PC V2.0 Storms Brewing Dev Diary

[sheep]

The pregen maps may be different from pre-2.0 (I haven't compared them), but they are the same filenames. I only noticed that they removed the 4k pregens. Maps do not contain all POI. There are far too many POI to place them all on a single map unless you're overcrowding the map, which RWG will not do, and pregens aren't set up that way either. Building density is controlled entirely by the tiles. If you want things to be closer, you'll need to make new tiles and use those instead of vanilla tiles.

As far as difficulty, it will always be easy for veterans. Any change to make it harder might make it harder for veterans temporarily until they see how things work, but once they get used to the change, the game will be easy for them again. That won't ever change in vanilla. They won't make the game really hard so that it's hard for veterans because they want it to be easy enough for new players and casual players as well. It won't ever be a Souls-like game.

Thank you for this super helpful reply. Good to know the pregens have the same names.

By building density, and I may have used the wrong term, I meant how much open space/wilderness there is versus buildings. In our current map it feels like 5% of the land is taken up by buildings but we would rather have that be a much higher percentage.

I found just now a mod for 2.0 for the rwgmixer.xml file that gives you all of the POIs. There's just no comments on it yet:

Modified rwgmixer.xml - Guaranteed POI Spawns V2.0

I modified the rwgmixer.xml file (the one that generates your maps) so that every POI spawns at least once. I manually selected the POIs, so there are no forced test POI spawns or anything like that.

www.nexusmods.com

"I modified the rwgmixer.xml file (the one that generates your maps) so that every POI spawns at least once. I manually selected the POIs, so there are no forced test POI spawns or anything like that. Right now, there are about 780 'good' POIs, new 2.0 Pois included, and all of them will appear at least once."

You're probably right. The veterans will adapt. But at least so far, the veterans in our game are finding it much harder and more satisfying than 1.3/1.4.

 

[Riamus]

Thank you for this super helpful reply. Good to know the pregens have the same names.

By building density, and I may have used the wrong term, I meant how much open space/wilderness there is versus buildings. In our current map it feels like 5% of the land is taken up by buildings but we would rather have that be a much higher percentage.

I found just now a mod for 2.0 for the rwgmixer.xml file that gives you all of the POIs. There's just no comments on it yet:

Modified rwgmixer.xml - Guaranteed POI Spawns V2.0

I modified the rwgmixer.xml file (the one that generates your maps) so that every POI spawns at least once. I manually selected the POIs, so there are no forced test POI spawns or anything like that.

www.nexusmods.com

"I modified the rwgmixer.xml file (the one that generates your maps) so that every POI spawns at least once. I manually selected the POIs, so there are no forced test POI spawns or anything like that. Right now, there are about 780 'good' POIs, new 2.0 Pois included, and all of them will appear at least once."

You're probably right. The veterans will adapt. But at least so far, the veterans in our game are finding it much harder and more satisfying than 1.3/1.4.

If you mean building density in the wilderness, that should be possible to set in rwgmixer by adjusting minimum spacing between POI. You can't change it for towns, which is what I thought you were asking about.

As far as editing the rwgmixer to get all POI.... I'm not sure accurate that is. You could change spacing enough to maybe get all wilderness POI, but it would look less like wilderness and more like a town. And for town POI, that can be especially difficult as it all depends on what tiles are used and how many of each tile are available to get room for every POI. I've done enough work on maps and have seen some POI not get used often enough to find it a bit hard to believe that it can be done only by editing rwgmixer. It might work for a specific set of RWG parameters, but for every seed and every choice of parameters? Unlikely... but who knows? I personally don't care if some are missing on one map. For one, I'm not going to see every POI on a single map anyhow, and second, I'll just see any I missed on the next map(s) that I play. It also sounds like they are just picking the POI they like and don't care if the others are on the map based on that description, so it probably doesn't include everything.

