to the mods.

On crops:

I think with food spoilage you could have a basic crop failing system. I would imagine TFP would want to keep this simple and not have growing seasons and weather effects as that seems like a large system to put in place.

They could have a secondary timer on the crop that starts when the crop reaches maturity and if it is not picked in X time then it becomes rotten. Like the dried up corn.

I also liked the idea that crops need to be adjacent ( or maybe within 2 or 3 blocks) of a water block to grow at all. That may be more than TFP are wanting to implement though and that is fair, more for modders.

I am excited about the changes to the game for 18. The improvements to RWG is a large part of that. The skill/ perk revamp and the weapon changes are another big part of that. The game keeps changing and I like that, a lot. I don't love all the changes, but that is life. I think this is an amazing and unique experience and I thank TFP for it!

 

[madmole]

Food spoilage would of course require crop spoilage as well. Just wrap the stages so that the final stage returns to seedling stage if you don’t harvest the plants. So if you harvest you need to store, and if you miss the harvest window you have to wait until it comes back around again.
Add to that the return of zombies and animals trampling crops and even possibly targeting food and crops as a priorities and the problem of using unpicked mature crops as a spoilage workaround is mostly solved.

I'd take it a step further and make it grow into a dead one where you lost the crop entirely. The problem is if you play online and go to be IRL when you log in your stuff will all be dead for sure.

 

[madmole]

zombies are smarter then we give them credit for.... they are tired of us building these anti-zombie fortresses so now they will get rid of all our food sources... zombies win if we starve to death. <good thing joel doesnt come to forum and read these ideas>

Says who?

 

[Thecolours]

We're talking about that, they could target your containers.

They should target your dukes and guns.

 

[madmole]

Zombies attacking crops: I could imagine fertilizer from rotting meat that will attract zombies, but is necessary to have a decent growth rate (else its severely slowed down)

Thats why they used to turn in circles, all the dead have a load of ♥♥♥♥ in their pants.

 

[madmole]

So I assume the bandits raid will only start when the player is nearby (loaded the area),or is there some kind of "approximated raid result" calculation, when the player is far off?

Haven't given it much thought yet. I'm thinking wandering hordes though, so if you are at your base and one comes buy, they might start talking about "I wonder what kind of loot this guy might have?" "Only one way to find out" and they start attacking your base.

 

[meganoth]

* More animals? (cows, tigers, and turkeys) Mountain lion and coyote

The larger the farm the more intense the bunny heat map. Bunnies show up in droves for the feast.

Elmer Fudd confirmed.

 

[FA_Q2]

"Why do we even have hunger/thirst in the game? What behaviors does it change?

You have to gather, produce and eat. All new actuivities.

You know what would be different than storage - exactly zero. Nothing. Nada. Zip. My farm will sustain me in either situation. The question is what does it add. What action does the player have to take to manage the situation? Nothing different than what they are doing now - grow a farm. A mechanic needs a PURPOSE.

The only real difference is having to click on an item every few minutes" - an item that, by the way, you can't run out of. That's what it all boils down to if you don't have some proper item economy.
Yes, pretty much everyone has a farm that "suffices" - if they bother making one that is. Whether or not people ignore all other sources of food (traders, loot, animals) the farm always creates a surplus and people "don't farm as much" which most usually means "don't farm at all" if their surplus is large enough simply because there is no reason for them to do it.

So yes, given that there time is a resource (especially under certain settings), I'd consider it a pretty important change. For example in a random occasion the "let's go grind some zombies" would become "let's go grind some zombies - oh wait do we have the proper resources to make food so that we don't starve while we do it"? I'd consider this "a win".

Except you are not really adding a real time sink by making food disappear if you don't eat it. Harvesting is fast and easy. If your objective here is to force players to harvest more often to eat then I would say that is not really a sufficient purpose for an entire mechanic to be added.

Basically, I don't see the value add with another layer of complexity that is ignored because you have an infinite food source already.

And if we want a proper item economy and farming to become something more than farmville farming, involving some actual player decision making, a resource cost (like fertilizer) for the plant to grow needs to come back to the game.

All indications show that is exactly what the dev team is not interested in doing since that is what the farming system used to be and it has slowly but steadily migrated away from that direction.

 

[The Gronk]

* Piranhas and sharks in the water? No

Ill tempered mutated sea bass?

Russian spy whales?

In all seriousness, if you don't eventually have a Kraken as a late-stage underwater threat I'll be sorely disappointed.

 

[Sakurambo]

I think there was one other, might have been Portuguese though.

tnx, i'm fine(ish) with english, but my nephews aren't

probably already ask and answered but electricity got a revamp for a18 or later on?

 

[Cazmyr]

tnx, i'm fine(ish) with english, but my nephews aren'tprobably already ask and answered but electricity got a revamp for a18 or later on?

Later on.

 

[madmole]

tnx, i'm fine(ish) with english, but my nephews aren'tprobably already ask and answered but electricity got a revamp for a18 or later on?

We can always add more languages at gold.

 

[Tin]

The larger the farm the more intense the bunny heat map. Bunnies show up in droves for the feast. A garden of 20 plants won't trigger the horde but a farm of 100 will see itself reduced down to 20 by time they are satiated.
The light of the bloodmoon causes crops to die which resets them all to be on the same timer.

Zombies and animals can trample and ruin crops completely. The farmer zombie from some muddled memory of his rotted brain has an unreasonable hatred toward crops and specifically targets them when in destruction mode.

Some or all of these give incentives to player to get the crops harvested and into containers rather than leaving them in the plants.

Like the ideas.

