PC The Great Ammo Nerf in Alpha 20.1 b5

[canadianbluebeer]

There is no such thing as "Too Much Ammo".



(the nerf just means I have to *make* more. oh wait, I'm always making more ammo)

 

[POCKET951]

They won't reverse it but they might swing the pendulum back a bit if they discover they went too far. I doubt that it will return to the levels it was at previously.

I don't know that we will get that many tears. Youtubers were among the loudest and first voices stating that in their opinion there was way too much ammo. But you never know. People can always turn their loot to 200% or more if they decide they liked the larger ammo counts.

 I think it would be acceptable to swing the pendulum back a bit for  end of POI loot containers  and ammo piles in tiers 1-3, maybe even 4?

I would say 80% of the excess ammo in the Alpha 20 B238 build came from yellow/blue/red zombie loot bags

in b238 I had a 233 lootstage hordenight where I got over 5k round of ammo

 

[KageOni]

I guess I'm on the outside but I think you are all crazy. I love swimming in ammo. I struggle to find a place to keep it all. 

Why would you want to craft it? Having to craft stuff like that in this game is so tedious. 

 

[DaChibii]

I guess I'm on the outside but I think you are all crazy. I love swimming in ammo. I struggle to find a place to keep it all. 

Why would you want to craft it? Having to craft stuff like that in this game is so tedious. 

Outside possible hording tendencies showing...

What do you consider fun crafting?

 

[KageOni]

Outside possible hording tendencies showing...

What do you consider fun crafting?

I don't know if any crafting is "fun" but I don't mind things like getting the items together to craft a weapon, or even a box of ammo. But the box of ammo recipe is locked behind a full set of books for each ammo type. Having the escape from tedium be such a long and RNG based journey doesn't appeal to me. 

Like, right now I am building on a new room to my Red Mesa base. With each block costing 10 concrete mix I went through a stack of 1000 in no time. However, now, I am constantly jumping back and further between forges and cement mixers to keep the queues full. After about 10 minutes I only have a couple hundred. 

It wouldn't be such a big deal if I could queue up as many as I want but with only 4 queue slots I find crafting to be more of a chore than a rewarding game mechanic. 

EDIT: you know what, belay my last, I just discovered you can make stacks of items by increase the craft quantity. lol. That eleviats a lot of the concerns I have with crafting. 

 

[Sjustus548]

Personally I wouldn't mind if they nerf the ammo drop by a lot.  Currently we have to have a storage box for each different kind of ammo because we are finding so much of it.  We literally can't use enough ammo where we don't come back from looting with a surplus.  Do a tier 5 POI quest in the Wasteland and brought 1000 round, came back with 1500+ and that's with shooting everything that moved even slightly.  We haven't had to craft ammo yet.  It's really hurt my enjoyment of the game because having to go out and harvest lead, coal, nitrate, and brass have all been negated now.  So personally I'm going to be excited when we aren't getting truck loads of ammo on every looting run.

 

[ktr]

I give 20.1 experimental b5 a huge thumbs up. No glitches. No funny business. The games finally works like it's supposed to if you do a fresh install. NOT ONE GLITCH for me.

BUT Ammo Nerf!

I understand that to fully experience this, one must wipe all worlds and playthroughs and start over, but I am still shocked that so few have discussed the effect this has on the first few weeks (and longer) of gameplay. If you don't cheat (as some do), then this is a game changer, and makes crafting your own ammo and gunpowder all the more imperative asap; along with melee/brawl/archery only battling. Youtubers have yet to catch up with this, either.

The nerf is real, folks. Is it going to be reversed? If not, then some time in the near future many streamer tears will be falling if they have to start over with a fresh install (especially if b5 goes stable). Until then, I guess no one is going to say boo about it. It's not that you won't find bullets. You just won't find anywhere near as much as you did. Instead of 50, you get 10. Instead of stacks, you get trickles.

It's like a really big elephant in the room, but it hasn't woken up yet. For me, I'm good. I'm used to it. Many are not. But they will be! (unless it gets reversed).