 

[Grandpa Minion]

That is on them. If the server states that chunks will be reset, then the players need to plan for it. Automatic chunk resets are there almost exclusively for MP. There's almost no reason to use them in SP. You obviously do things differently because you're in PVP. Which, you can use your own words against you with that... you see things through a PVP lens without considering non-PVP. In PVP, sure... you might not want to place LCB or leave a vehicle or a bedroll to protect your base from a chunk reset. But in regular co-op MP (which is the intended MP playstyle), there's little reason not to. Besides, automatic chunk resets do NOT happen in chunks that have been visited recently. So unless a player doesn't play for long enough or doesn't ever go to their base, the chunk at their base isn't going to reset anyhow.

The majority of PvE and PvP server owners I am acquainted with have disabled this feature for valid reasons, reasons that you are unwilling to acknowledge.

<property name="MaxChunkAge" value="-1"/> <!-- The number of in-game days which must pass since visiting a chunk before it will reset to its original state if not revisited or protected (e.g. by a land claim or bedroll being in close proximity). -->
<property name="SaveDataLimit" value="-1"/> <!-- The maximum disk space allowance for each saved game in megabytes (MB). Saved chunks may be forceably reset to their original states to free up space when this limit is reached. Negative values disable the limit. -->

 

[Riamus]

The majority of PvE and PvP server owners I am acquainted with have disabled this feature for valid reasons, reasons that you are unwilling to acknowledge.

<property name="MaxChunkAge" value="-1"/> <!-- The number of in-game days which must pass since visiting a chunk before it will reset to its original state if not revisited or protected (e.g. by a land claim or bedroll being in close proximity). -->
<property name="SaveDataLimit" value="-1"/> <!-- The maximum disk space allowance for each saved game in megabytes (MB). Saved chunks may be forceably reset to their original states to free up space when this limit is reached. Negative values disable the limit. -->

As you quoted there, it will not reset if you are visiting it regularly, which should be normal for a base unless someone plays infrequently. If set to 7-14 days, it should have little impact on most players' bases. But it is entirely up to the server what they want to do, and it's up to the players if they want to play on such a server.

Besides, many servers just start a new map after a relatively short amount of real time (one week to one month), which means there's little reason to reset chunks. It is most beneficial to servers that intend to run for long periods of time.

 

[zztong]

In fact, I would wager that many individuals participating in this thread do not play multiplayer on a daily basis.
This is part of the issue; many aspects relevant to single-player experiences do not apply in multiplayer, and vice versa.

I would agree to some extent. Among the permanent servers I find folks like to extensively apply mods that do weird things like add their own money system and server store, allow teleportation, and other things I don't like.

But when it came to a small server among friends, Vanilla or near-Vanilla, things were pretty cool.

To me, those are both multiplayer but worlds apart.

 

[zztong]

I found just now a mod for 2.0 for the rwgmixer.xml file that gives you all of the POIs. There's just no comments on it yet:

I was intrigued, so I downloaded the mod.

It sets the min_count to 1 for every POI they listed in the rwgmixer. It also sets the bias to 20 for each of those POIs.

First, setting min_count to 1 will be decently effective, but not perfect. Those POIs still depend on a Tile appearing that will support their placement and enough of those Tiles appearing to give each POI a chance. The modlet cannot make that happen. In one case (at least) it even configures a POI that isn't tagged to appear in the game, so that one will never get placed regardless of the rwgmixer.xml.

Secondly, setting the bias to 20 just tells me they don't understand how bias is used. Doing that selectively overwhelms the bias calculations such that the tier of other POIs won't be relevant anymore and it might mess up trader placement. Doing that across all the POIs just puts all of the other POIs at the same level as the traders and doesn't otherwise affect the math... unless you add custom POIs (more on that later). Actually, it might move trader placement to last as I don't think they have a tier to add to the calculation. In short, bias and weight options are tricky. You have to know the algorithm to use them effectively.

Third, it overwrites three TFP special cases for rural filler lots, gas stations, and the rural outdoor wedding.

Fourth, none of these changes would apply to any custom POIs you get from other sources. In fact, the bias setting will make any other POIs appear infrequently if at all.

