I know everyone knows the issues in this video but I’ll put it here anyways…
JaWoodle Video "What's Happening with 7 Days to Die?"
- Thread starter ProlificPoultry
- Start date
And why should we then see that video? Are the issues more important now because some guy who makes videos all the time made a video?
Or is this some reference to a higher authority? Why is that youtuber a higher authority?
Or is he just more entertaining? Does a discussion need entertainment instead of well-thought out arguments?
ProlificPoultry
Refugee
This was a well thought out summation of the state of the game. That’s why. And I’m not making anyone do anything. Watch it, don’t watch it doesn’t really matter however you immediately jumped into defense mode on a dime as soon as I posted. :/
And you know what? Sure, in case anyone knows this guy but can’t accurately gauge where the game is that then maybe they ought to check this out since the thing that speaks the loudest gets the most attention.
In the first 35 seconds of the video, the guy talks about how he's been making videos for 10 years and whether it's going to be related to the film or not. I didn't watch any further.
If you want to be heard, then formulate the problem. Otherwise, no one cares how much of what you're filming or what your cat's name is.
Riamus
Hunter
I don't ever watch people's YouTube videos reviewing games. People make those videos to get views, so they are going to sensationalize and exaggerate everything to get more people to watch. In most cases, that results in a wildly misleading review. I haven't watched that video and I won't, but I have a feeling it's the same. And even if it isn't, it would still be just one person's opinion. I can see people's opinions just fine on the forum without listening to people talking about it on YouTube. 
LittleNightma
Scavenger
What's Happening with 7 Days to Die? I'll tell you what's happening. They took away my gothic pants, a storm blew my house away, and a Plague Spitter stole my cadillac converter!
Oh, this is just my frustration speaking that youtubers have such a power of influencing public opinion. It gets more and more common for people to not speak their minds anymore but just refer to some youtuber or post what some AI thinks. Call me old-fashioned but I don't like that direction
YourMirror
Survivor
Its even worse, they dont HAVE an opinion of themselves anymore. Completely led by an army of people that get payed for views. Example: look up the complaint of the user that "addresses" an suspected ad ingame. Came directly from his God youtuber. And suddenly its an opinion of his own. Scary shizzle.
zztong
Hunter
You're old-fashioned.
No, I get what you mean. I hate that corporations can spend lots of money to buy a soapbox to use to influence voters, but that's the world in which we in the USA live. I can somewhat resent (or be jealous of) JW for using his soapbox to document his opinion because I don't also have a soapbox of that size from which to speak and however many followers he has. (As a good friend of mine says, "that's a 'me' problem.")Seeing he has 2.4k likes on 5.2k views (as of the time I looked) for that video is useful information. It isn't the most reliable and telling form of data, but pretty much nothing visible to me is collecting any data about customer feelings.
I can somewhat understand that you'd prefer everyone to express their own opinion and that you fear a "pied piper" effect. That isn't very practical.
We know that those here, on Steam, on Reddit are a vocal minority and that most players don't bother with any discussion. If we could convince millions of people to post their own original opinions here, it would be a massive undertaking to compile the results.
I wonder, has TFP ever thought to include a survey and make it available on the game's News screen?
A lot of what he, other youtubers, commenters on the forums, reddit and steam have all pointed out. I got to say he is cooking a bit.
Now before you get all rage mode defensive and want to critique everything let me just say that I also don't agree with everything he said. I don't assume TFP made the changes just for the new DLC and want to think TFP have the best intentions with things.
My point of this thread isn't to point out what TFP are doing wrong, instead to use it as a timelapse to see what we have lost and what we should push to get back. Not all of the things you may agree with, for example, I personally hated gore blocks and I think zombie AI is a good thing for a compelling game.
A few things pointed out - Steam analytics. The current trend of RPG > Sandbox is proving to be less appealing to players generally speaking. A lot of the feedback I have seen here and elsewhere revolves around removing sandbox/survival elements to which I was sold on when I bought the game.
Things I would like to see returned/modified in some way
- Temperature debuffs like heatstroke and hypothermia. Combine this with snow back in the forest biome. You can always tweak the settings to be more or less punishing based on feedback, but generally some ramifications for being cold/hot would be nice other than thirst/hunger.
