I don't see any need for weapon crafting anymore with the combiner and these new weapons

[ElCabong]

I looted a starred purple primitive bow that I believe I have combined twice with other starred primitive bows that does more damage than a level two iron crossbow. My 9 mm is similar though not quite that bad. I made a quality level two hunters rifle and scrapped it for parts when I loted a quality level 6 starred pipe rifle.

By the time I'm able to craft something better than what I have looted, I'm probably going to loot something better than what I can make.

I'm playing on the default difficulty and I didn't change any of the loot settings.

I don't know if this works but if I can combine the 9 millimeter I have now with a higher quality level gun that has more slots, do I get the extra slots? Will the looted item I have gain a level and retain the damage? I can see a reason to make new weapons then.

Of course the loot fairy can be fickle and I might wind up making a weapon.

 

[Uncle Al]

I'm playing a run with noticeable permanent degradation (10% on repair, 25% on death) and crafting is vital there in order to have working equipment.

Crafting level is also valuable because you can combine your high quality level crafted items with lower level looted stuff with great stars to get much more powerful items.

I really like the way the new systems interact: It makes both crafting and looting valuable, while degradation makes a constant supp[ly of weapon and tool parts valuable because effectively repairing permananent degradation requires parts.

 

[Kyoji]

Even with degradation I think the bonuses need to be far more minimal. Instead of percentages they need to be flat value increases so instead of 27 DPS it should be 30 DPS, not 35 DPS or more as an example.

The values should be such that you get some benefit but they are not over the top. It might be alright to increase the value spread as you go up the tiers such that tier 6 variation is more noticeable and desirable than lets say tier 0 or 1.

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

I will still craft them rather then relying on luck tbh. Too often that i am not lucky with looting my favorite weapon/armor.

 

[Scyris]

I'm playing a run with noticeable permanent degradation (10% on repair, 25% on death) and crafting is vital there in order to have working equipment.

Crafting level is also valuable because you can combine your high quality level crafted items with lower level looted stuff with great stars to get much more powerful items.

I really like the way the new systems interact: It makes both crafting and looting valuable, while degradation makes a constant supp[ly of weapon and tool parts valuable because effectively repairing permananent degradation requires parts.

I had mine set to 20% degradation on repair. Really makes you rethink alot of the ways you do things when you can't just use a repair kit on that rare weapon you found yet cannot craft. I love this new system 3.0 is the first 7dtd update I been excited for and had fun with in a very long time. Primitive weapons for example now get some extended use. I've found a wooden club with +62.5% damage on it. At t6 wooden club it had the stats of about a t2-3 steel club. This also makes progression smoother, as the zombies at feral and up honestly have always had too much health imo, and this evens the playing field a fair bit.

It DOES make the early game alot easier though like if you find a primitive weapon of your choices with a +50% or more damage bonus, That will last you a long time, it does balance out later on though once the higher hp zombies start coming in. Assuming rngesus decides to bless you like that anyway. I've had runs where I couldn't find any melee weapon of choice with a good damage bonus so I ended up having to just craft a baseball bat, which kinda confused me, as it was only 0.4 damage higher than my wooden club, yet somehow did 12 more dmg a hit on headshots. Starting to think 7dtd ignores the number after the decimal.

 

[bdubyah]

It seems to common to find items with bonuses. The xml has it at what seems to be a 30% chance to roll one with bonuses, but it seems higher in game to me. I also don't think primitive items should even get them at all.

 

[Scyris]

It seems to common to find items with bonuses. The xml has it at what seems to be a 30% chance to roll one with bonuses, but it seems higher in game to me. I also don't think primitive items should even get them at all.

Every item has stat bonuses when found in loot, the bonuses the 30% refers to I think is the chance for a stat to have a Star which means it has a much higher than normal stat bonus. Or a 30% chance to roll for stars on each stat on the item. I say leave them on primitive items, it makes them actually viable a tad longer.

 

[bdubyah]

Every item has stat bonuses when found in loot, the bonuses the 30% refers to I think is the chance for a stat to have a Star which means it has a much higher than normal stat bonus. Or a 30% chance to roll for stars on each stat on the item. I say leave them on primitive items, it makes them actually viable a tad longer.

It's 30% to roll the bonus per stat. Just seems to happen too often.

The issue with the current bonuses is we are right back where we were before with items of a lower tier being able to clear the next tier up. A wooden club can now clear all but the higher levels of a bat, and is almost equal to a Q1 steel club. Add in how common these bonuses are currently, and the ease of combining them together and it's just a bit much to me.

 

[Kyoji]

It's 30% to roll the bonus per stat. Just seems to happen too often.

The issue with the current bonuses is we are right back where we were before with items of a lower tier being able to clear the next tier up. A wooden club can now clear all but the higher levels of a bat, and is almost equal to a Q1 steel club. Add in how common these bonuses are currently, and the ease of combining them together and it's just a bit much to me.