Personally, if you want this rwgmixer, I'd remove all of the bias="20" entries for every line after the "UFFBASEE" comment. If you still want to mess with min/max appearing, then go for it.

 

[zztong]

Regarding the Frostclaw, when they throw a rock and miss it does block damage, which is kind of neat. Unfortunately, once a player realizes they need to just keep moving to avoid those, the Frostclaw pretty much always misses, which is fine. The downside, however is the terrain around areas the player frequents becomes littered with destroyed terrain. This is very much like the effect the Endermen have on the terrain around a base in Minecraft. Overtime, the land will become a hellscape.

On one hand I like that it might do damage to a horde base on horde night. On the other hand, I really hate what's happening to the terrain around my base. I don't know what to recommend.

By the way, tricking Frostclaws into knocking entrances into POIs with their boulders is kind of entertaining.

EDIT: What if Frostclaws didn't damage terrain blocks? Oh, I guess people would start building horde bases from terrain blocks.

 

[Adam the Waster]

Regarding the Frostclaw, when they throw a rock and miss it does block damage, which is kind of neat. Unfortunately, once a player realizes they need to just keep moving to avoid those, the Frostclaw pretty much always misses, which is fine. The downside, however is the terrain around areas the player frequents becomes littered with destroyed terrain. This is very much like the effect the Endermen have on the terrain around a base in Minecraft. Overtime, the land will become a hellscape.

On one hand I like that it might do damage to a horde base on horde night. On the other hand, I really hate what's happening to the terrain around my base. I don't know what to recommend.

By the way, tricking Frostclaws into knocking entrances into POIs with their boulders is kind of entertaining.

Fill in the wholes but maybe they could do something like the cop were it doesn't deal damage to the terrain but to only blocks

I for one like the fact he wrecks everything

 

[Adam the Waster]

The one thing I do miss tho is the look of the old wasteland in term of debris (I can hear the boos)

But it made the whole biome feel like a dump to clean up eventually

 

[EvilPolygons]

The one thing I do miss tho is the look of the old wasteland in term of debris (I can hear the boos)

But it made the whole biome feel like a dump to clean up eventually

It never made sense for the entire biome to be covered in the broken brick texture, even in places where there were obviously never any buildings to begin with. Farms and pastures covered in bricks, parks covered in bricks, fields and forests covered in bricks...

The broken brick texture makes sense for decorating destroyed buildings, but not for every square inch of the wilderness.

 

[Khalagar]

After being in the desert for a couple of days, I noticed I often miss the swarm the spitter throws.
I'm either too early or too late because I have a hard time clearly seeing the "shape" of it and / or its distance.
It blends a lot in the desert biome, but it might be on purpose.
Has anyone else experienced this?
(Also, it gets annoying pretty fast because it's systematic and happens a bit too often imho.)

Yes, spitters are by far the most annoying thing they've ever added to the game lol. The bugs slow you, outrun you on a bicycle, give you 12,000 diseases and injuries because they will hit you 15 times in 4 seconds, and are very hard to hit back or even see

I would say they will definitely need to be toned down, because ATM they make anyone sane just leave the desert and absolutely never go back lol. Just trying to bike across it you will have 12 swarms of bugs chasing you at all times, giving you every possible injury known to man

 

[CyberHellKen]

Silly question, but in the Marauder armor set trailer, it featured a remote detonator. New explosive coming?

Also, is the wetness debuff simply dead and buried, or will it return with different properties, like increased infection chance? I have a feeling we'll be relying on modders once more to make this game a survival game again instead of the arcade game it's turned into. Partially teasing here. I know that new players won't realize that mechanic is gone, but it's pretty jarring (get it, JARring?) that it's no longer a survival concern.

My opinion on storms is that they are almost exactly like the storms of No Man's Sky, right down to the intrusive warnings. The only difference being that you have mods in NMS that mitigate the damage, but there are still vignettes and other minor debuffs -- but you can also get some buffs by being out in certain storms. Examples: special materials you can only gather in storms. Your movement or jumping can be improved in certain storms. I'd love to see some variety in the storms with different debuffs and even a buff to things, like run speed, mining strength, melee damage, XP gain boost, etc.

