PC A20 - Leveling is now pointless

[meganoth]

but when A20 came out, steamers got to play it on a long weekend when half of them were offline and us the supporters got to watch a youtube video...lol

That was in their contract. The streamers got to play it for promotion. If you ever own a games company you too will try to get whatever news outlet is there reporting about games to report about YOUR game.

Now show me where in our contract it says we get to play the newest version before anyone else? You won't because testers could play it already months before us. Are you envious of testers too?

this bug didn't only happen to me, my gf pc was brand new and fresh install and she got the bug before me.

Ok. But you played together on a server (which might be either of your PC or a rented server) and the server could have had the problem. But I'm just showing you there are many possibilities and finding the cause of a bug isn't simple. I think Faatal already said something about looking for the bug which means they probably could reproduce it already which means it actually is a bug.

 

[Darklegend222]

Broadly speaking, yes! "Random" numbers in programming are almost always pseudo-random, based on a seed value. If you know the seed value, you can determine the sequence of "random" numbers that will result. In nearly all applications where randomness is required, this is sufficient. If you:

1. Know the seed
   
2. Know the exact algorithm used to produce 'random' numbers
   
3. Know the probabilities for all potential loot items in all containers you want to search
   

Then you could deterministically work your way through a game looting exactly the right containers at exactly the right time to get the "best" loot for each search.

I wouldn't know how to make an algorithm, but I'm sure someone of your expertise could.

It'd be rather interesting to see what seed values produce the best type of loot per trader, each restock. I know that it might require generating nearly 100 worlds to get anything useful, and even then it may not produce enough information.

 

[Boidster]

It'd be rather interesting to see what seed values produce the best type of loot per trader, each restock. I know that it might require generating nearly 100 worlds to get anything useful, and even then it may not produce enough information.

I wrote a longer, very boring nerd response, but the gist is that it's unlikely that such a test would show anything helpful, much like the loot container testing didn't really show anything about "good" or "bad" RNG seeds. It would surprise me quite a bit if TFP coded the game - loot, traders, spawning, any of it - so that world seed was anything more than academically related to RNG experience. Could you visit Jen, then Rekt, then Joel in world A and then world B and compare results? Sure. But you'd have to visit them in exactly that same order - probably with zero other actions in between - if you wanted to duplicate the results in a real game.

So the message is, there is no such thing as a bad RNG seed. Every world is plenty "random enough" to completely hide the "pseudo" part that we computer nerds add to it with our algorithms.

 

[Pernicious]

I think you are more focused about my gf’s job than other things here… and I’m not sure what you trying to defend exactly ? The complexity of how my vehicle bounces off your head or my vehicle disappearing before it does?!

I think the point is, you have no idea what you are talking about, and tried to use your girlfiend's job to lend some credibility to your statements. Even your last statement there tells me (and most programmers) how naive you are - those two are not separate issues, and there is no either/or. The more complicated the code around how a vehicle behaves, the more likely an error will creep in that makes it behave in a way that it should not. Who knows if vehicles disappearing or teleporting is something as simple as the code for trying to determine what it hits or what altitude it should level on, has a rounding error, and it falls through the earth?

But let's move on, and instead use something a bit more comparable and less personal. Cyberpunk 2077. That game was started one year earlier than 7D2D, and was developed by a very large (multi billion dollar) company with over 1000 employees, and released late 2020. Go to their forums and have a look at how many bugs and complaints of instability there were, and how many people even now, a year and 3 or 4 months later, are still complaining. Hell, case in point, there are vehicle bugs in CP2077 as well:

(I'd love to say that I chose that as a bit of a middle finger to you, but truth be told, that was the first image I got when I googled "CP2077 vehicle bug". )

This bug is present in a flat, polygon based, immutable world (i.e, you can't dig a hole in the road, and expect the car to respond to that as an excuse for the level of the car or passenger being misaligned. You can in 7d2d.)

Anyway, I started responding to you by saying that I usually don't get into mud slinging matches... This is exactly the reason why, so I should have taken my own advice. I'm gonna let this go, unless you have genuine questions I can contribute to, and not just complaints and defensiveness.

 

[Roland]

Anyway, I started responding to you by saying that I usually don't get into mud slinging matches... This is exactly the reason why

It's cuz you don't have a gf amirite?  

 

[Pernicious]

It's cuz you don't have a gf amirite?  

100% - At least, it better be.

(I've been married for 12 years, so I'd be murdered in my sleep if I did!)

 

[Darklegend222]

Broadly speaking, yes! "Random" numbers in programming are almost always pseudo-random, based on a seed value. If you know the seed value, you can determine the sequence of "random" numbers that will result. In nearly all applications where randomness is required, this is sufficient. If you:

1. Know the seed
   
2. Know the exact algorithm used to produce 'random' numbers
   
3. Know the probabilities for all potential loot items in all containers you want to search
   

Then you could deterministically work your way through a game looting exactly the right containers at exactly the right time to get the "best" loot for each search.

