PC A20 Developer Diary Discussions

[Darklegend222]

well it can be easy fixed by making clear rules like : 1.  you want to stealth you need clothes and go barefoot or with five fingers shoes or indian moccasines.

2. What can triggered zombies in this same POI ? :

broken glass - if you step on it in shoes it make  noice and trigger zombie in this same POI  . barefoot  this but you get bleeding

rubbish  this same thing but without bleeding

Fake floors ( it will make noice when you step on it) this same 

So to avoid detected you must destroy it first ( well it will be easier that implementing puting it ).

Door are offten closed so you need to pickpocking it because hiting it with axe or pickaxe will make a noise and triggered zombies. Some doors have alarm on it ( in bank shop lab etc) and will triggered alarm when it is hitted respawning zombie horde. 

3. what can triggered zombie horde?

- random respawning sleeping screamer and screamerina ( this is starved versions of screamer - less hp , more destroyed clothes  more dirt on hands and feet). - you must to eliminate her fast or she will call for help

- doors with alarm 

- explosions  (like some places have a lot of  barrels - you need to kill zombies before they will make explosion)

- collapsing ( some POI have fake floor but it works diffrent - when it's broke it cause collapsing of some part of building )

I will agree with that, Go into the school in the snow biome on navezgane, walk into gym, everyone's triggered.

There have been countless discussions about sleeper volumes needing to be tweaked. Stealth can work, SOMETIMES, but it's not even close to helpful as it is just running in with a sledgehammer. The best your gonna do is kill 1-2 zombies before the rest wake up.

I know for sure I died at least once because of it. And that is not neccesarily wrong. The same can happen with mines in the wasteland or around military camps, floor traps and surprises like on the first seventh day in any new 7days gamers life.

I am a candidate for the Zombie Rehabilitation Party and I will defend their right to get a fair chance in fights and eat people. Zombies are supressed everywhere. Look around, do you see any zombie being CEO of a top500 company? Have you seen the wages they get? How difficult it is for them to rent a house or just a social security number? There is a lot of discrimination here. Vote ZRP, we care.

Dying because they've overrun you is a separate problem. If you died because you don't know how stealth or hearing/seeing detection works then that's on you.

If you can't stealth more than 90% of the time because zombies have auto-trigger once you pass an invisible barrier, then it's a problem. Which is what EVERYONE complains about, because you know, it's a problem.

I'm having a hard time figuring out how you missed the point entirely.

 

[Matt115]

I will agree with that, Go into the school in the snow biome on navezgane, walk into gym, everyone's triggered.

There have been countless discussions about sleeper volumes needing to be tweaked. Stealth can work, SOMETIMES, but it's not even close to helpful as it is just running in with a sledgehammer. The best your gonna do is kill 1-2 zombies before the rest wake up.

Well  thats way i thing to create " points"  like : crouch when going barefoot 1 shoting with bow 1 , going barefoot 4 etc and if you get for example 10 point zombie will know you are here. But as zombie is farer it need more point to be alarmed like 10 block away 11 point to be alarmed

 

[IzPrebuilt]

Does anyone have any info on how the radiation will affect the player? I know I saw someone said it will work similar to the older Fallout games but I can't find anything from the devs about it.

Ty.

 

[BFT2020]

If you can't stealth more than 90% of the time because zombies have auto-trigger once you pass an invisible barrier, then it's a problem. Which is what EVERYONE complains about, because you know, it's a problem.

I'm having a hard time figuring out how you missed the point entirely.

Not if it is the intent of the Developers that you cannot stealth 100% of the time and those rooms are setup to ensure that you cannot.  It wouldn't be a problem at that point, more of how they are approaching the game intent / design.

He didn't miss the point.  This point has been debated for so much over and over again.

 

[Laz Man]

For those who forgotten, I think the wandering sleeper feature that was pushed to a21 was one of the things that may address the stealth issues at least partially.

Also, with the new feral sense feature, I have a feeling stealth perks will be more useful in a20.

 

[Roland]

Does anyone have any info on how the radiation will affect the player? I know I saw someone said it will work similar to the older Fallout games but I can't find anything from the devs about it.

Ty.

It is planned that there will be three levels of radiation along with a radiation icon that will appear and a geiger counter sound effect and possibly a screen effect that will help the player differentiate between the mild, moderate, and extreme radiation zones. It has also been revealed that radiation zones will also modify the gamestage value resulting in tougher enemies and better loot. Finally, one of the planned outfits is designed to protect against radiation and there will be medicine to counteract radiation poisoning. 

The three levels of radiation have been in the code but not implemented for years now. The game used to have the extreme radiation as a zone that surrounded the entire map caging the player within it. That was removed a few alphas back. As far as I know, radiation is not on the priority list for A20 so that is why there isn't a lot of talk about it.

