4.0 A new threat update - Bandits?

Bandits were never implemented. They were in the game and could be spawned in debug mode, but were not part of an active spawning group. They also caused an error if you shot or melee’d them.
Argh yes i remember now you are correct but we were still able to spawn them via console and i later did a mod to add them via a mod. But we are still in alpha and as one other said bandits are a kickstarter so they will be in the game..
 
Wouldn't it be fair to say that AFTER TFP announced that Bandits were going to be introduced (in 2016), that PEOPLE had every right to expect them to be working, and IN GAME looooooooooong before this? TFP can only blame themselves for their communication skills. FFS "we" are getting the sandbox update BEFORE Bandits because they finally responded to the people who demanded they add back most of the stuff they have deleted over several years of development.

The Sandbox Update is, in itself, proof the game has not been a scam. A scam would not have spent years, still developing, still adding POI's.

What does cause me pause, is their sale of this company, it likely began before the relaunch to console.
 
The Sandbox Update is, in itself, proof the game has not been a scam. A scam would not have spent years, still developing, still adding POI's.
The reason why they were called so, is because after release of A17 they began adding sh.t players never asked for and removed a lot of nice stuff, players would have wanted to remain at that time! Who's at fault? easy, who does the development? there's the answer
But instead of admitting their mistakes, they chosed to blame and gaslight community in their town hall stream like its all the community's fault that they delay bandits again! A lot of legacy gamers gave up already by A17
 
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The reason why they were called so, is because after release of A17 they began adding sh.t most players never asked for and removed a lot of nice stuff, most players would have wanted to remain at that time! Who's at fault? easy, who does the development? there's the answer
But instead of admitting their mistakes, they chosed to blame and gaslight community in their town hall stream like its all the community's fault that they delay bandits again!
That's where it falls apart as an argument. I completely understand the frustration...but, it is misspoken. which allows the defenders room to nitpick. TFP have continued to work on the game...doesn't matter if "we" don't like what they did with it, therefore it was not a scam. sorry, but, that is true.

imo PC gamers really have no valid complaint about the current state of the game.

a console gamer, imo, has every right to put two and two together and add it up to: they re-launched the game to console prematurely, when they did, because it upped the value of their sale. To me it looks like they used us and hoped they'd be able to code fast enough to keep the backlash to a minimum.
 
imo PC gamers really have no valid complaint about the current state of the game.
Mods basicly saved pc version of the game and helped us avoid horrible vanilla
a console gamer, imo, has every right to put two and two together and add it up to: they re-launched the game to console prematurely, when they did, because it upped the value of their sale. To me it looks like they used us and hoped they'd be able to code fast enough to keep the backlash to a minimum.
But console players sadly dont have access to mods which forces them to play same boring vanilla over and over again
 
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Mods basicly saved pc version of the game
lol...I agree with you, but, we both know that there will be people saying "most people don't play Modded content". I think that is a ridiculous statement. Do they mean that the people who walked away from the game do not engage with modded content? because THAT would make their statement their favorite kind of correct...technically correct...technically not lying.

The other thing that kept this game going is the popularity of the Jawoodle's of the world...the Neeb's crew hilarity. TFP engaged with them and it kept sales going...kept the popularity relevant. I watched those guys because I still wanted to see what was going on with the game for all the years console was shut out...and it did look like the developers were still engaged with the "community".
and helped us avoid horrible vanilla

But console players sadly dont have access to mods which forces them to play same boring vanilla over and over again
IMO the vanilla game is not horrible. Yes, there a quality of life things that would be nice in vanilla, but, having never had them...I can live without...it just would be nice. The road map roll out has been horrible, but, that's a different convo. lol.

There are still far too many PC users who think the answer to console concerns about vanilla is "get a PC".
 
a console gamer, imo, has every right to put two and two together and add it up to: they re-launched the game to console prematurely, when they did, because it upped the value of their sale. To me it looks like they used us and hoped they'd be able to code fast enough to keep the backlash to a minimum.
For The Fun Pimps, the decision to sell came after co-founders Richard and Joel Huenink considered options for growing the company. The studio has grown from two people to 70 and has taken no outside investment.