That said, having "damage" being the only threat of storms is a bit basic. Some of the biome hazard effect mechanics would be much more amazing if applied to storms. In other words, being in a storm builds up a debuff over time, and when it becomes critical you feel the effects of it - be it damage, slowness, increased water/food usage, even increased damage to your armor, or perhaps driving your vehicle in a storm could cause slow damage and worsened fuel/speed performance. Then, using armor mods could slow how quickly the storm builds the debuff to critical, and special foods (like the biome smoothies) could slow it further, or reduce the build-up by a minute or two (which could also be affected by a perk, like Iron Gut).

The way storms are now, they feel rushed and simplistic. PLEASE give storms better mechanics and variety.

This also reminds me, why don't mods degrade over time and have quality stats? I'd have a reason to be excited when I find my 50th rad remover mod if I had to replace them periodically, or even finding one that has better stats. I'd even want to craft mods if the RNG gods don't provide me a replacement in a timely manner.

Thanks for AMAZING optimization work done in this update. I'm playing on higher video settings now, with far better performance than 1.4.

 

[Riamus]

Regarding the Frostclaw, when they throw a rock and miss it does block damage, which is kind of neat. Unfortunately, once a player realizes they need to just keep moving to avoid those, the Frostclaw pretty much always misses, which is fine. The downside, however is the terrain around areas the player frequents becomes littered with destroyed terrain. This is very much like the effect the Endermen have on the terrain around a base in Minecraft. Overtime, the land will become a hellscape.

On one hand I like that it might do damage to a horde base on horde night. On the other hand, I really hate what's happening to the terrain around my base. I don't know what to recommend.

By the way, tricking Frostclaws into knocking entrances into POIs with their boulders is kind of entertaining.

EDIT: What if Frostclaws didn't damage terrain blocks? Oh, I guess people would start building horde bases from terrain blocks.

I'm kind of opposite. I purposely make demolition guys explode during house night and leave the ruined terrain alone afterwards. However, I wouldn't want that happening near my regular base. Which means I won't build my base in the snow now. Of course, I rarely did anyhow.

 

[zztong]

I'm kind of opposite. I purposely make demolition guys explode during house night and leave the ruined terrain alone afterwards. However, I wouldn't want that happening near my regular base. Which means I won't build my base in the snow now. Of course, I rarely did anyhow.

Oh yeh, I don't mind setting off a Demo zombie in a POI I'm clearing. Sometimes that's really handy. But I don't set them off outside my base. I'd have to drive my vehicle through the massive divot.

 

[Old Crow]

Silly question, but in the Marauder armor set trailer, it featured a remote detonator. New explosive coming?

I was wondering this too. Would love to see some remote explosives for setting traps.

 

[Adam the Waster]

It never made sense for the entire biome to be covered in the broken brick texture, even in places where there were obviously never any buildings to begin with. Farms and pastures covered in bricks, parks covered in bricks, fields and forests covered in bricks...

The broken brick texture makes sense for decorating destroyed buildings, but not for every square inch of the wilderness.

I've aways though of it as debris being thrown from the blast.

But if you wanna do that "doesn't make sense" card for fun cuz I like to nit pick

Why are ember storms a thing and why does the burnt forest "even with life trying to regrow' keep setting on fire? What is this place silent hill?

And realistically the wasteland would basicly be a Charged black desert with rocks and rubble no trees or anything standing

 

[faatal]

Yes, spitters are by far the most annoying thing they've ever added to the game lol. The bugs slow you, outrun you on a bicycle, give you 12,000 diseases and injuries because they will hit you 15 times in 4 seconds, and are very hard to hit back or even see

I would say they will definitely need to be toned down, because ATM they make anyone sane just leave the desert and absolutely never go back lol. Just trying to bike across it you will have 12 swarms of bugs chasing you at all times, giving you every possible injury known to man

Today, one of us died in the desert from storm+swarms+vultures due to swarms hitting while on bicycle, so I removed the Insect Swarm speedup while target on vehicle as it should not have been on there in the first place, but being a vulture they inherited it.

