PC 7DTD - Will it ever leave Early Access?

W

Wut

Refugee
With the huge influx of early access games all set to leave it and release massive content updates, it's finally time to recognize what this game really is. I started playing this game in Alpha 7 or 8; in 2014. It seemed very creative and was on the right track to becoming "THE" survival-pvp game.

Nearly four years later, the content and improvements don't outweigh the waiting. It's simply just not enough. This game has so many flaws, errors, bugs, hacks, abuses, and exploits, along with lag and no existing game servers, so we're forced to play on servers controlled by random people that are often heavily abused.

I don't believe this is the product people hoped for when they pledged on Kickstarter for this game in August 2013, or purchased it thereafter hoping one day for a finished product.

Please don't get me wrong; I have 2115 hours of 7 Days on Steam. I have gotten my money's worth. I just feel this game should have been so much more and at a much quicker pace. I feel that The Fun Pimps' vision was not matched with effort.

I'd like to hear how other long-time players of this game feel about the status of this game relative to other large early access games that have come and launched while this game stagnates.

 
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The game has tremendous scope and complexity so updates have required progressively more time. I think people would have been much less happy if the devs had stuck to their original vision and launched THAT version in May of 2014 as originally promised.

In the time before EVERY SINGLE update there are people like you who lose hope and predict that the game is going to die and yet each update has spiked higher in players than the previous one.

Sales are still strong. That means that among people with zero hours the game stil looks appealing fun and compelling enough to purchase. TFP can’t help it that someone with 2000+ hours might be feeling a bit burnt out. In fact, they would most likely put you in their win column for having captured your attention for so long before you decided to move on to another game.

My feeling is that many more people than ever before will return to check out the A17 update and if it is good or even if it has been several months since they’ve played they will get recaptured by the magic of this game.

Finally, the ones who complain the least about the length of time are those who are trying different mods because they make the game feel fresh and different. It’s like getting an update. That will be even more true once this game does leave early access and workshop support is added.

 
In its current state 7 Days to Die is very similar to other survival games:

* It has a lot of (unused) potential

* but no long-term motivation (apart from unmotivated base building and playing or creating mods)

* and the game becomes trivial once you've learned how the AI works

There's still a good chance that TFP will fix these weaknesses though...

 
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I keep looking at it this way. I paid to play the game and have had lots of fun doing exactly that. Each new version adds something to keep me playing and I expect A17 will add enough to keep me busy playing for a long time. I don't feel at all ripped off by the return on my investment in this game. That puts 7DTD in a small group of games on my Steam list of "would buy again". In fact I've easily spent more time playing 7DTD than all my other steam games combined.

So if they take 10 more years to release it I won't care. It's perfectly fun and playable at the moment and they keep adding to it to make it better. What's to complain about?

 
With the huge influx of early access games all set to leave it and release massive content updates, it's finally time to recognize what this game really is.
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I've seen many people saying the game will never leave Early Access and it's basically abandonware because of the updates frequency and how long the game is in developement but it's really not and will eventually come out of EA, since we're getting close to beta now apparently. They prefer releasing large updates once in a while rather than small ones all the time and tons of games took longer than 5 years to be completed.

 
So if they take 10 more years to release it I won't care. It's perfectly fun and playable at the moment and they keep adding to it to make it better. What's to complain about?
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This exactly.

Who cares whether they call it early access or neverending development like Minecraft?

Is it playable? Yes. My game RARELY crashes and though there are about a billion things that can be tweaked or optimized, most of those things are accessible by XML edit.

Is it fun? Hell yes. I take the occasional break to play other games, but I always end up circling back around to 7dtd. Even with ♥♥♥♥ty AI there are tons of ways to challenge yourself in a new random gen.

So what is there to complain about? The game is good and should get/has gotten better with each alpha update.

VIVA LA EARLY ACCESS!

 
Is it fun?
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Beyond considerations of quality, release dates and whatnot this is basically the ultimate question because it's the whole point of playing a game right. Sure the game is still broken, but did The Fun Pimps managed to pimp out a game that's indeed fun to play? My personal answer to this fundamental question is that I didn't have such a blast playing a game in years. I usually get bored of games rather quickly and carry on to the next one, but I'm never stopping to play 7 Days.

 
I don't see why so many players are so fixated on time. For the first time in game history we actually see how long game development really takes, especially the bigger the game and the smaller the development team. Programming takes a lot of time and if it isn't obvious, Hollywood is lying to you about that :smile-new:

7D2D also is one of the titles that uses voxels instead of the normal polygons any 3D-engine has routines for per default. Look around, there are a lot of voxel games in development/EA now, before that you could search with a magnifying glass. So lots of additional experimentation, making mistakes and getting experience.

