PC Still no jars

[InfiniteWarrior]

there aren't really any other options [to level smithing] in Skyrim

Than to artificially inflate the skill by crafting of hundreds of iron daggers? How did I get to ebony smithing over the due course of the game in that event?

I thought the perk system was awkward (though the UI was nice) because I had to invest in too many skills I didn't want in order to get to the ones that I did want in the skill trees, but leveled normally otherwise in that game, investing points where they were needed to raise the skills according to what kind of character I was playing from Pathfinder to the infamous stealth archer.

The only normal source of clean water is the toilet cistern.

Can't go along with that. I rather like zztong's ideas on the subject, though access to a chemistry bench would have to be granted far earlier in the game. (Probably not possible at this point. And I do wish we could have some of those we see in labs that simply sit on a counter. That bench is humongous.)

Moot, at any rate. TFP are apparently adamant the natural water sources will be used in the base game solely to create moats and what not. Not sure why you'd need one given the zombies can swim, though. (And that's perfectly fine by me.)

 

[Suxar]

the zombies can swim

I've never seen zombies swim. Mine always walk along the bottom. Try playing without mods.

 

[InfiniteWarrior]

I've never seen zombies swim. Mine always walk along the bottom. Try playing without mods.

Poorly phrased on my part. Point is: they can make it across. No problem. Also, I don't play with a ton of mods, but only quality of life mods. Nothing is interfering with vanilla in my case.

 

[InfiniteWarrior]

The reason, almost exclusively, is the looting requirements of the game.

I agree, and have been racking my brains trying to think of ways to make the wilderness more viable. It doesn't appear anything will be done about it at this point, though.

 

[Gamida]

I've never seen zombies swim. Mine always walk along the bottom. Try playing without mods.

From my understanding is if you are in deep water and you are on the surface, the zombies will walk on bottom towards you and then when close or under you, they will swim up.

 

[zztong]

It would be nice if it were possible to bring a bucket of water to the fire and boil it to get, for example, 5 cans of clean water.

Yeh, I mod it so that when you point at a water block and hit "e" you don't drink, but instead get a jar of murky water. That action refreshes every 10 seconds and the stacking limit for murky gets set to 10, so you really have to work to have "infinite water." I don't mess with the loot tables, which I probably should look at doing as water from POIs is super common when it probably shouldn't be.

I also change the normal boiled water to have a dysentery chance. You can wipe that chance out if you max out Iron Gut. Or, when you finally get a Chemistry Set and start making the really good water then you can have potable water. Teas remain as they are, so if you're willing to do two steps of cooking you can avoid dysentery too.

I like it, but I've no indication or confidence that this approach has any mass appeal.

 

[Rotor]

I like it, but I've no indication or confidence that this approach has any mass appeal.

I would try it if'n when I am able to play again, like bang for bucket from @FramFramson

 

[warmer]

There is a difference between adding a toggle to turn feral sense on and off and reworking the whole water mechanic again.

It´s simply not realistic that they give us back glass jars. Mostly because they don´t want to, but also because we are too late into development to change that mechanic again.

I really don´t know why you are so keen on hating the idea to toggle feral sense on and off. It doesn´t effect you at all if they do so. Live and let live.

You can already toggle feral sense on an off. 

"It´s simply not realistic that they give us back glass jars. Mostly because they don´t want to, but also because we are too late into development to change that mechanic again."

This is exactly my point. You made it for me. Happy to see we agree.

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

@warmer I meant ofc rage mode not feral sense obviously.

And no we don´t agree. A rage mode toggle and bringing back glass jars are two completly different things. One is easy, the other needs a whole rework or a game mechanic again. Rage mode should be a toggle in vanilla that´s a simple change. Bringing back glass jars would delay development.  Because if they bring them back (which is 100% not happening, that´s the true reason why here "mod it" is the only option) they surely wouldn´t just bring it back like it was before.

Hence why for rage mode "Just mod it" is the worst option, for water jars it is the only one.