Ironically, I just decided to make a new world on a new seed, got steel tools schematics by specifically looting trash piles LOL. I know it's still random, but that's still very interesting nonetheless!

Edit: I'm on day 1: 12:27

 

[Roland]

so when others like roland say these new features and game today is for new newcomers, it kind a selfish..since we were the real supporters out there and deserve much more than newbies. 

Sorry. Whenever they update the game in the current phase it is with the intention to create the base 1.0 game that they expect most gamers who purchase it as a finished game to be able to pick up and play and enjoy. They do not update the game with the intention to add on complexity and expanded features in order to satisfy those who have already devoured all of the current content that is available. That is what DLC expansions to the base game are for-- and those won't be released until after the base 1.0 game is released.

You are essentially asking for DLC expansion content for a game that hasn't even been released in its basic form. It is not selfishness that would cause TFP to ignore such a request. It is plain common sense and good business. All the bling and extra stuff and moar content you wish they would add instead of the development stuff they are doing hopefully will come someday. Madmole said they plan to support and update 7 Days to Die for at least 2 years after it releases.  So on their timetable that's hopefully 2 DLC expansions to the game with hopefully purely juicy extra content and zero overhauls to re-balance or re-implement.

 

[Boidster]

Hell, case in point, there are vehicle bugs in CP2077 as well:

Help me understand what the bug is here. Car's got a T-topper. Dude drives around without pants. Not seeing the problem. This is the cyber punk future I dream of.

 

[JCrook1028]

steamers got to play it on a long weekend when half of them were offline and us the supporters got to watch a youtube video

Besides the fact that they are advertising they are also supporters, same as you. They bought the game same as you.

 

[saoron666]

Besides the fact that they are advertising they are also supporters, same as you. They bought the game same as you.

And I bought the game same as them.. what’s your point? 

 

[BarryTGash]

And I bought the game same as them.. what’s your point? 

If you are a streamer, that meets the requirements, as well then you should have applied for the streamer weekend: 

 

[saoron666]

I think the point is, you have no idea what you are talking about, and tried to use your girlfiend's job to lend some credibility to your statements. Even your last statement there tells me (and most programmers) how naive you are - those two are not separate issues, and there is no either/or. The more complicated the code around how a vehicle behaves, the more likely an error will creep in that makes it behave in a way that it should not. Who knows if vehicles disappearing or teleporting is something as simple as the code for trying to determine what it hits or what altitude it should level on, has a rounding error, and it falls through the earth?

But let's move on, and instead use something a bit more comparable and less personal. Cyberpunk 2077. That game was started one year earlier than 7D2D, and was developed by a very large (multi billion dollar) company with over 1000 employees, and released late 2020. Go to their forums and have a look at how many bugs and complaints of instability there were, and how many people even now, a year and 3 or 4 months later, are still complaining. Hell, case in point, there are vehicle bugs in CP2077 as well:



(I'd love to say that I chose that as a bit of a middle finger to you, but truth be told, that was the first image I got when I googled "CP2077 vehicle bug". )

This bug is present in a flat, polygon based, immutable world (i.e, you can't dig a hole in the road, and expect the car to respond to that as an excuse for the level of the car or passenger being misaligned. You can in 7d2d.)

Anyway, I started responding to you by saying that I usually don't get into mud slinging matches... This is exactly the reason why, so I should have taken my own advice. I'm gonna let this go, unless you have genuine questions I can contribute to, and not just complaints and defensiveness.

You sound like a man that believes he is making a point when feeding whatever BS to a girl in a bar to get some ass… really no disrespect intended… just giving you how I feel throughout my experience hiring 126 employees at the company..

you know the type that you ask them a question about their experiences or ask them to explain a certain thing and they show you their reference letters instead and which school they went to… lmao  

for the 4th time, I’ll repeat it again for you, my point is not how the codes, the algorithm or the logic behind this vehicle disappearing or my the turrets going underground when I place them. It’s how and why it isn’t tested when it’s supposed to be tested if the code was rewritten or modified …and I am not the only person who experiencing this bug, I did see some others have same issue. 

my turret doesn’t travel at a certain speed or velocity, it is placed on a x,y,z coord and it ends up underground…

im not a programmer and I don’t code , I’m just asking why this needs to happen on a A20 and why there isn’t an urgent patch for it?

but please go ahead and amuse yourself by tell me about the obvious logic behind a moving car lol because it seems we are  

 

[DiegoLBC1]

You sound like a man that believes he is making a point when feeding whatever BS to a girl in a bar to get some ass

I feel like the quote above when I read your statements around your girlfriend's qualifications when you said: "you know the type that you ask them a question about their experiences or ask them to explain a certain thing and they show you their reference letters instead and which school they went to… "

Really no disrespect intended too

 

I did see some others have same issue. 

Maybe  why "some others" isn't the same that "All"?
 

BTW... Have you already registered your report on this?