Another thing I notice in your post: You said "becoming "THE" survival-pvp game". What an achievement for a game that was targeted as single-player/co-op. No wonder it didn't fullfill your expectations because the developers efforts went into a different direction. It is as if you wanted to go to Paris and boarded a train to Rome. CORRECTION: I see that in the kickstarter somewhere down in the list of features multiplayer (as a synonym for PvP) is mentioned. It still is only one of many features and genres that 7days wanted to include. Maybe too many, maybe a little too ambitious. But calling it "survival-pvp" is surely not a term this game could be summed up with.

Can't compare it with similar EA-games, because I don't play them. I have a friend who plays the dino game, from what I see a massive amount of grind, but I don't think it fair to judge it without really having played it.

Other EA games I actually play are not that comparable, for example Factorio. They also take their time, AFAIK Factorio started at somewhere the same time as 7D2D and will be released also nearly at the same time.

 
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In Q3 of 2018 it will be the 6th year of 7DTD's development.

It might be too long and the wait might not be really worth it (btw most of the community wanted to have less-content updates and get them more frequently, but developers don't like this idea), but it's not a typical game, where you just run and shoot.

There are not many games out there where devs can take inspirations from, so that's why it takes so much time. They add something, change few times and finally delete it cause they see that it simply doesn't work or don't like the idea.

And my opinion is that - the time might not really go well together with the content, but we will get an unique game, that differs a lot from others and I think this is what devs are trying to achieve. Will they try to get the most out of 7DTD's potential? I doubt, but time will tell.

 
It seemed very creative and was on the right track to becoming "THE" survival-pvp game.
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it's never intended to be a pvp game, madmole and others fun pimp said over and over the their primary focus would be on sp\co-op

pvp balance would be addressed when the game reaches beta or even post release

 
In Q3 of 2018 it will be the 6th year of 7DTD's development.
It might be too long and the wait might not be really worth it
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Worth what exactly? The cost of admission? People have already paid for the game and are presumably playing it. If someone picks it up for a few hours during each release cycle and then puts it away until the next one they're still getting more value out of this game than most "fully released" games out there. Most games you play, maybe beat, and then stop playing without ever likely picking it back up later to play through again. 7DTD was "worth it" at each alpha release (since I've started playing at least) let alone combining all of the experiences from all the releases.

 
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Can't compare it with similar EA-games, because I don't play them. I have a friend who plays the dino game, from what I see a massive amount of grind, but I don't think it fair to judge it without really having played it.
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Major complaints about ARK is it's still glitchy and has performance issues even now that it's released with a full price tag. I can only wish the same won't happen to 7 Days, but they still have a while to go and try to fix that. Once they finally get all the major features in then they can really focus on bug fixing in the last alpha and beta.

 
Worth what exactly? The cost of admission? People have already paid for the game and are presumably playing it. If someone picks it up for a few hours during each release cycle and then puts it away until the next one they're still getting more value out of this game than most "fully released" games out there. Most games you play, maybe beat, and then stop playing without ever likely picking it back up later to play through again. 7DTD was "worth it" at each alpha release (since I've started playing at least) let alone combining all of the experiences from all the releases.
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I already said what - content.

People paid for a full game in the future. This is sandbox - it's the type of game in which you should do whatever you simply want and you should spent a lot of time without getting bored. If it's 10 hours, 50, or 1000 it doesn't mean it's worth it, cause this is a type of game in which again - you are supposed to spent tons of hours.

That's why it is good to say, that you don't like this game after 2k hours of playtime - because you came to the point where the game has not really much to offer. I used to play Minecraft and I'm pretty sure I have over 2.5k hours of playtime there. And I didn't stop playing because it got me bored. I stopped playing because I achieved what I wanted. I felt accomplished. This is the point of sandbox.

 
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In Q3 of 2018 it will be the 6th year of 7DTD's development.
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In Q3 2018 it will begin its 6th year of development. We are currently in the fifth of development meaning it hasn't been in development for five years as of yet and won't have been in development for six years until Q3 of 2019. I only bring this up because the way you emphasized 6th year it seemed like you might have been correcting DeadMole when he said it has been five years of development. It hasn't quite been 5 years yet and it won't be correct to call it a full 6 years for another year and change.

I think for a game of this type anywhere from 5-7 years is acceptable particularly since gamers have been able to play the various iterations all along. As I've said, these types of threads always pop up and they're always about one player being burnt out on a game they've played for 1000's of hours as if such a thing were extraordinary and then projecting that feeling onto their misguided assumptions about the community at large.

1) Feeling burnt out about a game you've spent so much time on is typical, normal, and ordinary. It happens. It is not a failing of the devs or the game or the player.