- For those unknowing it was a progressive system (Heatstroke Level 1/Level 2) that would provide debuffs to your character such as hunger/thirst consumption debuffs as well as stamina debuffs and when left unchecked would progress to level 2 which would impact speed and health. - Summary from wiki - Wetness effecting insulation would be nice as well. The thought that rain would make you colder is a reasonable concept. Again you can tweak how frequent rain happens and add items to mitigate them to a degree but I enjoyed the realism and balance provided when going out.
- For those unknowing it impacted your ability to stay warm which could lead to things like being cold which could have character stamina penalties, etc. - Summary from wiki - Weapon part quality. It would be nice to have weapons broken down into parts again and able to be modified to gain better stats using higher grade parts. It gives players something to work towards. Some have asked for degradation associated with it, but for my recommendation I think just the parts quality is enough for it to be in it's own category.
- For those unknowing your weapon would have several parts that could be exchanged that would range from common to legendary and each part would provide a bonus for example a common might be +2% damage while legendary would be +10% (don't recall the specifics). This means you could cannibalize weapons found for their parts to make an all legendary weapon that did more damage than the standard common one. - No wiki article found. - Sandstorms, Blizzards are a part of the biome storms and would love to see some TLC for them. Currently they just do damage over time, instead of simply impacting your characters movement speed, temperature values, visibility, etc. They could add more zombie world spawns during storms as well as zombies could get riled up during them possibly turning them feral even. All of this is better than a simple DoT.
- Drinking mechanics. Bring back glass jars. It was stupid to remove them and I don't think many prefer the collector system which is pointless as you can just use looted dirty water and a campfire. You can fix water by simply making water take longer to distill down and make jars expendable. Once you drink from the jar the jar can break. A product of using it to cook water lets say. In this way jars are not reusable, but you can still get water from actual water sources. The current system doesn't even do what you intended it to do which is to bring some survival elements back into the game as water is still very easy to come by.
- Biome badges. Are currently a joke. A lot of people play with progression turned off. If you insist on keeping the mechanics such as forced loot caps that don't get removed once you get all badges making things like the Forest permanently worse than everywhere else and the harsh DoT effects after being in the zone for a very very small amount of time (should act more like the temperature system of old but amplified) then at least fix the icons to make sense.
Things I don't need to see returned or returned but modified
- Wellness I don't think is needed in it's previous iteration. If they made side effects associated with hunger/thirst specific to each then perhaps. Like if you are hungry your stamina drops by a percentage and if thirsty your max HP is lowered or something to that effect. The previous wellness system was convoluted IMO.
- Zombie smell is another thing I don't need returned. We have feral sense now which while inferior in some regards it functions largely the same. Plus with how food is currently worked in it would be more annoying to make the changes for the level of enjoyment gained.
- Learn by doing. As @Laz Man stated in another thread his ideal system would be a learn by doing system combined with a magazine system. I don't mind the current system as much as others, but it does inhibit players from playing with multiple weapons as I am invested in a skill tree that greatly enhances that weapons effectiveness - try using a metal sledgehammer with no skill points/books. The downside of learn by doing is that people would just craft a lot of cheap items to get to high item levels fast but it's not much different than going around looting mailboxes and prioritizing POIs with books. I don't mind this as much as both work about the same in effectiveness and I don't want to see the skill system changed yet again.
- For those unknowing you used to be able to level up your skills by doing them. Want to level up the quality of your wrench for crafting? Go wrench things. - Lootable corpses. I agree that it's a better mechanics than a loot bag which seems like I am playing Fortnight but you would need to tweak how lootable corpses work when stacked in such things as blood moon events so that I can loot over top of other corpses.
Didn't cover everything in the video but these are a few things I noticed that peaked my interest. With so many changes over the years it's easy to forget how nice some systems were.
ProlificPoultry
Refugee
Okay yes it’s stupid and icky that they should have so much influence okay like yeah I fully agree. Also people turning to ai for an opinion is now the worst thing I’ve had to think of today. But people need a voice. And they need a loud one otherwise nothing gets done. It’s even more apparent today (don’t want to be getting too political)
I’d reference Mon Mothma’s speech in Andor but I think a more apt analogy is what happened with Gearbox’s dlc update to risk of rain 2. It was dysfunctional and poorly implemented and coincidentally the game became worse as consequence of its console development…
Anyways the game got review bombed and all the big name risk of rain 2 youtubers basically gave a concise and focused voice to the problems with the game. And the devs actually listened. They listened to feedback and balanced accordingly. No more mostly negative reviews. Even on the dlc… though it’s mixed overall because of the initial poor reception.