 

[IzPrebuilt]

It is planned that there will be three levels of radiation along with a radiation icon that will appear and a geiger counter sound effect and possibly a screen effect that will help the player differentiate between the mild, moderate, and extreme radiation zones. It has also been revealed that radiation zones will also modify the gamestage value resulting in tougher enemies and better loot. Finally, one of the planned outfits is designed to protect against radiation and there will be medicine to counteract radiation poisoning. 

The three levels of radiation have been in the code but not implemented for years now. The game used to have the extreme radiation as a zone that surrounded the entire map caging the player within it. That was removed a few alphas back. As far as I know, radiation is not on the priority list for A20 so that is why there isn't a lot of talk about it.

That's super helpful thanks! I couldn't find much about it. Just for the record, I'm making a Youtube video about Alpha 20, are you fine with a screenshot of this being in the video?

Edit: also what is radiation actually going to do? (if we know) is it all going to just do health damage? or is it moreso like the infection where you get increasing amounts of poisoning with increasing debuffs?

 

[BFT2020]

Can any dev comment on the QoL changes or changes in general for Stun Baton? Are any even on the table? As someone who started a new A19.5 run with the explicit intention to do a Stun Baton character . . . yeah . . .

IMO, you shouldn't need to have candy + a book only mod + an entire perk line + your junk turrets going all combined to basically just let the junk turrets do what they would already have done anyway. I couldn't even get a single stun baton for the entire first week, which made the build very sad as well, so I'm hoping it gets some drop rate changes to actually be usable as a starting weapon as I'm pretty sure damage wise it's out damaged by a stone axe rofl

Alpha 20 is getting the Pipe Baton for Int builds.  That should greatly help in early game play as the Int tree was the only one that had a melee weapon you can perk into but didn't get it until much later.

However, don't expect the baton to improve overall in damage compared to the others.  Right now it looks like the plan is to keep the Int tree the worst in regards to combat (if you pure spec into it), but obviously that can change down the road and I don't have any more insight into the Int tree than anyone else eagerly waiting for Alpha 20

 

[Khalagar]

ATM the stun baton is fun but it honestly is essentially useless. It stuns enemies decently well, but a club or handheld junk sledge does that job more than well enough on it's own, so investing so many resources and levels into the stun baton is . . . questionable. Honestly, I often find myself just falling back to using the Fireaxe to 1-3 hit kill the zombies instead of whacking them with the stun baton and then having to chase them around while I ragdoll them around the room not doing damage.

My friend even asked me to stop using the stun baton because it just makes it harder to hit the zombies and keeps getting him beat up when he thinks a zombie is dead after seeing it thrown across the room and then it stands back up behind him and starts punching him XD

I don't want to use the club or sledge every playthrough but like, it's kind of hard not to when you can just kill the zombie instead of spending 10 minutes doing a Benny Hill skit where you chase the zombies around on a sheet of ice as it flies all over the house with you spanking it with your 1 damage electric fly swatter. I'd honestly say an unperked club is probably more useful than a fully perked and full build stun baton lol

 

[JCrook1028]

I will agree with that, Go into the school in the snow biome on navezgane, walk into gym, everyone's triggered.

or just open the door, stand there and stealth shot em one by one. When then come to you in that little room kill them and go call forth the next contestant. I learned that after the 1st time I did that POI. Did you not learn? Well now you know.

Which is what EVERYONE complains about, because you know, it's a problem.

When you say "everyone" you're almost always wrong.

 

[hiemfire]

I hope the designers will also rethink and make more natural (I don't know how) the auto-trigger rooms.

They're spoiling part of the fun for stealth players.

Not again! This was already discussed to death. Now I'm gonna say "Not all stealth players" and we get stuck in a time loop

Iirc @faatal has mentioned that they're looking at changing it from a straight up <the zombies in the volume know exactly where you are at the moment they activate so they rush you> to a rng die roll to see if they do or just go to wandering awake, adjusted by From the Shadows. I'm waiting to see how that pans out before I bring it back up. Attack volumes are still hyper slanted, unbalanced bull@%$#.

 

[hiemfire]

I will agree with that, Go into the school in the snow biome on navezgane, walk into gym, everyone's triggered.

There is a blue double door in the hallway wall that connects to the gym before you hook around to the lockers. One of them (if you aren't running a modified game, I now that DF sets allot of door that are normally unlocked in vanilla to locked) is unlocked and has a grate you can fire through. Iirc it is the left door. Last I knew you could clear most of the final room, barring everything spawning bleacher side, without tripping the activation threshold.

One thing right now with stealth, aside from the attack volumes, though this is very likely changing with the armor/clothing rework that they pushed to A21. Any armor that is heavier than padded, including leather and military, is a no go till you have them fully modded for moving silently and you're perked fully into light armor. Ignore any stat on the armor other than Noise until then. Allot of the places that feel like they are attack volumes aren't and are probably triggering off of the noise you're generating from "upgraded" gear.

