PC Tried A19, A16 is still best Alpha
- Thread starter ~Kevin~
- Start date
RipClaw
Well-known member
The one I've heard about so far are different pipe firearms that use the same ammo as the T1 guns. That should allow the player to specialize early on.
If it were up to me, you wouldn't find any guns in crates or weapon bags during the Stone Age. All you would find are parts and a little bit of ammo.
But the developers are generous and give us ready to use weapons. They may not have a fancy military designation or kill a man at a greater distance, but they are still useful when used properly.
At that point wouldnt it be better to just add in more weapons in general so you progress in a "realistic" manner?
Like:
p90 handgun (weakest 9mm)->Glock (midage 9mm)-> Whatever pistol (highest damage 9mm) then branch out here for 3 sidegrade pistols so everybody gets his favorite deal?
RipClaw
Well-known member
More guns? We currently have 14 guns in the game. 16 if I count the junk turret and the rocket launcher.
I remember when we only had 9 different guns and that was plenty.
The game is not a shooter and should not become one. It has elements of a shooter and that is all.
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Thats true but with how the game goes weapons in general are the main part of the game and as such they should be expanded upon to fill out the gaps.
I specifically said constantly increasing weapon power so it matches the melee system where you replace stone with iron and iron with steel as you progress. This way the early game can still have pistols and such its just they are going to be weak.
RipClaw
Well-known member
They are a part of the game but not necessarily the main part. Just because you consider them the main part doesn't mean that everyone does. I see building as the main part of the game but that is just my personal opinion.
And that is exactly why there will be pipe guns in A20. They will then correspond to the "stone" level of melee weapons.
Why do you insist that you need an industrially manufactured firearm?
wizard puke
New member
I wonder if I have more hours playing 7dtd or more hours reading posts about LBD... It's really a toss up at this point.
Honestly im not against a grand expansion of base defense contraptions. Acid sprinklers, more turrets, wall spikes and soo on.
Because i cant shake off the feeling that flintlocks and their kind as they currently look and what their materials are, they are not exactly primitive weapons at all.
I can pretty much make all the primitive melee weapons anytime IRL on the side of the road but a flintlock pistol requies a blacksmith to make and is essentially an iron age weapon.
You are taking "stone age" too literal. The official term would probably be "loot tier 0" and the weapons "tier 0 weapons"
The term "stone age" isn't about the material the weapon is made off and might even have been coined by players
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RipClaw
Well-known member
I think you're confusing primitive with historical.
Here's an article on improvised firearms: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Improvised_firearm
Improvised firearms have been found in prisons. They've been made from things inmates have access to.
Here is a example:
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Yeah, no sarcasm but i really take it literally. Its because its tied up directly with tools and weapons what are something i would expect in prehistoric movies i kind of got attached to the term.
The fact that im suffering from sleep deprivation at this point too doesnt help me i think.
Anyway i would be okay with those improvised weapons as show in the pic, as long as they actually look primitive and not like something what you need a forge to recreate.
pApA^LeGBa
Well-known member
Where is the problem with that? I rather see a problem with the fact that you can do it in your first week. Some POI´s should only be possible to raid later in game. They did a step in the right direction with slowing down the progression, now they need to follow that path further down the road. I still say forge possible on day one needs to go tbh.RipClaw said:
RipClaw
Well-known member
There was a bug in A17 that caused radioactive zombies to appear in the game much earlier and in greater numbers than would normally have been the case. The whining in the forum was very big. It was called the green plague.
I expect a similar level of whining when players think they can loot a factory in the first week and then get rekt.
One way to force this is to create an barrier that prevents the player from entering the area. But this feels artificial.
The other way is to make the opponent so difficult that he has to be well prepared. This allows the player takes the risk and if he succeeds he gets the reward. This would feel much more natural and it seems the Fun Pimps will take this route.
If you slow it down too much then the players get bored very quickly. The current pace seems to me to be appropriate.
Okay, then day two
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Yeah... hard barriers would be awful. I wonder if it would be a good idea for big loot POIs, like skyscrapers and military bases, to have some sort of built-in security system with turrets or whatever (but only in the loot room). That would at least make it hard for someone with primitive tools to get inside the loot areas. Any sensors could be easily taken out by a bullet, but not an arrow, something like that.
Mr.tektite
New member
as someone who has been playing since alpha 7 (or somewhere in there. I had to do a little digging to see what alpha was out when i started playing in 2013. the game released 2 weeks before i bought and started playing it) so 7-8 I can say with 100% assurance. this game is one of the biggest head scratches when it comes to gameplay over the years. its better then when it started... but it also is not? to be clear. I have technically never set foot in a game with other people that were not friends i invited (post alpha 17 when they put in peer to peer connections) so all my exp is single player as is all my enjoyment. when i play. I play day in and out for about a week and set it down and pick it back up again after some updates have gone by. just because after 3 or 4 blood moons. theres nothing close by left to loot (or used to not be) and i have most of the best items.
as of alpha 17 or 18 (whichever made every building feel like a mini dungeon which i @%$*#!ing love tbh) im struck by this weird feeling of progression. I experienced it in 18 just like i am in 19's current build. I get bored so much more quickly. and frustrated. the game currently is so much more polished then it has been in years making it a lovely playground to run through. and yet there are so many small details that throw mud back into the process. My opinions do not reflect "pvp" mode. yes I get it. I understand these things there trying to do to force the game to be fair for other players trying to murder eachother. its stressful seeing people getting guns right away due to luck or people trying to cheese the system. I get it.
