PC V2.0 Delayed Again

[Arez]

Not sure. I understand Fataal saying that the current implementation has not been submitted yet. That doesn't mean they didn't get a laundry list of changes from Sony/Microsoft after submitting a then-current state of the game at a past date. Which would better fit with past communication, unless I misunderstood completely.

"Waiting for 2.0 and could've tried pushing it through for 1.x" doesn't sound like it was ever submitted despite the official Storms Brewing Update page stating "We will not know officially if Consoles can play on dedicated servers until passing cert on each platform. Fingers crossed". 

"Fingers crossed" implies that it's now in the hands of MS & Sony.

I don't know. 

 

[Suxar]

 And a17 wasn't even ready to be released when it was. TFP just caved to the complainers and pushed an un-tested build.

So that's where all the bugs came from. Don't do that anymore. It would have been fine for a test build, but it was terrible for a release.

 

[Javabean867]

So that's where all the bugs came from. Don't do that anymore. It would have been fine for a test build, but it was terrible for a release.

Was the clown car of zombies part of the bugs?  I remember early alpha 17 had way too many zombies in each house, that just charged out at the first sign of noise lol

 

[HammerDano]

Not sure. I understand Fataal saying that the current implementation has not been submitted yet. That doesn't mean they didn't get a laundry list of changes from Sony/Microsoft after submitting a then-current state of the game at a past date. Which would better fit with past communication, unless I misunderstood completely.

Since you always conversate in the spirit of good faith, and are decent even when disagreeing, I hesitated, and thought these words out carefully, as to cause as little offence as possible.

when I read Your response and Roland's particularly...you both just can't seem to believe it...and you both struggled to come up with some reason why it was STILL something else...some reason to deflect away from TFP. Read Faatal's response...which I appreciate he made...he could have sat on that awhile longer...it's not like you guys push them for answers...he admits they make mistakes...just not that they don't own up to them. and honestly...you guys do make excuses for them when it is not deserved. that is all I wanted to point out. thank you.

 

[faatal]

Not sure. I understand Fataal saying that the current implementation has not been submitted yet. That doesn't mean they didn't get a laundry list of changes from Sony/Microsoft after submitting a then-current state of the game at a past date. Which would better fit with past communication, unless I misunderstood completely.

Our console devs communicated with then, but that is not the same as submission, which no one would know as we don't give out many details of our dev process. Game dev is messy and full of unknowns even if you are best organized person in the world.

"Waiting for 2.0 and could've tried pushing it through for 1.x" doesn't sound like it was ever submitted despite the official Storms Brewing Update page stating "We will not know officially if Consoles can play on dedicated servers until passing cert on each platform. Fingers crossed". 

"Fingers crossed" implies that it's now in the hands of MS & Sony.

I don't know. 

That was a future looking statement, that at the time was about to happen, and then several delays came up due to many other things not being done and scope creep.

 

[HammerDano]

@faatal why can you not just admit I am right about this part too...you guys have been slow... rolling out console features on a relaunch to @%$#ing console...there has been little to no urgency to actually bring console to parity.

 

[HammerDano]

IF we had dedicated servers the game is in an acceptable place to wait for the rest to be rolled out. I stand behind my word. 

 

[meganoth]

Since you always conversate in the spirit of good faith, and are decent even when disagreeing, I hesitated, and thought these words out carefully, as to cause as little offence as possible.

when I read Your response and Roland's particularly...you both just can't seem to believe it...and you both struggled to come up with some reason why it was STILL something else...some reason to deflect away from TFP. Read Faatal's response...which I appreciate he made...he could have sat on that awhile longer...it's not like you guys push them for answers...he admits they make mistakes...just not that they don't own up to them. and honestly...you guys do make excuses for them when it is not deserved. that is all I wanted to point out. thank you.

Well, Fataal's next post showed my theory was wrong. Before that what few information came from TFP about the state of the multiplayer code and other information and guesswork  seemed to point at the submission being one of the reasons for the delays. I never claimed it was the only one. And I argued from that position. 