 

[Roland]

That's super helpful thanks! I couldn't find much about it. Just for the record, I'm making a Youtube video about Alpha 20, are you fine with a screenshot of this being in the video?

Edit: also what is radiation actually going to do? (if we know) is it all going to just do health damage? or is it moreso like the infection where you get increasing amounts of poisoning with increasing debuffs?

I don’t know that radiation is going to be in A20. I was more talking about future plans and not necessarily plans for A20. 
 

we don’t know particulars about how radiation will affect us because it hasn’t been revealed. 

 

[lord_ahriman]

Delete

 

[ShellHead]

ATM the stun baton is fun but it honestly is essentially useless. It stuns enemies decently well, but a club or handheld junk sledge does that job more than well enough on it's own, so investing so many resources and levels into the stun baton is . . . questionable. Honestly, I often find myself just falling back to using the Fireaxe to 1-3 hit kill the zombies instead of whacking them with the stun baton and then having to chase them around while I ragdoll them around the room not doing damage.

Last i had heard the electrocution bonus was bugged so that the duration was stuck at 4 seconds when it should be 8 fully perked, which would give it more damage and be more useful against tougher zeds than the junk sledge. The baton is supposed to be more of a self-defense weapon than a zed killer but it does need a bit of tuning.

My friend even asked me to stop using the stun baton because it just makes it harder to hit the zombies and keeps getting him beat up when he thinks a zombie is dead after seeing it thrown across the room and then it stands back up behind him and starts punching him XD

They should make it a bit clearer whether a zed is dead or ragdolled, maybe just make zeds have an electric particle effect?

I don't want to use the club or sledge every playthrough but like, it's kind of hard not to when you can just kill the zombie instead of spending 10 minutes doing a Benny Hill skit where you chase the zombies around on a sheet of ice as it flies all over the house with you spanking it with your 1 damage electric fly swatter. I'd honestly say an unperked club is probably more useful than a fully perked and full build stun baton lol

The stun baton perk could use a bit of love tbf, though it’s far more meant to keep zeds away while the turret does its job. Clubs are pretty powerful at the moment and are completely focused on zed killing with no other features so they’re going to suit your needs better, but i think what would help solve this is a club nerf along with buffing the baton, knives, and spears.

 

[MechanicalLens]

I recently cleared the high school on day 1 and while there were a few trigger points, such as the army section and some of the hallways, it's not nearly as bad as described above. I was going stealth, so I would know. As for the roof, stick to the outside rim and frame up if you need to. The gymnasium was no problem at all. I simply peaked my head through and took shots at the zombies on by one. I got stealth attacks on all of them, including that POS feral biker.

 

[IzPrebuilt]

I don’t know that radiation is going to be in A20. I was more talking about future plans and not necessarily plans for A20. 
 

we don’t know particulars about how radiation will affect us because it hasn’t been revealed. 

That's all I needed to know, Just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing some info thanks.

 

[meganoth]

...

They should make it a bit clearer whether a zed is dead or ragdolled, maybe just make zeds have an electric particle effect?

....

This is like saying enemies in a WW2 shooter should always shout "TIMBER" and wave a flag before shooting at you, to prevent any surprises

 

[BFT2020]

I don't want to use the club or sledge every playthrough but like, it's kind of hard not to when you can just kill the zombie instead of spending 10 minutes doing a Benny Hill skit where you chase the zombies around on a sheet of ice as it flies all over the house with you spanking it with your 1 damage electric fly swatter. I'd honestly say an unperked club is probably more useful than a fully perked and full build stun baton lol

I think the only limiting factor is you.  I have done all melee weapons a lot with the exception of the spear and unarmed.  I really need to do those at some point but I keep getting distracted.  Blades are my favorite go to right now.  I have never felt like I had to use either the club or sledge to be effective.

Stun batons are great against ferals.  Had one rushing at me so I just started smacking it with my baton.  Getting the feral locked up / stun means you can keep hitting it, then zap it again.  Or if you got one in a bunch of zombies, whack the others to build up the charge and use the zap to stun the feral.  Makes crowd control a breeze at that point.

 

[Ladarian]

Doesn't really matter. That's not the point.

If TFP used your logic, they wouldn't have put ANY path in the "dungeon" POIs.

They place obstacles in the path so that whoever enjoys that type of "adventure" can play it like a dungeon.

No idea what you're talking about here, could you elaborate because it's really confusing.

Sorry but shooting your way through a wall with a shotgun to get to the loot room isn't an obstacle I need in my games.   The actual "dungeon pathing" I can live with if they make random gen random instead of the same houses everywhere.