Agreed. The concept is good but needs tweaking. The percentage chance of getting one at 30% is a bit high. I think between 7-15% would be better.

For me I think 7% or 10% at most would be ideal.

The bonuses are also far too strong. The values need to be capped more per tier where you should only find a larger disparity at tier 6. Until then the percentages should be lower and gradually increase as the tiers increase.

Perhaps something like up to 10%, 15%, 20%, 25% for t1-4

 

[Maxil20]

The issue with the current bonuses is we are right back where we were before with items of a lower tier being able to clear the next tier up. A wooden club can now clear all but the higher levels of a bat, and is almost equal to a Q1 steel club.

I feel the problem with this argument is it assumes that higher tier items will never get the boosted stats of lower tier items, but that's simply not the case. Even mild stat boosts will overpower high stat boost low tier items, and they get demolished if you do roll said high stats on those high tier items. My current playthrough (at day 22 ATM) showcases it well enough, I feel:

For the first 2 weeks I intentionally limited myself to primitive tech and ended up forging quite the Godclub tm from the dozens of clubs I found from loot. As you might imagine, it turned out pretty powerful!



However, toward the end of those two weeks, I started finding low quality stat boosted bats. Thanks to my crafting skill, I ended up crafting a quality 6 bat and funneled those stats into my new bat, and it easily outperformed this outside of the stamina cost (which, given the extra damage, more than made up for it). I then continued to loot higher and more powerful bats as I was exploring the burnt forest, and funneled all of those into a Godbat tm. This is the culmination of those results on day 22:



A similar argument can be made for my firearms, which I feel also get a much more noteworthy mention. Even a high rolled pipe pistol will get destroyed by a low quality pistol in every aspect that isn't damage (better range, a much higher ammo capacity, and a far more favorable reload).

I personally like this a lot because it encourages you to stay on your tech tier and not instantly rush maxed out crafting to forge quality 6 tier 3 items by the end of day ~28 and never touch looted items for the rest of the game. I still feel it's superior to looting before your loot stage catches up just from the sheer potential of kitted out tier 3 items even without the boosts, but you're not so astronomically off of the curve that it makes no sense to not rush for these items.

I will say I do think it is a little strange that for an update that focuses on customization that you can't tweak these values, admittedly. I do think it would be nice for players who would prefer for boosts to be lower/more rare or even disable them entirely to have these options, especially because it does make the game curve significantly easier (I do like this, as it again makes me feel like I don't need to rush through tiers to have a fighting chance in higher tiered POIs in more difficult biomes, but I can totally see how that's not for everyone). I think that's totally fair for people to want to have that.

 

[bdubyah]

I feel the problem with this argument is it assumes that higher tier items will never get the boosted stats of lower tier items, but that's simply not the case.

I'm well aware all items get it. That doesn't change the fact that it's too much, too often. They are undoing the changes they made to fix a problem they made before. Lower chance to roll a bonus, lower max bonuses and it's fine. As is, it's too much.

 

[7DaysToDieEnjoyer]

Maybe add they could add a separate abundance option for weapons with a star and separate them from the general loot abundance setting and the categories they belong to.

 

[zztong]

Gadzooks, I do NOT want higher block damage with my clubs. I'd like to be able to LOWER that.

If I'm hitting a block with my club it is probably because I missed what I was aiming at. I do not want to destroy loot or my own base.

 

[Scyris]

Gadzooks, I do NOT want higher block damage with my clubs. I'd like to be able to LOWER that.

If I'm hitting a block with my club it is probably because I missed what I was aiming at. I do not want to destroy loot or my own base.

We should be glad shotguns don't have it. least with melee if you hit the block thats your fault, but shotguns with their buckshot spread? usually after a horde night if I am fighting near the ground I have a big hole in the ground I end up needing to fill back up from stray pellets. 58 block damage though is not enough to destroy anything in a single hit though as most items have at least 100 hp, other than say glass windows, pictures etc that are 1 tapped by anything. Though it is pretty silly why they would put that as a rollable stat on melee weapons, on the tools it makes sense as thats the job they are for, but on weapons... Oh man imagine a steel sledgehammer with that bonus. I guess it'd be a REAL problem if that can be on sledgehammers. But on other weapons its fine.

Post automatically merged: Sunday at 6:10 PM

Agreed. The concept is good but needs tweaking. The percentage chance of getting one at 30% is a bit high. I think between 7-15% would be better.

For me I think 7% or 10% at most would be ideal.

The bonuses are also far too strong. The values need to be capped more per tier where you should only find a larger disparity at tier 6. Until then the percentages should be lower and gradually increase as the tiers increase.