What I am still correct about is how much time it takes to program network code, obviously it took them a long time even though there was no delay from sony or microsoft. Note also that I didn't really blame the console companies for it, I just assumed they were part of the delays.

Now that we know those details, please tell me what really changed? We already knew TFP is on the slow side, and even though I thought there was a chance they might have changed their methods after submitting a roadmap, that didn't happen. For ME that is about as important as if I guessed at a dice throw and was incorrect.

You still don't seem to really believe us when we say how much we don't care about delays (or the reasons for them). The important thing is that whatever they deliver is still fun for us. I think I speak for Roland as well when I say we still like to discuss about that stuff, or try to calm poster that seem to have major problems with the way TFP works. But that's it.

 

[SylenThunder]

@faatal why can you not just admit I am right about this part too...you guys have been slow... rolling out console features on a relaunch to @%$#ing console...there has been little to no urgency to actually bring console to parity.

I am curious here.  What features are they "slow rolling out" for the console?

Aside from the obvious two.

1. RWG map generation at launch, because the consoles did not have the RAM available to support it until it was optimized further.

2a. Cross-platform Peer-2-Peer capability at launch because Sony and Microshaft had not approved it yet.

2b. Dedicated server capability for console. Something Sony and MS do not often approve, that TFP is still waiting for approval on.

You act like there is this huge list of features missing from the console, and that the current console version is not in parity with the PC version. Except that for the most part it is. The above list aren't gameplay features with the exception of #1, and that was only an issue because MS forces developers to include the pathetic Series-S console in releases. If they didn't have to develop for hardware that doesn't meet the minimum specifications for the game client, #1 would have been available at the console launch.

Cross-Platform play and dedicated servers is a bonus, not a missing feature.

So honestly. Aside from what I mentioned, what is missing for "parity".

 

[HammerDano]

Well, Fataal's next post showed my theory was wrong. Before that what few information came from TFP about the state of the multiplayer code and other information and guesswork  seemed to point at the submission being one of the reasons for the delays. I never claimed it was the only one. And I argued from that position. 

What I am still correct about is how much time it takes to program network code, obviously it took them a long time even though there was no delay from sony or microsoft. Note also that I didn't really blame the console companies for it, I just assumed they were part of the delays.

you argued in good faith

Now that we know those details, please tell me what really changed? We already knew TFP is on the slow side, and even though I thought there was a chance they might have changed their methods after submitting a roadmap, that didn't happen. For ME that is about as important as if I guessed at a dice throw and was incorrect.

thank you for acknowledging there was a vague hope that they had changed a little when they put out an actual long term roadmap...it fooled me. I didn't think they would be able to maintain it perfectly...not that they had no intentions of even pretending to try. That with the limited time loyalty reward...i caved to fomo. I notice no one has acknowledged they pulled that bs.

what changed or changes? I guess nothing for you guys. He just admitted that they misinformed you guys, that they have sat on that knowledge for an undetermined amount of time, and just have not even been trying to get it done for console. His half hearted non apology does not cut it. I really do appreciate he came clean about them dropping the ball....be really great to hear what their plan is to get it done.  FFS...i am beating my head against a brick wall I guess...you guys can see that this has not been a great roll out for a relaunch to console. even THIS site...their site...did you guys get ready for console players to come back...nope. it has been half assed for us.

You still don't seem to really believe us when we say how much we don't care about delays (or the reasons for them). The important thing is that whatever they deliver is still fun for us. I think I speak for Roland as well when I say we still like to discuss about that stuff, or try to calm poster that seem to have major problems with the way TFP works. But that's it.

I do believe you...it is basically free candy every year for one small investment...I have said that over and over again...I do get why. The majority of you guys just don't want to hear any other perspective....because it might @%$# up your free pile of candy...I get it. 

 

[HB_H4wk]

Bottom line Consoles are limited while PC's are not, stop wasting money on a system that is limited and go buy a decent gaming pc and plug in your Xborx or Whaastation controller and your done.

 

[bdubyah]

@OP What complaint have you made that is valid? That the update has been delayed? Roadmap said dates are subject to change, so your point isn't valid. Next.