2) The game is still going strong. It is not dying. The pattern that has happened many times will happen again. People who have taken a break from the game for six months or longer try it again and get hooked...again. It's even happening right now in the doldrums of pre-A17 release. People who haven't played since A12 or A13 are returning to play A16 and are loving it. I deal with these people at the help desk daily. I say this so you know that when I say this it isn't just my circle of friends I'm referencing.

 
I have been playing this game on and off since Alpha 8. I love it. Yes, there have been things along the way that I hated or still hate, but so does pretty much every game I've ever played. The things I like about the game out weight the *bleah* things I don't like.

And how can anyone seriously believe this is abandonware in any form? MM post regular videos. The forums are constantly active. People in the know like Roland are engaging the community daily. Mod development is ongoing in a really rich ecosphere.

I am looking forward to Alpha 17, not because it is another step towards a final product, but because it is another step forward period. I may hate it, or many parts of it. I don't know yet. But I am going to play it, and anything that comes after it. Maybe it will be one of those Alphas that causes me to take a break for a few months. Maybe it will be one of those Alphas were it soaks up all of my free time. Don't know, don't really care. I will see wait happens and trust in the Pimps' vision.

 
In Q3 2018 it will begin its 6th year of development. We are currently in the fifth of development meaning it hasn't been in development for five years as of yet and won't have been in development for six years until Q3 of 2019. I only bring this up because the way you emphasized 6th year it seemed like you might have been correcting DeadMole when he said it has been five years of development. It hasn't quite been 5 years yet and it won't be correct to call it a full 6 years for another year and change.
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https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/7daystodie/7-days-to-die-zombie-survival-game This is from about June-July 2013, right? It clearly says "The game has been in development for only 7 months with 2 full time guys and 3 part time guys.". Yeah, I made a mistake, not Q3 but Q4 of 2012. So the 6th year will be in Q4 of 2018. I don't know how you got that "Q3 of 2019".

 
Been playing since the Pre-Alpha, and as a big zombie fan I confess it's the best zombie game I've ever played. There are one or two things I dislike and that I would definitely change if I were the devs, but since I'm the player I tweak them with small modifications instead. I gotta say the devs have been very slow in the delivery of A16 and now A17 as well, but I still enjoyed A16 and think it was worth waiting for it; And I'm sure it will be the same with A17 for me, even though I understand those who are upset.

I believe the devs have so far stayed truthful to the project they presented in their kickstarter, achieving things I never actually knew they were going to achieve when I pledged for it, and I remain confident they still are on the right track.

Now, I must say I'm an SP only player, so I can't really speak of MP. However, this game was never really intended to be mainly focused on MP exclusively, much less PVP, and this is something the devs made clear from the moment they released their KS. Therefore, I don't believe it's fair to say this isn't the game they promised based on the state of the MP aspect of the game.

As for bugs and errors, I know this is cliche, but it is still an early access game with many updates pending. Obviously, waiting is our only choice in the matter, but my conclusion is that despite these facts the game remains as one of my favorite ones.

 
I already said what - content. People paid for a full game in the future. This is sandbox - it's the type of game in which you should do whatever you simply want and you should spent a lot of time without getting bored. If it's 10 hours, 50, or 1000 it doesn't mean it's worth it, cause this is a type of game in which again - you are supposed to spent tons of hours.

That's why it is good to say, that you don't like this game after 2k hours of playtime - because you came to the point where the game has not really much to offer. I used to play Minecraft and I'm pretty sure I have over 2.5k hours of playtime there. And I didn't stop playing because it got me bored. I stopped playing because I achieved what I wanted. I felt accomplished. This is the point of sandbox.
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I don't necessarily agree or disagree with everything else you're saying but it makes me chuckle every time someone says "This is a sandbox game" and just leaves it at that, like that's all that it is.

The base game has aspects of a lot of different genres but it's not fully a "sandbox" game but has aspects of it.

They do offer a sandbox version of the game though, It's called "creative mode". You can still play the base game but get to do/get/have everything at your disposal without all the rules that the base game has.

 
I'd like to hear how other long-time players of this game feel about the status of this game relative to other large early access games that have come and launched while this game stagnates.
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I addressed the timing conversation in the other reply.

I disagree with your sentiment and idea this was meant to be a Survival-PVP game.

4 years later and I think the game has certainly been worth the wait. I've received several unique and playable versions that in most other developers camps would have sequels or annualized releases like many AAA studios pull.

You're right, the game is not what I hoped when I first saw it. In continues to exceed my expectations with each version.

2115 hours of play, all on the same version? Or was there effort that provided that additional play value over the time you've owned the title?

As a long time player I feel I have gotten more than my monies worth, and far better gameplay, changes over time, and new games/versions that play uniquely than any other title I've ever purchased. By far this game has outclassed ever other Early Access, Alpha, Beta, and Full Release title I have ever owned including those of AAA studios.

 
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