Depends on how you play.  I run hard AGI. Bullets are nothing to me but backup for "oh hell" moments through most of the 7 days. By the time I hit T5 missions, I can get through them with iron arrows for the most part, leather armor and some mix of military by that point and usually come out with a trove of ammo for guns on horde night. I am speaking almost strictly SP and to some degree MP (depending on the number of players).  Horde nights until then? Stilt base with moltovs and pipe bombs (thanks Grand Spartan for the inspiration!).

I have yet to have an issue in SP with bullets.  MP is harder to gauge because we have a hardcore miner/crafter and we covet brass like the Lost Ark from the beginning lol. By the time we actually need bullets, we have have a stockpile of resources.

 

[Ripflex]

Only complaint about ammo is why next to no 44 ammo ?  I thought, okay maybe increase the number of rewards I can get completing quests to get 44 ammo (nope),  or maybe once I'm high level 44 ammo with drop or show up in containers ... some do, a bit.  After awhile I just drank forgettin elixir and went back to Machine guns and got rid of my 44 Desert Vulture.  7.76 ammo all days and 9mm ammon by the thousands for my turrets ....

 

[Pernicious]

Ah, glad this is coming. Our team usually has a dedicated miner. Not a lot for them to do unless we're upgrading our base at the moment.

Seriously, I used to run into T5s with two stacks of ammo. Now I run in with about half a stack, knowing I'll still leave the POI with more than I entered with.

 

[Scyris]

I give 20.1 experimental b5 a huge thumbs up. No glitches. No funny business. The games finally works like it's supposed to if you do a fresh install. NOT ONE GLITCH for me.

BUT Ammo Nerf!

I understand that to fully experience this, one must wipe all worlds and playthroughs and start over, but I am still shocked that so few have discussed the effect this has on the first few weeks (and longer) of gameplay. If you don't cheat (as some do), then this is a game changer, and makes crafting your own ammo and gunpowder all the more imperative asap; along with melee/brawl/archery only battling. Youtubers have yet to catch up with this, either.

The nerf is real, folks. Is it going to be reversed? If not, then some time in the near future many streamer tears will be falling if they have to start over with a fresh install (especially if b5 goes stable). Until then, I guess no one is going to say boo about it. It's not that you won't find bullets. You just won't find anywhere near as much as you did. Instead of 50, you get 10. Instead of stacks, you get trickles.

It's like a really big elephant in the room, but it hasn't woken up yet. For me, I'm good. I'm used to it. Many are not. But they will be! (unless it gets reversed).

Git Gud and learn to use melee and archery. Archery especially got buffed. If your using bullets on anything below a pack of ferals coming at you, your wasting ammo. There is NO reason to be using guns early game in 7dtd, even on ferals, if you have 1-2 chasing you, you can just archery/melee them down easly. Its a player skill issue, not a game issue.

Thank you for the nerf, Pimps! I love the ammo rebalance because even if play at 100% Loot, I'm not swimming in ammo like in previous alphas. I don't know how the hell people play to be submerged in bullets, but there's something they don't tell us, it just doesn't make sense. The ammo nerf for quest rewards was the first step and I'm glad I don't find 75 of them every time I turn around the corner.

Its easy they use archery or melee, unless you have like 3+ ferals chasing you there is really no reason to use bullets at all. In Vanilla A20.1 I have tons of ammo as I never have a need to use it. Not till I get sleeper volumes with 3+ ferals running at me every volume, which will happen as 90% of sleeper volumes are ambushes with GPSing zombies these days, which is the dumbest choice I seen tfp make, or one of them.

 

[Callum123456789]

anyone remember how scarce ammo used to be in the older 7dtd lets say between a10 and a17 i think its in a good position where it is in b5 im on day 6 ive used atleast 200 rounds so far of 762 and ive still got 400 with no extra loot abundance modifiers and not buying any from the trader 

 

[bloodmoth13]

ammo should be more scarce than food.