Perhaps something like up to 10%, 15%, 20%, 25% for t1-4

Add to sandbox options. Max stat cap per stat, starred drop chance. EVERY looted item comes with some bonus stats though you can hold shift to see them with the item clicked on in your inventory. usually its 9% or less, but looted anything is better than crafted, since you can fuse it with the higher tier crafted item to transfer the stats over.

 

[Scyris]

I feel the problem with this argument is it assumes that higher tier items will never get the boosted stats of lower tier items, but that's simply not the case. Even mild stat boosts will overpower high stat boost low tier items, and they get demolished if you do roll said high stats on those high tier items. My current playthrough (at day 22 ATM) showcases it well enough, I feel:

For the first 2 weeks I intentionally limited myself to primitive tech and ended up forging quite the Godclub tm from the dozens of clubs I found from loot. As you might imagine, it turned out pretty powerful!

View attachment 39598

However, toward the end of those two weeks, I started finding low quality stat boosted bats. Thanks to my crafting skill, I ended up crafting a quality 6 bat and funneled those stats into my new bat, and it easily outperformed this outside of the stamina cost (which, given the extra damage, more than made up for it). I then continued to loot higher and more powerful bats as I was exploring the burnt forest, and funneled all of those into a Godbat tm. This is the culmination of those results on day 22:

View attachment 39599

A similar argument can be made for my firearms, which I feel also get a much more noteworthy mention. Even a high rolled pipe pistol will get destroyed by a low quality pistol in every aspect that isn't damage (better range, a much higher ammo capacity, and a far more favorable reload).

I personally like this a lot because it encourages you to stay on your tech tier and not instantly rush maxed out crafting to forge quality 6 tier 3 items by the end of day ~28 and never touch looted items for the rest of the game. I still feel it's superior to looting before your loot stage catches up just from the sheer potential of kitted out tier 3 items even without the boosts, but you're not so astronomically off of the curve that it makes no sense to not rush for these items.

I will say I do think it is a little strange that for an update that focuses on customization that you can't tweak these values, admittedly. I do think it would be nice for players who would prefer for boosts to be lower/more rare or even disable them entirely to have these options, especially because it does make the game curve significantly easier (I do like this, as it again makes me feel like I don't need to rush through tiers to have a fighting chance in higher tiered POIs in more difficult biomes, but I can totally see how that's not for everyone). I think that's totally fair for people to want to have that.

I really like this system as well as it adds a decently deep extra layer of progression, as being able to craft t6 is no longer the end all be all, now you need to find copies in loot to fuse into that t6, I'd like to see it on armor as well, where it can get a armor bonus, a movement speed reduction bonus, durability bonus, and noise increase reduction bonus. Stam regen decrease whilg moving reduction bonus. Though that might make heavy armor the be all end all if you can with perks and such basically nullify its downsides. Granted I always felt armor in 7dtd was stupid with the way it is setup, as your not supposed to tank hits, so having high armor really is not that great of a benefit, as you are just going to end up with every status condition in the book in 1 fight. I follow a speed is life thing in 7dtd, I never use heavy armor, slows you down way to much to be worth it. Medium armor is where its at, can basically nullify the mobility penalty via perks+mods. Do wish you could nullify the stam regen penalty while moving though, that part of armor has always annoyed me.

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

So i already crafted weapons. Because loot didn´t give me ■■■■. I mean it did give me weapons just not the ones i use...

 

[grz__]

I haven't played enough to test the entire new weapon stats system everything is subject to balancing but I don't see a problem with a Tier 6 stone sledge hammer with a bonus being superior to a base Tier 1 or 2 iron sledge, I’m really making use of primitive weapons. Plus, with the degradation system, you need new supplies of weapons and items. Some drawbacks like making the early game too easy can be addressed using some of the new and old options: reducing player damage, very high zombie density, smell sprint, nightmare ferals, etc. It’s satisfying that zombies aren’t just bullet/hit sponges there just need to be more zombies and more dangers. I don’t know if there will be any overpowered weapons that break the game I haven’t played enough yet.

I also like that the best weapons with bonuses can only be obtained by looting or trading (if you use a trader) and not by crafting them, which keeps looting exciting at all times.

 

[8_Hussars]

There is a setting for max weapon crafting level and max weapon looting level. Changing those would impact weapon crafting feasibility.

The system is not balanced for every eventuality...

 

[Javabean867]

the benefit to crafting is if you can't find the gear you need in loot. The secondary benefit is that you can make your 1uality 6 gear, and combine it with all the cool bonus items to make a super weapon.

I just did that with a stone shovel. its crazy how good it is. I kind of feel that with this new system they should make the differences even greater between the tiers of tools.

 

[aceguy7]

I feel the new magnitude system is too OP needs more balance?....Day 2 i used the combine bench to upgrade my axe and well i cant remember the stats but man it was way too powerful for early game. Maybe more sandbox options to tweak this? Otherwise I love the new system.