You refuse to say why you hate the idea so much. You act like those trolls on steam forums tbh, lots of hate for something that doesn´t effect you in any way but no reason why.

 

[theFlu]

This is exactly my point.

Your point is "too late in the development for settings"? ... guess what the previous answer is? "Too early in the development, we don't know if this is permanent and maintaining setting through the dev is pointless". That one is correct. And don't worry, I know you're just agroing; I'm just pointing out the obvious.

 

[warmer]

@warmer I meant ofc rage mode not feral sense obviously.

And no we don´t agree. A rage mode toggle and bringing back glass jars are two completly different things. One is easy, the other needs a whole rework or a game mechanic again. Rage mode should be a toggle in vanilla that´s a simple change. Bringing back glass jars would delay development.  Because if they bring them back (which is 100% not happening, that´s the true reason why here "mod it" is the only option) they surely wouldn´t just bring it back like it was before.

.

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of how coding works. Bringing jars back is actually simple in comparison than reworking every entity AI to removing that function. A toggle button does nothing by itself. You need to make that toggle button modify a file on the fly for that specific aspect of the game. That is an entity condition.

Feral sense is a Player condition that can be changing with a single value.

Rage is a condition associated with each entity as a unique rule. It is not a blanket rule like feral sense.

This is why you don't understand my point of view. You a missing the understanding of what you are actually asking to be done. Asking for someone to bring a rock back from the moon is a lot more complex than simply asking the question.

 

[aceguy7]

...How is this a glitch?

I don't know if its a glitch or an intended "feature" seems op or cheap if it is lol? The bucket is useless? by the time you get one your swimming in water with 3 or 4 dew collectors anyways I don't see the point. lol

 

[fragtzack]

We have no jars because there is no spoon.

 

[Rotor]

A few jar discussions ago, it was understood by all that the Jars themselves is not the issue.   Too lazy to look it up.

 

[Old Crow]

I don't know if its a glitch or an intended "feature" seems op or cheap if it is lol? The bucket is useless? by the time you get one your swimming in water with 3 or 4 dew collectors anyways I don't see the point. lol

It's pretty much intended. Plus the bucket can be used to carry water for other reasons, like if you want to make a pond or swimming pool at your base.

 

[Roland]

But, of course, we all know it's not drinking water TFP have an issue with but glue and duct tape.

It's none of those things. TFP just had an issue with empty jars and that is mostly the long and the short of it. They wanted empty jars to be gone and they erased them. Then they chose a design that could be implemented without the empty jars.

I've said it from the beginning that even if TFP did away with dew collectors and went in a different direction, it would never include bringing back empty jars. This is not about TFP being anti-glue or anti-duct tape. It's just about the jars.

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

The anti duct tape part would be the amount of cloth you need to craft them now.

 

[Roland]

The anti duct tape part would be the amount of cloth you need to craft them now.

That perspective just ignores the fact that the amount of cloth needed for ALL recipes went up. One man's anti duct tape conspiracy theory is another man's pro cotton farming agenda proposal...

 

[pApA^LeGBa]

That perspective just ignores the fact that the amount of cloth needed for ALL recipes went up. One man's anti duct tape conspiracy theory is another man's pro cotton farming agenda proposal...

Are you trying to imply that they didn´t exactly know that this will influence mostly duct tape production? I didn´t even recognize that other recipe  costs have gone up. That part can be neglected tbh.

 

[Roland]

Are you trying to imply that they didn´t exactly know that this will influence mostly duct tape production? I didn´t even recognize that other recipe  costs have gone up. That part can be neglected tbh.

Knowing what the results of a change will be is different than having that result as the motivating reason for making the change. Of course they knew the impact of their changes. They made those changes before it was released as an update and internal QA guys played with the changes. 

In my profession I assign grades based on the performance of my students. I know that an F grade is going to result in an athlete not being able to play in their next game. But I didn't assign the F in order to get them benched. The belief of some players that the devs don't want them to have duct tape and that's why the devs increased the cloth cost and removed jars is just as ridiculous as my student complaining to his Dad that his teacher just didn't want him to play in the game this weekend.