How about also having the blood moon affect the wildlife? Instead of going for players the bears/ boars/ deer/ rabbits went for the crops? First wave is the animals, followed by the zeds and so on..? 'All' the animals become aggressive during the bloodmoon, so if you hurt them, they will attack. Maybe counter the meat delivery service with them being tainted and they don't drop any good meat, or very little.

 

[gampbler]

I think there was one other, might have been Portuguese though.

What about Klingon?

 

[SnowDog1942]

You don't NEED whatever is in that safe on day 1. Mark it on your map, come back later when you have found the right tool. You are making the game a grind by being stubborn and playing stupid.

Lol my thoughts exactly

 

[Cazmyr]

I just though of something that could be added to the living off the land perk. If it is not right for the base game, maybe a modder would like it.

It would go hand in hand with crops needing to be within X of a water block to grow.

Default ( Level 0) -

- Get 1 Crop per Harvest

- 8 crops to make 1 seed

- Crops must be touching water block

- Crops must be harvested within 12 game hours or will rot.

Living off the Land 1 -

- Get 2 Crops per Harvest

- 6 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 2 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 1 game day or will rot.

Living off the Land 2 -

- Get 3 Crops per Harvest

- 5 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 2 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 36 game hours or will rot.

Living off the Land 3 -

- Get 4 Crops per Harvest

- 4 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 3 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 2 game day or will rot.

Living off the Land 4 -

- Get 5 Crops per Harvest

- 3 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 4 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 3 game days or will rot.

Living off the Land 5 -

- Get 6 Crops per Harvest

- 1 crop to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 6 block of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 4 game days or will rot.

Sorry for the space consuming format, but it is how my brain works. All of this is IMHO and just my thoughts.

 

[SnowDog1942]

Nevermind....

 

[Ayrton]

* In A18 we will have more new Pois? Yes*New recipes? Yes

* Will we have zombie bosses? - Yes

* Will we have more air enemies? (bees and vultures) No

* Deterioration of crops? No

* More defense traps? (will return the peak) No

* Crossbow trap? No

* Throw flames? No

* Can we use the cameras and connect them to the TVs and watch them from our bunker? (that would be great) No

* More animals? (cows, tigers, and turkeys) Mountain lion and coyote

* Scorpions in desert terrain? No

* Piranhas and sharks in the water? No

* Missions that take you to meet another merchant? Doubtful but someday.

* More skins for zombies? No

Thanks for the response, the world needs more developers like you!

When could we see the concept of new animals?

The bandits are far from A18?

Thanks for all the answers!

 

[madmole]

I just though of something that could be added to the living off the land perk. If it is not right for the base game, maybe a modder would like it.
It would go hand in hand with crops needing to be within X of a water block to grow.

Default ( Level 0) -

- Get 1 Crop per Harvest

- 8 crops to make 1 seed

- Crops must be touching water block

- Crops must be harvested within 12 game hours or will rot.

Living off the Land 1 -

- Get 2 Crops per Harvest

- 6 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 2 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 1 game day or will rot.

Living off the Land 2 -

- Get 3 Crops per Harvest

- 5 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 2 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 36 game hours or will rot.

Living off the Land 3 -

- Get 4 Crops per Harvest

- 4 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 3 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 2 game day or will rot.

Living off the Land 4 -

- Get 5 Crops per Harvest

- 3 crops to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 4 blocks of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 3 game days or will rot.

Living off the Land 5 -

- Get 6 Crops per Harvest

- 1 crop to make 1 seed

- Crop must be within 6 block of water block

- Crops must be harvested within 4 game days or will rot.

Sorry for the space consuming format, but it is how my brain works. All of this is IMHO and just my thoughts.

Recipe scaling is in, so we could do that part. However, its not going to change much, you can get food at traders, find huge farm pois, and hunt, survive only on eggs etc. Food is just a minor bump in the road getting started and isn't meant to be "don't starve". I can't think of any other survival game where food is the center of attention.

 

[RestInPieces]

Nothing different than what they are doing now - grow a farm

Wrong:

-Many players don't bother growing a farm in the first place because they stockpile food from other sources.

-They will also have to sustain it.

What action does the player have to take to manage the situation

The player will have to juggle between food sources and will have to spend time to sustain the farm. No more visiting that food

POI mindlessly and stockpiling all the food in the world and attending your farm once in a blue moon.

If your objective here is to force players to harvest more often

The question is what does it add..... A mechanic needs a PURPOSE.

I understand it would be inconvenient for you - it's not for everyone. As I said earlier, if the "let's go grind some zombies" or the "let's go explore that POI", becomes a case where the player actually has to manage his time and prepare, it is more than enough of a purpose.

you are not really adding a real time sink by making food disappear

So, you are saying that "I am not really adding a real time sink" but on the same time "my objective is to force players to harvest more often". I think you just don't like the time sink - it would be more productive to this discussion if you were more straightforward.

Basically, I don't see the value add with another layer of complexity that is ignored because you have an infinite food source already.

As said earlier, spoilage will make sure that you will be working for that "infinite food source" and not just stockpiling food from every food source in the game, working on it once a year. Cost (e.g. need for fertilizer or seed loss) will make sure that the player will have to put some effort into and choose whether to sustain the farm, rather than just clicking a few times.

You have to gather, produce and eat. All new actuivities.

Which, after reading your post, seems you don't particularly like doing very often, much like farming, since without spoilage you can just easily stockpile food for months and stop gathering or producing altogether.

You may not be finding much of a purpose personally in this, but as I said, not all survival elements and resource management is for everyone and I am sure you don't really have to worry for your way of playing since it will most definite be optional if it ever gets implemented.

All indications show that is exactly what the dev team is not interested in doing since that is what the farming system used to be and it has slowly but steadily migrated away from that direction.

So?