Post automatically merged: Sunday at 5:48 PM

Regarding the Frostclaw, when they throw a rock and miss it does block damage, which is kind of neat. Unfortunately, once a player realizes they need to just keep moving to avoid those, the Frostclaw pretty much always misses, which is fine. The downside, however is the terrain around areas the player frequents becomes littered with destroyed terrain. This is very much like the effect the Endermen have on the terrain around a base in Minecraft. Overtime, the land will become a hellscape.

On one hand I like that it might do damage to a horde base on horde night. On the other hand, I really hate what's happening to the terrain around my base. I don't know what to recommend.

By the way, tricking Frostclaws into knocking entrances into POIs with their boulders is kind of entertaining.

EDIT: What if Frostclaws didn't damage terrain blocks? Oh, I guess people would start building horde bases from terrain blocks.

Friday I added "Increased snow terrain block health (50>160)", but it did not make b289. It takes 4 boulder hits to make a hole with that.

 

[faatal]

It never made sense for the entire biome to be covered in the broken brick texture, even in places where there were obviously never any buildings to begin with. Farms and pastures covered in bricks, parks covered in bricks, fields and forests covered in bricks...

The broken brick texture makes sense for decorating destroyed buildings, but not for every square inch of the wilderness.

It did not make sense and I hated it.

 

[faatal]

Silly question, but in the Marauder armor set trailer, it featured a remote detonator. New explosive coming?

Also, is the wetness debuff simply dead and buried, or will it return with different properties, like increased infection chance? I have a feeling we'll be relying on modders once more to make this game a survival game again instead of the arcade game it's turned into. Partially teasing here. I know that new players won't realize that mechanic is gone, but it's pretty jarring (get it, JARring?) that it's no longer a survival concern.

My opinion on storms is that they are almost exactly like the storms of No Man's Sky, right down to the intrusive warnings. The only difference being that you have mods in NMS that mitigate the damage, but there are still vignettes and other minor debuffs -- but you can also get some buffs by being out in certain storms. Examples: special materials you can only gather in storms. Your movement or jumping can be improved in certain storms. I'd love to see some variety in the storms with different debuffs and even a buff to things, like run speed, mining strength, melee damage, XP gain boost, etc.

That said, having "damage" being the only threat of storms is a bit basic. Some of the biome hazard effect mechanics would be much more amazing if applied to storms. In other words, being in a storm builds up a debuff over time, and when it becomes critical you feel the effects of it - be it damage, slowness, increased water/food usage, even increased damage to your armor, or perhaps driving your vehicle in a storm could cause slow damage and worsened fuel/speed performance. Then, using armor mods could slow how quickly the storm builds the debuff to critical, and special foods (like the biome smoothies) could slow it further, or reduce the build-up by a minute or two (which could also be affected by a perk, like Iron Gut).

The way storms are now, they feel rushed and simplistic. PLEASE give storms better mechanics and variety.

This also reminds me, why don't mods degrade over time and have quality stats? I'd have a reason to be excited when I find my 50th rad remover mod if I had to replace them periodically, or even finding one that has better stats. I'd even want to craft mods if the RNG gods don't provide me a replacement in a timely manner.

Thanks for AMAZING optimization work done in this update. I'm playing on higher video settings now, with far better performance than 1.4.

No new explosive.
No plans on using wetness.
Today I added "biome zombies move at blood moon speeds during damaging storms (not forest)", but have not yet had team feedback on that one.
Storms do effect vehicles, but I have not seen anyone notice yet.

 

[4sheetzngeegles]

@faatal
This may be an odd question
The food and water in entities.xml was it based on a 30 60 or 90 min day, and is it
based on game time or real time? it doesn"t say in the notes

EDIT: also how do I set damaging storm in the forest?