Consoles don't have dedicated servers on release? Roadmap said they wouldn't, you just ignored it. Next.

 

[meganoth]

you argued in good faith

thank you for acknowledging there was a vague hope that they had changed a little when they put out an actual long term roadmap...it fooled me. I didn't think they would be able to maintain it perfectly...not that they had no intentions of even pretending to try. That with the limited time loyalty reward...i caved to fomo. I notice no one has acknowledged they pulled that bs.

what changed or changes? I guess nothing for you guys. He just admitted that they misinformed you guys, that they have sat on that knowledge for an undetermined amount of time, 

Sure, he said they have not informed us until now. We don't have any rights to internal information. But misinformation? Lets be clear, that means they must have said something which turns out to not be true, if they don't say anything they obviously can't misinform us. Do you have a link?

and just have not even been trying to get it done for console. 

He said they didn't push for adding it to 1.x because they thought 2.0 would be finished sooner. A reasonable approach, with the only problem that they failed at judging (again) how long it takes. We know they are not good at that. By saying they have not been trying you are grossly misrepresenting what he said.

His half hearted non apology does not cut it.

I don't think that was meant as an apology.

I really do appreciate he came clean about them dropping the ball....be really great to hear what their plan is to get it done.  FFS...i am beating my head against a brick wall I guess...you guys can see that this has not been a great roll out for a relaunch to console. even THIS site...their site...did you guys get ready for console players to come back...nope. it has been half assed for us.

I do believe you...it is basically free candy every year for one small investment...I have said that over and over again...I do get why. The majority of you guys just don't want to hear any other perspective....because it might @%$# up your free pile of candy...I get it. 

 

[HammerDano]

@bdubyah like it or lump it...I was not off base. You keep on being offended that I just don't revere these guys like the die hards. (olive branch...it's a lot nicer than fan boys and you can meme the @%$# out of John McClane) 

Be honest, is it maybe that you guys see the end is coming and you're @%$#ed I am trying to speed it up? Because I have admitted I see how great this game has been to you and for you guys, you basically have gotten a new...er or ish revision of the same game, but, maybe with new skins, or POI's and progression changes...things you loved/hated, people to talk to about it...you personally make mods...you are highly motivated. I do recognize all of that...I get that I am yucking your yum...it shouldn't though. I have said over and over that I wish they had done parallel development so you guys could have as good a game as your platform can support...that would be awesome. I'd watch the @%$# out of that content and not feel the least bit bad that my yum doesn't support that much awesome. I used on game on PC, I don't love file management...that's why I switched.

 

[bdubyah]

Be honest, is it maybe that you guys see the end is coming and you're @%$#ed I am trying to speed it up?

The fact you think you're actually accomplishing anything is hilarious. Sad, but hilarious.

Because I have admitted I see how great this game has been to you and for you guys, you basically have gotten a new...er or ish revision of the same game, but, maybe with new skins, or POI's and progression changes

Why are you talking about the past now? We no longer have a newer version of the game. It's the same game.

I have said over and over that I wish they had done parallel development so you guys could have as good a game as your platform can support...that would be awesome.

Not sure what you mean here, we got as good of a game as we were/are gonna get, console or not. I'm sure there have been some changes that wouldn't have happened if not for consoles, but it is what it is.

I used on game on PC, I don't love file management...that's why I switched.

Consoles these days aren't that much different, and I'd rather have much more freedom/control over everything. I played console for a long time but can't see ever going back. They are simply inferior. And if you just install games and play I'm not sure how much file management you have to do.

 

[Dark Sun]

We are never going to agree about this, that's okay, I get that you guys do not care how long it takes...it is basically all freebies to you and you love it...cool.

console has not had the same experience.

I'll just chime in and say that complaining about it isn't going to make the devs work on the build faster or release it sooner. It sucks, but it is what it is, and hopefully the update will be well worth the wait.