My most recent game i played i focused entirely on food and had a very good haul, but compared to ammo i had a full damn crate and more shotgun shells than i could possibly spend. i started using ammo when i didnt need to and still netted a positive!

The demand never kept up with supply.

Though in saying that i dedicated that build to brawling, which is amazing. Killed a bear 1v1, drink a brew and punch my way through an entire T4 and just watch heads explode at the tips of my corkscrew.

My recent playthroughs have been melee oriented, maybe i should try a guns only game

 

[theFlu]

you know what, belay my last, I just discovered you can make stacks of items by increase the craft quantity.

Wait, you were crafting things One At A Time? Well, that would indeed suck..

 

[Raindear Games]

Sam Winchester: "Hey Dad, whatever happened to that college fund?"

John Winchester: "Spent it on ammo"

I remember watching them load ammo all the time on Supernatural, and thinking how screwed I would be because of arthritis...ouch, my hands! my wrists!

Seriously, though, a reloading station isn't easy to work. I've only tried it once, a very long time ago, at a friend's house. Respect to those who do it with no problems.

 

[ElDudorino]

 Killed a bear 1v1, drink a brew

You should hang out at the Bear Den. You drink for free if you fight the bears there!

Ammo-wise, it surprises me that anybody runs through the game firing bullets at single enemies. I use a crossbow whenever I can, a club for when I have someone up close, and only switch to guns when it gets serious. I mean, in the zombie apocalypse would you really be trotting through the streets and buildings spending ammo on every weak shambler?

 

[bloodmoth13]

You should hang out at the Bear Den. You drink for free if you fight the bears there!

Ammo-wise, it surprises me that anybody runs through the game firing bullets at single enemies. I use a crossbow whenever I can, a club for when I have someone up close, and only switch to guns when it gets serious. I mean, in the zombie apocalypse would you really be trotting through the streets and buildings spending ammo on every weak shambler?

that will be my next challenge, melee only bear den!

Yeah im stuck in the old ways of a16 where ammo was scarce as anything and you only saved it for horde night. Im an archery/melee guy till horde nights as much as i can unless things get hairy and i have to bust out the ole boomstick.

 

[BFT2020]

Only complaint about ammo is why next to no 44 ammo ?  I thought, okay maybe increase the number of rewards I can get completing quests to get 44 ammo (nope),  or maybe once I'm high level 44 ammo with drop or show up in containers ... some do, a bit.  After awhile I just drank forgettin elixir and went back to Machine guns and got rid of my 44 Desert Vulture.  7.76 ammo all days and 9mm ammon by the thousands for my turrets ....

44 ammo is gated so you don't see it early in the game and it drops out late game.  Something that I believe they are working on correcting as they improve the loot file.

 

[POCKET951]

44 ammo is gated so you don't see it early in the game and it drops out late game.  Something that I believe they are working on correcting as they improve the loot file.

once 44 ammo is fixed in the loot files, I wonder how TFP feels about HP/AP rounds being in loot, it used to be findable in a19 and I wonder if they want it to be craft able only, or if it should appear in loot, but much more rarely

 

[BFT2020]

once 44 ammo is fixed in the loot files, I wonder how TFP feels about HP/AP rounds being in loot, it used to be findable in a19 and I wonder if they want it to be craft able only, or if it should appear in loot, but much more rarely

Yeah, in loot - it is only in the treasureAmmo group.  You can obviously by it from the trader or craft it yourself but not something you are going to find in loot in the vanilla game.

I hope they look at that again.  I modded it in my game to be a potential loot item in specific loot containers - munition crates, army trucks, and ammo displays.

 

[Rotor]

As a noob, I dont use ammo.  Too skeered to run out.  I only break out the pipe MG when my bow needs repaired during a horde night.  I dont feel I am swimming in it,......on another note, why do arrows disappear so effing quick?  Is it a system load issue?  Or ya'll just like to see me grind out umpteen stone arrows?