"We've entertained the idea of potentially selling, merging, or looking for investment," Richard Huenink explains. "Our success has allowed us to be selective in that process. Over this last year, we've had quite a few suitors interested in us. But the selection wasn't necessarily about the pure financials. It was a good fit. We're partnering with somebody who's invested in what we're doing. They see our vision, and they want to help us get there." -- 'Dead by Daylight maker Behaviour has bought the studio behind 7 Days to Die to create "a portfolio of horror IP"'
Sounds to me like the Hueninks are believers in the infinite growth on a finite planet paradigm as is pretty much every other business leader at this point thanks to neoliberalism, the ideology that underpins the entire global economy. It's not capitalism, per se; it's not natural; it's nothing it purports to be; yet it is. Most people think of it as "just the way things are" and "there is no alternative." Well, it may be just the way things are now (and since 1980), but the "no alternative" part came straight from the lips of Margaret Thatcher.

As long as we're speculating, I'd sincerely question the "they want to help us get there" part if TFP hadn't already been headed in the same direction as Behavior. I despise the turn TFP's business model has taken. I could get behind the old school business model on display through A21. I can't get behind this one. I'm sure they don't care. Why would they care? But the change in business model has little to do with the game itself at this point. Were TFP and Behavior to charge extra for bandits, story, etc., that would be a phenomenally horrible decision that would cost them more in community goodwill than its worth financially, imo, but they've both said those features will go ahead as planned, presumably at no extra charge. They'll be added, then Behavior will take a more active role d(as has been said), I suspect, in turning 7DTD into a MTX nightmare replete with in-game store as opposed to an out of game store.

That's just the direction I see it headed in logically because that's the underpinning logic of Neoliberalism. Fortunately, there's more to human beings than logic or reason, however. We also possess the qualities of common sense, creativity, ethics, intuition and memory. Hopefully, those will play a part going forward as well, but considering Urizen rules the socioeconomic order of the day, I wouldn't count on it.

I'm sorry you feel used, but don't imagine you speak for all console players in always assuming the worst of TFP. Neoliberalism is the logic behind everything they've done on the business end. I wouldn't take it personally myself. Taking it personally leads to emotionality which leads to reactivity as opposed to response. All the character assasination of the Hueninks and accusations of illegality on the part of a portion of the community is unwarranted, imo. They've obviously done nothing illegal. Whether some things the industry at large is doing should be illegal or not is an open question the public has yet to determine. The Stop Killing Games testimony that recently took place in Europe may help determine what is considered illegal and/or "anti-consumer" on the part of the video game industry in the future. That, however, doesn't even touch on predatory business models ripped straight out of the playbook of the FTP mobile gambling/gaming space, but only the preservation of online video games.

This is bigger than TFP or Behavior or the 7DTD community, iow. It's part and parcel of how the games industry, as every other, operates today and, from a spiritual perspective, they "operate according to their own logic and motivations," quite apart from the motivations of the people who serve them -- artists, level designers, computer programmers, etc. in the case of the games industry. That's why I pay no attention to those who blame "the devs" for everything patently unhealthy about the industry. It's a worldview and paradigm that's in question.
 
I think they stated the delay was due to the efforts put into survival revival and what's coming in the new 3.0. Personally I would love to see bandits but I want them to fix what we have now first. Post 2.0 the game was lackluster and we got the developer feedback we wanted.

While unfortunate, I understand and largely appreciate the changes they have made thus far.
 
Sounds to me like the Hueninks are believers in the infinite growth on a finite planet paradigm as is pretty much every other business leader at this point thanks to neoliberalism, the ideology that underpins the entire global economy. It's not capitalism, per se; it's not natural; it's nothing it purports to be; yet it is. Most people think of it as "just the way things are" and "there is no alternative." Well, it may be just the way things are now (and since 1980), but the "no alternative" part came straight from the lips of Margaret Thatcher.

As long as we're speculating, I'd sincerely question the "they want to help us get there" part if TFP hadn't already been headed in the same direction as Behavior. I despise the turn TFP's business model has taken. I could get behind the old school business model on display through A21. I can't get behind this one. I'm sure they don't care. Why would they care? But the change in business model has little to do with the game itself at this point. Were TFP and Behavior to charge extra for bandits, story, etc., that would be a phenomenally horrible decision that would cost them more in community goodwill than its worth financially, imo, but they've both said those features will go ahead as planned, presumably at no extra charge. They'll be added, then Behavior will take a more active role d(as has been said), I suspect, in turning 7DTD into a MTX nightmare replete with in-game store as opposed to an out of game store.