 

[TWORDY]

Oh, I see no update is coming next week. The new Snow Biome Zombie or Creature gives me Elder Scrolls and Metro vibes, which is not bad. It gives me chills every time. From what I have seen, the number of trees/foliage on screenshots worries me the most. I would love to see more realistic plains and dense forestation, tbh. I understand that there needs to be some special treatment for console users, aka optimization. I replaced my 4060Ti OC to 9070 OC version, and hell... I have strange temperature spikes on my CPU, my Noctua fans are blowing nocturnal winds  for 2-3 seconds. 

 

[Riamus]

Oh, I see no update is coming next week. The new Snow Biome Zombie or Creature gives me Elder Scrolls and Metro vibes, which is not bad. It gives me chills every time. From what I have seen, the number of trees/foliage on screenshots worries me the most. I would love to see more realistic plains and dense forestation, tbh. I understand that there needs to be some special treatment for console users, aka optimization. I replaced my 4060Ti OC to 9070 OC version, and hell... I have strange temperature spikes on my CPU, my Noctua fans are blowing nocturnal winds  for 2-3 seconds. 

I don't think they've shared any real images of what the changes to trees will be.  Supposedly, you'll get trees grouping together more, which should give you more of the effect you're talking about.  Not sure how good it'll actually be, though.

 

[HammerDano]

I'll just chime in and say that complaining about it isn't going to make the devs work on the build faster or release it sooner. It sucks, but it is what it is, and hopefully the update will be well worth the wait.

welcome to the site.

following that logic, why did they put out a roadmap with rough dates? It clearly was not for the PC gamers, or at least the ones engaging with me on this site...overwhelming opinion I hear is, "it takes as long as it takes" no question asked... no sense in complaining...does it matter they keep adding things they did not promise but are no closer to bandits, story etc...apparently no. So what was the roadmap for? to sell the idea that they have their @%$# together and are in the final stretch....too bad they didn't tell console gamers the final stretch is a looooooose term. I was okay with the idea it would take longer than the year and a half they laid out...a month or so delay per roadmap stop...seems reasonable especially since they had built in 6 months per update for themselves...so maybe it would take 2 years. These guys have no timeline...none. would be a lot easier to take if the rollout to consoles wasn't so lacking. If they had actually put steady consistent effort into getting us dedicated servers. if it hadn't taken so long to optimize even a little. we are being treated like a burden they have to lug around...not a revenue stream they chose to tap.

*this next part is for anyone*

*an answer that is just: all dates subject to change OR you should have known they would never follow the roadmap isn't actually answering the question...it's just avoiding it. sorry

 

[meganoth]

welcome to the site.

following that logic, why did they put out a roadmap with rough dates? It clearly was not for the PC gamers, or at least the ones engaging with me on this site...overwhelming opinion I hear is, "it takes as long as it takes" no question asked... no sense in complaining...does it matter they keep adding things they did not promise but are no closer to bandits, story etc...apparently no. So what was the roadmap for? to sell the idea that they have their @%$# together and are in the final stretch....too bad they didn't tell console gamers the final stretch is a looooooose term. I was okay with the idea it would take longer than the year and a half they laid out...a month or so delay per roadmap stop...seems reasonable especially since they had built in 6 months per update for themselves...so maybe it would take 2 years. These guys have no timeline...none. would be a lot easier to take if the rollout to consoles wasn't so lacking. If they had actually put steady consistent effort into getting us dedicated servers. if it hadn't taken so long to optimize even a little. we are being treated like a burden they have to lug around...not a revenue stream they chose to tap.

*this next part is for anyone*

*an answer that is just: all dates subject to change OR you should have known they would never follow the roadmap isn't actually answering the question...it's just avoiding it. sorry

It actually was an improvement for us PC players as well, as we got general features that would be delivered in the respective version. 

I would also guess that those are the biggest or most important features planned for the update. For example the "New Quest Marker System" seems a very miniscule feature compared to all the adjustments for the weather and biome progression system, not mentioning it didn't really make the roadmap look like it was missing something. Especially since the roadmap is actually preceded by the sentence "Here is a high level preview of our post 1.0 features Roadmap stay tuned:"