PC Does the battle axe create the wrong impression?

Biscoitoso said:
Hyeah, but we still miss a battle axe, not are all "efficiency junkies" care just about "killing", sometimes we want have some style. I would be very happy if the game has a battle axe.

And to be honest, axes and chainsaws are classic weapons in all "zombie apocalypse" universe, but not in the 7D2D...
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I don't understand. You have a cool looking battle-axe here, how much better can it be style-wise ?

So it seems you are actually complaining about efficiency, right?

As a weapon the axe isn't the best but with enough sex-rex it seems it could hold up very well (maybe not at end-game, but there you have alternatives, many players seem to switch to ranged anyway), and the compensation for not being the best weapon is its dual-use and a saved toolbelt-slot. It looks well-balanced to me.

Maybe someone should post some hard facts about the damage and stamina values and make a real case for why it is too weak.

 
meganoth said:
I don't understand. You have a cool looking battle-axe here, how much better can it be style-wise ?

So it seems you are actually complaining about efficiency, right?

As a weapon the axe isn't the best but with enough sex-rex it seems it could hold up very well (maybe not at end-game, but there you have alternatives, many players seem to switch to ranged anyway), and the compensation for not being the best weapon is its dual-use and a saved toolbelt-slot. It looks well-balanced to me.

Maybe someone should post some hard facts about the damage and stamina values and make a real case for why it is too weak.
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Here are your facts: No skills, no books.

Enjoy.

 
First world problems. Really. I rather have this, than a generic looking axe by far. Even if it´s only for harvesting ressources. And people who play on the first 3 difficulties can effectivly use it as a weapon vs zombies also imo.

 
Biscoitoso said:
Here are your facts: No skills, no books.

Enjoy.
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And... you are mistaken. Miner69 is the skill, it brings 50% damage increase to melee, same as skull crusher (yes, skull crusher has some more effects). Also strength bonuses (head shot damage and dismember chance work on axes as well.

Firemans Almanach is the book series, but only one book directly influences combat with a fireaxe specifically. But night stalker book 3 is for all bladed weapons. By the way, there is also no dedicated book for the knifes and they count as bonafide weapons, don't they?

 
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meganoth said:
And... you are mistaken. Miner69 is the skill, it brings 50% damage increase to melee, same as skull crusher (yes, skull crusher has some more effects). Also strength bonuses (head shot damage and dismember chance work on axes as well.

Firemans Almanach is the book series, but only one book directly influences combat with a fireaxe specifically. But night stalker book 3 is for all bladed weapons. By the way, there is also no dedicated book for the knifes and they count as bonafide weapons, don't they?
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Miner 69 is for block damage. It is much more different than other melee weapons who have their own skills, like clubs and spears.

 
meganoth said:
I don't understand. You have a cool looking battle-axe here, how much better can it be style-wise ?

So it seems you are actually complaining about efficiency, right?

As a weapon the axe isn't the best but with enough sex-rex it seems it could hold up very well (maybe not at end-game, but there you have alternatives, many players seem to switch to ranged anyway), and the compensation for not being the best weapon is its dual-use and a saved toolbelt-slot. It looks well-balanced to me.

Maybe someone should post some hard facts about the damage and stamina values and make a real case for why it is too weak.
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I agree, mid to late game, the axe becomes my sole melee weapon. I do stealth builds, so bow, cross bow, SMG w/silencer as primary ranged weapon with shotty as back-up. Other weapon combinations for some POIs like Shamway or Shot gun messiah.

 
Biscoitoso said:
Miner 69 is for block damage. It is much more different than other melee weapons who have their own skills, like clubs and spears.
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Don't guess. Start the game, read the description of miner69. It's what I did. Then I spawned in an axe, looked at my character stats which said 38 (power attack) damage. Next i put one or two points into miner69, looked again and it was 41 damage.

 
Working Stiffs announces their new line of high-style "wood" axes, suitable for all purposes! Since we are not a licensed weapons dealer we cannot legally describe this enormous double-bladed "tool" as a fighting implement, but remember...

🎶When it's time for attaaacks...

don't min/maaax...

use a Working Stiffs aaaxe! 🎶

 
Tahaan said:
I have the opinion that the Tier 3 steel axe which looks like some kind of fantacy battle axe creates the impression that it should be an awesome weapon.

TFP says the axes are meant as tools primarily.  Sure I've swung it at the odd zed with success but I agree that it is a tool.

And I do get what TFP wants to achieve - eg a more bad-@%$*#! looking axe.