I. Don't. Play. PVP. so these changes that help pvp? hamper me and any other single player or co op playing group of people. I don't want those things to be removed from pvp. keep doing that sure but i really think this game needs more access given to the modding community or more customization to alter the gameplay back to the way it has been in previous alphas. let us have our fun with rng and give us interesting enemies to fight on the 7th day like we were. so many great and horrible choices are being mixed that its staggering. I once played this game for like a week and a half or so straight. and had it set to 1 hour days (or 2 hour. hard to remember it was alpha 14) and finally tapped out cause i ran out of stuff to do by about the 37 or 38th ish day (pic of my base by the way will be below if you wanna see it). I had a base surrounded by a miles worth of wooden spikes, the best weapons, walls that were a layer of metal with spiked logs under them. ect. and this was before the locations were all interesting mini pathed dungeons that they are now. also i think the map was about half the size that it is now.
also i want to note for anyone reading this that just started coming around alpha 16 forward. you missed out on alot of terrible ideas that were implemented over the years. My favorite was gore blocks. enemies would die and turn into blocks that would need to be manually removed after they died if they were blocking paths. so say you killed an enemy behind you in a building. and another was advancing on you. the enemy behind you turned into a solid grid space like dirt inside of a building hallway or doorway. so if your trying to get away you'd get cornered. also back when you could loot zombie bodies. this would turn them into gore blocks before you could loot them. also really frustrating on the 7th day. (and don't even get me started on the one alpha that briefly had to much gun shooting lead to mob spawns)
Idk. im probably going to finish building my base and on the 7th day start a alpha 16 game or look up any mods that revert most of the choices implemented in alphas 17 forward while keeping the current map and building and loot stuff. cause most else is just agony to play through solo. regardless of chosen difficulty. I'm sure alot of people disagrees with me and some agree slightly. we all have our own opinions of how the game should be played after all. im just glad i have the choice to play the old alphas.
@Mr.tektite I don't know where you get the idea that the changes in A17/A18 were done for PvP, they were definitely not.
Mr.tektite
New member
I kinda assumed. because I couldn't understand why they were done overall and the only way i could rationalize some of them was for pvp reasons. If im mistaken i apologize but some of the changes that have been made to the gameplay just baffle me. maybe they won't make it to the full build of 19 and alot more changes will go through idk. im hoping the day the game is finally released that ill still be able to enjoy it.
I don't know which changes you are refering to exactly. If you are talking about the new loot system, this was done mainly to prevent players to all have guns immediately on day 1. Just take an AK in your hand and even a group of normal zombie has not the slightest chance against you. So now most players have crappy weapons for the first few days and kill crappy zombies with it.
Mr.tektite
New member
In previous beta's. I was lucky to ever find an ak after several hours of looting. I normally found single shot rifles and shotguns. all of poor quality. and rarely pieces of sniper rifles. my point is. if playing single player. you could alter or fine tune the rng values of some weapons if were talking single player. your worrying about the one person playing. if its annoyance over several people playing. thats still a pvp thing. i know its not as easy as just changing some values but this game has been out for 7 years now. its been more then playable since alpha 15. its just. frustrating to see mechanics i enjoy go out the window and be forced to use others now that i don't like. while elements i do like are being added. If i could chop out apha 17 or 18's graphics, map layout, and leveling system maybe. and stick it back into alpha 14-16. good lord.
I would be playing this game for months at a time with friends. or atleast would enjoy doing so. and the mod that the person above mentioned (the one i first replied to) also overhauls more then just bringing old stuff up. it changes the entire layout of the game along with adding new stuff.... idk man theres no easy way with any of this. and i know i sound like just a winey idiot but the only 2 times i've logged on this forum is to complain about recent (and at the time before recent) changes. last time was the jump from alpha 14-15 when they changed the loot system from 1-600 lvls to 1-6 lvls per weapon and tool. and some other changes they did for the exp points. i wish peer to peer existed when the game hit alpha 12. its one of the biggest things they added im happy about in later alphas. also... a question. at night. my torches will light a few feet around them. but if i move say 20 feet away. the lighting of the torch disappears. is that a settings thing on my end or is that something game play wise the implemented for some reason? Cause its kinda irritating.
and there are a few other design choices. like eating. it feels like the game is telling me that i need to eat 50 pounds of food a day just cause i ran a mile or two and used a shovel to dig up a trench. or the way damage system is working now. I get attacked by a dog and get my arm broken. ok fair. get that squared away. get attacked by a crawling zombie. my leg gets broken. i got abbrasions. im infected. so now im half health. i need the best medicine in the game to get rid of it in less then 2 hours for the major breaks or abrasions. (im assuming thats leveled to the day length cause i play 2 hour days) I usually want good tools starting out so i usually drop alot of points into the two trees that effect my harvesting and my tool quality. only to learn through a friend that they will need to make the tools cause it takes more and more materials to make higher level iron tools (20 30 40 50 forged iron ect along with 2 3 4 5 amounts of tape and other stuff) since my tool quality skill is higher. and i cant do anything about it and didn't know before hand. which forces me to limit were i put my points. and if i want to make med kits now? i better save 12+ or how ever many levels JUST FOR THE DOCTOR SKILL TREE that may as well be a pipe dream of several hours of work EVEN ON 300% exp gain. there trying to slow the early game progression but it makes everything i do agonizingly slow and painful and the only way around it is to play with friends and perk into one skill tree to make a nice rounded play style between eachother. but if your solo? pffft. enjoy not having somthing in your play through.
Sorry if im being annoying. I'll go back to not existing after i get no responses. its not my game its the devs and communities. I'm just along for the ride. i just get frustrated.
I've been frustrated ever since 17 came out. Alpha 16 was the last time I enjoyed vanilla.