There was also “Fix” and “Save” tf2 whi h managed to get the remaining tf2 “dev” to tackle the bot crisis. The game was review bombed, even other valve games were getting review bombed, and the big names in the community managed to focus players into action. Can you believe that? Tf2 got “fixed” except bots might be coming back
My point is, yes I wish it didn’t have to be this way. I wish the loudest voice didn’t get the biggest say. But just like tf2 people had been content with complacency and making reddit posts about the bots where they really needed something a lot bigger to change things.
And the game is not… bad. It’s in a bit of a slump in my opinion. It’s my favorite game ever, I’ve been playing since alpha 10 and I feel like I’m watching it become something unsustainable. Like it’s on the downward slope with how these changes are being implemented
EvilPolygons
Survivor
The Bang for your Bucket mod proves that you don't need empty jars brought back at all. You can draw water from lakes just like before, with no need at all for empty jars. Just like we don't need empty gasoline cans or empty food wrappers.
ProlificPoultry
Refugee
They took away 64 zombie hordes (should have been an option still) and my old pump shottie. LIKE SCREW IT THEY SHOULD HAVE ADDED WEAPON DLC. But not like weapon paints. Weapon skins. I would kill an entire village of sand people for the old pump shotgun back.
EvilPolygons
Survivor
Being a grouchy old Gen Xer, I really couldn't care less what some rando on YouTube or TikTok has to say. Like, ever.
The whole "influencer" thing is ridiculous. Having a camera, a YouTube channel, and a lot of spare time doesn't make anyone an expert/authority on anything.
The whole "influencer" thing is ridiculous. Having a camera, a YouTube channel, and a lot of spare time doesn't make anyone an expert/authority on anything.
YourMirror
Survivor
Did he hire you to plug that video EVERYWHERE?
I just want fair dialogue. Not snarky comments. I won't post what I had originally because I think it's fair to give everyone a fair shake.
My post was likely moved to images and videos by moderators rather than it being posted twice.
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Okay yes it’s stupid and icky that they should have so much influence okay like yeah I fully agree. Also people turning to ai for an opinion is now the worst thing I’ve had to think of today. But people need a voice. And they need a loud one otherwise nothing gets done. It’s even more apparent today (don’t want to be getting too political)
I’d reference Mon Mothma’s speech in Andor but I think a more apt analogy is what happened with Gearbox’s dlc update to risk of rain 2. It was dysfunctional and poorly implemented and coincidentally the game became worse as consequence of its console development…
Anyways the game got review bombed and all the big name risk of rain 2 youtubers basically gave a concise and focused voice to the problems with the game. And the devs actually listened. They listened to feedback and balanced accordingly. No more mostly negative reviews. Even on the dlc… though it’s mixed overall because of the initial poor reception.
There was also “Fix” and “Save” tf2 whi h managed to get the remaining tf2 “dev” to tackle the bot crisis. The game was review bombed, even other valve games were getting review bombed, and the big names in the community managed to focus players into action. Can you believe that? Tf2 got “fixed” except bots might be coming back
My point is, yes I wish it didn’t have to be this way. I wish the loudest voice didn’t get the biggest say. But just like tf2 people had been content with complacency and making reddit posts about the bots where they really needed something a lot bigger to change things.
And the game is not… bad. It’s in a bit of a slump in my opinion. It’s my favorite game ever, I’ve been playing since alpha 10 and I feel like I’m watching it become something unsustainable. Like it’s on the downward slope with how these changes are being implemented
There are good examples of public outcry making things better, I agree. Especially in the game scene where voting with your wallet simply doesn't work. But I also have seen many negative examples as well.
And one thing seems to be troubling us the same: That influencers who appeal to viewers emotions and are more sensational (and therefore more entertaining) are more successful than influencers who try to argue with facts. Or simpler said the populists win.
Arma Rex
Survivor
To parry with your ridiculous comment, it would be far more likely to assume TFP hired you to act as damage control for their bad development decisions.
This JW video says pretty much everything most players want to say.
On top of the “DLCs,” they’re already talking about making another game when they can’t even finish the first one.
I honestly hope they listen to the community and make this game better—otherwise, they’d be better off selling it to a more capable team.