 

[saoron666]

I feel like the quote above when I read your statements around your girlfriend's qualifications when you said: "you know the type that you ask them a question about their experiences or ask them to explain a certain thing and they show you their reference letters instead and which school they went to… "

Really no disrespect intended too

 

So you the type that can’t face a man and instead talks @%$# about a girl? Lol explains your hair style … 

 

[DiegoLBC1]

Então você é do tipo que não consegue encarar um homem e ao invés disso fala @%$# sobre uma garota? Lol explica seu estilo de cabelo… 

You wanted to prevail your point, citing your girlfriend's skills as above the game's creators skills.

You missed the point here.

I, on the other hand, am not obliged to give satisfaction about my hair, as it does not define my character, just like someone who has tattoos.

Now you miss the point, derail the topic, and put your girlfriend's skills as "feasible arguments", as if she had a superior ability to the developers of 7D2D.

Ask your girlfriend to create a mod for you, after all, she is very competent, she could do better than the devs.

My hair? It's still just my hair.

You didn't show any YOUR competence either, you just cited your girlfriend competency as an "argument" that bug fixes are "easy".

So speak for yourself, don't quote third parties, because your girlfriend's work doesn't fit here, and doesn't compare to creating games as you tried to make it out to be.

Hey!

as I mentioned before, my gf is a senior software product owner .. wtv that title is lol

(...)

She saw the vehicles going underground, her plant seeds getting lost when she harvests them, etc… 

(..)

she said it’s because they using that same code for past 10 years and every time they making some changes they not modifying the other codes so it messes things up… she also said, she doesn’t understand why they keep twitching these same old things if they were working good already?! Why not just focus on making and adding new features, new content’s, instead of all this polishing they call it just focus on A21 let’s say with bandits, new areas, mobs, bosses, challenges etc….

BS a lot...

Summary:

You always try to belittle what's been done so far, to justify that they should have put aside THESE changes they made, to work on the changes that YOU wanted them to make.

But since you don't accept arguments against it, you think it's valid to talk about my hair style.


This can only be a joke....

 

[Roland]

Let's all keep the focus on the game. There is no need for trash talk or insults.

 

[SnowDog1942]

Let's all keep the focus on the game. There is no need for trash talk or insults.

Go fly a kite!

 

[saoron666]

You wanted to prevail your point, citing your girlfriend's skills as above the game's creators skills.

You missed the point here.

I, on the other hand, am not obliged to give satisfaction about my hair, as it does not define my character, just like someone who has tattoos.

Now you miss the point, derail the topic, and put your girlfriend's skills as "feasible arguments", as if she had a superior ability to the developers of 7D2D.

Ask your girlfriend to create a mod for you, after all, she is very competent, she could do better than the devs.

My hair? It's still just my hair.

You didn't show any YOUR competence either, you just cited your girlfriend competency as an "argument" that bug fixes are "easy".

So speak for yourself, don't quote third parties, because your girlfriend's work doesn't fit here, and doesn't compare to creating games as you tried to make it out to be.

BS a lot...

Summary:

You always try to belittle what's been done so far, to justify that they should have put aside THESE changes they made, to work on the changes that YOU wanted them to make.

But since you don't accept arguments against it, you think it's valid to talk about my hair style.


This can only be a joke....

that is because your comments are directed to my GF and not to me or the game.. 

you have something valid to say then say, if you got nothing to say then go play the game and

keep my gf out of this and ill keep this out of your ..

\

your comments were not even directed to any game related facts or arguments.. they were pointed to my gf..

who even talks behind someones back that they not even in the convo?

wtv ill ignore your posts since they have no value or sentimental interests to me..

ill quote who i want what i want, your opinion dont mean sh... to me

 

[Roland]

It’s how and why it isn’t tested when it’s supposed to be tested

HOW

It is supposed to be tested by subjecting it to larger and larger sample sizes in order first get all the obvious bugs and then get all the intermittent or rarely emerging bugs that you will only see if hundreds out of thousands are experiencing them and hopefully reporting so that they can then be reproduced internally and then solved.

Internal testers --> experimental testers --> main branch testers

WHEN

It is supposed to be tested during the development phase of the game. All testing should be completed before the game is released as a 1.0 finished product. Builds should be kept secret and tested internally at first while the feature is still being actively developed so that TFP doesn't get 1000s of tickets about things that aren't working that the dev already knows isn't working because he isn't finished yet. The initial internal testing team will then find the common and easily manifesting bugs, once again, to avoid getting 1000s of duplicate bug reports on obvious things. Then the build can be pushed to experimental for a few weeks to gather bug reports from the much larger population now playing the game and experiencing bugs. Finally, the game is put to the main branch so that final testing and any additional bugs can be found with the largest sample size yet.

Please do not let yourself be concerned about whether TFP is doing it in the right way or at the right time. They are doing exactly what they should be doing when it needs to be done. The updates they push out to us are builds that they know will have bugs and will need fixing. If your expectation is that the bugs you are experiencing should never have been allowed to get through the internal process, that is an unrealistic expectation to have for playing the game during the development phase.