With that in mind would it not make more sense for Tier 2 to be a small hatchet and tier 3 to be a Fireman's axe?

Or if a double-bladed axe is really desired, there are some woodman's fireman's axe models to be found aplenty on the web.
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The fact that we cannot use axe's and pickaxes as effective weapons in 7dtd is a really stupid thing. Look at any zombie movie/game, almost all of them have a fireaxe as a really damn effective weapon for killing zombies. All it needs to be made good in 7dtd is have miner 69'er add benefits to it in combat like how knife perks let you bleed enemies etc.

meganoth said:
And... you are mistaken. Miner69 is the skill, it brings 50% damage increase to melee, same as skull crusher (yes, skull crusher has some more effects). Also strength bonuses (head shot damage and dismember chance work on axes as well.

Firemans Almanach is the book series, but only one book directly influences combat with a fireaxe specifically. But night stalker book 3 is for all bladed weapons. By the way, there is also no dedicated book for the knifes and they count as bonafide weapons, don't they?
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Sledgehammer has no books for it either iirc. Could use a line of books that make it better for breaking into things, as for bashing zombie heads it already does a really damn good job there.

 
Scyris said:
The fact that we cannot use axe's and pickaxes as effective weapons in 7dtd is a really stupid thing. Look at any zombie movie/game, almost all of them have a fireaxe as a really damn effective weapon for killing zombies. All it needs to be made good in 7dtd is have miner 69'er add benefits to it in combat like how knife perks let you bleed enemies etc.
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Sure, but that would be bad for balance. Other zombie survival games have no dual use of the axe as a wood cutter, so they can have it as a bona fide axe weapon. The knife has a dual role too but harvesting dead animals has not the central role that wood cutting/door breaking of the axe has. Case in point: If I don't play agility I never have a knife constantly in my toolbelt, often not even in the backpack (I use an axe instead for animal harvesting). If I don't play strength I still always have an axe in my toolbelt.

Gameplay/balancing trumps realism.

 
meganoth said:
Sure, but that would be bad for balance.
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I'm not sure it would have to be bad for balance.  They could just make tool mods for axes that convert them to be more weapon-ish and have the perks associated with axes modify melee damage.  An un-modded axe would still work great for chopping wood but you could still mod it and perk-up to become Thor and Paul Bunyan's love child.

 
Maharin said:
I'm not sure it would have to be bad for balance.  They could just make tool mods for axes that convert them to be more weapon-ish and have the perks associated with axes modify melee damage.  An un-modded axe would still work great for chopping wood but you could still mod it and perk-up to become Thor and Paul Bunyan's love child.
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Yes, sure. Isn't the fireaxe mod still in the game that does exactly this? If necessary the buffs for damage and debuffs for wood cutting need to be somewhat (or a lot) bigger.

 
Maharin said:
I actually like using axes as weapons.
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I just wanted to add that for the most part I meant this for in game.  I'm no aspiring axe murderer but I did manage to cut a deep gash into the first finger of my left hand with a hand axe while trying to cut the head off a chicken.  It was a "axident".  :p

 
Roland said:
It is valiant to be looking out for all the new players but.....there are two kinds of new players. Those who just play the game and have fun and those who are min/max efficiency junkies. The first type will use the steel axe as a weapon and have fun and feel awesome. They won't really worry about the fact that there might be a melee weapon out there that has better dps and so it really doesn't matter for these folks whether the steel axe was intended as just a tool or not. The second group won't be fooled by the look because long before they ever actually use it they will meticulously compare the entity damage stats between the axe and whatever other melee weapon they have and go with the one that is better. They won't really care about appearances since all they really care about is killing zombies as quickly in as few clicks as possible.
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@Roland I do wish you would not always assume MinMax at every possible oppertunity.  

This is not about what you can do or about what if effective.  Yesterday I killed 3 zeds in a row with a shovel.

This is about TFP stating that the axe is not intended as a weapon, and then giving it a skin of something that is clearly nothing but a weapon.

This is a conflict.  Either turn it into a good weapon and stop saying it is not a weapon, Or change the model so that the semantics match the intended use.

On a side note:

An Axe weapons line would be lovely.  Some people in this thread hinted at it.  You'd then have two kinds of axes - the tool axe - better at chopping doors, and the weapon axe - better for killing things.  Related to this:  I do wish the speed of tier 3 axes and clubs were FASTER not slower than tier 2.  I'd accept a penalty in damage per swing to maintain balance.

 
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