That's just the direction I see it headed in logically because that's the underpinning logic of Neoliberalism. Fortunately, there's more to human beings than logic or reason, however. We also possess the qualities of common sense, creativity, ethics, intuition and memory. Hopefully, those will play a part going forward as well, but considering Urizen rules the socioeconomic order of the day, I wouldn't count on it.

I'm sorry you feel used, but don't imagine you speak for all console players in always assuming the worst of TFP. Neoliberalism is the logic behind everything they've done on the business end. I wouldn't take it personally myself. Taking it personally leads to emotionality which leads to reactivity as opposed to response. All the character assasination of the Hueninks and accusations of illegality on the part of a portion of the community is unwarranted, imo. They've obviously done nothing illegal. Whether some things the industry at large is doing should be illegal or not is an open question the public has yet to determine. The Stop Killing Games testimony that recently took place in Europe may help determine what is considered illegal and/or "anti-consumer" on the part of the video game industry in the future. That, however, doesn't even touch on predatory business models ripped straight out of the playbook of the FTP mobile gambling/gaming space, but only the preservation of online video games.

This is bigger than TFP or Behavior or the 7DTD community, iow. It's part and parcel of how the games industry, as every other, operates today and, from a spiritual perspective, they "operate according to their own logic and motivations," quite apart from the motivations of the people who serve them -- artists, level designers, computer programmers, etc. in the case of the games industry. That's why I pay no attention to those who blame "the devs" for everything patently unhealthy about the industry. It's a worldview and paradigm that's in question.
any chance you would boil this down to a more pointed response?
 
No matter how much they scammed the community, there are still people left who defend them no matter what ))
Scammed the community? You sound like an overbearing mother at a parent teacher conference for real. This game was $15 US forever and ever and ever. For the amount of mileage and number of different versions all of these people have released from A16-17 to now, and you feel somehow scammed.
 
any chance you would boil this down to a more pointed response?
In this case, seems to be part "don't blame the player, blame the game" to shift responsibility away from TFP; while in part also judging TFP for the business practices. A mess of ideas with no coherent conclusion, just trying to touch on everything in that particular line of thinking.

TFP's actions are their own, though. If they'd hate the idea of selling DLC, they wouldn't. "Because someone else will" isn't an excuse, especially here in the case of an IP product. You don't need to earn more than the next guy, just enough to keep living your life ;)
 
any chance you would boil this down to a more pointed response?
It's how the games industry is trending: toward games as a service and away from games as completed products. Nearly everything from games to books to TV shows to movies to... have moved to an online distribution model that ensures "consumers" will own nothing, but only rent and/or subscribe to everything intangible and the private sector will own everything. Neoliberalism and the so-called digital revolution is behind it. Is that pointed enough?
 
It's how the games industry is trending: toward games as a service and away from games as completed products. Nearly everything from games to books to TV shows to movies to... have moved to an online distribution model that ensures "consumers" will own nothing, but only rent and/or subscribe to everything intangible and the private sector will own everything. Neoliberalism and the so-called digital revolution is behind it. Is that pointed enough?
thank you
and yes, for me...it was pointed enough. Sorry, but, no sense in using 100 words when 3 get to the point, but, that's just my opinion.

Sure...some companies are trying to follow the live service game model, just as some are running away from it. a game can "die" having never been "finished", pretty quickly, following that model. Common refrain is that They "all" are trying to extract as much profit as they can. Which, to me, means quality is not really the goal...profits are. Just more en■■■■ification by the suits of the world. our moms might say just because one does it, doesn't excuse "everyone" doing the same thing. lol

the idea that consumers are being asked to accept "owning nothing" is one we have discussed before...it is a goal of big tech companies. How far down the road it is...will consumers reject it? we are still living through it...hard to tell how things will play out in the short, middle, and long term. You are right to keep it in mind. imo.
 
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