[MODLET] Nerf Zombie Block Damage

[icehot]

The goal for this modlet is to make base building viable again by decreasing the amount of damage zombies deal to blocks. A17 has vastly improved AI which imo is pretty good. However, as of B199, TFP have left the block damage the zombies deal the same as A16.4 which means as they now all target the weakest spot hordes obliterate bases and can get to players really quickly even if it's made of steel.

The aim was to make zombies a threat to your base without it turning to swiss cheese and to still give some pay off to the player for making steel or reinforced concrete etc. I've tested this quite extensively in creative mode, they still get to you, there's still a threat, they can still smash through steel, but it does take them a reasonable amount of time, and pretty much relies on a horde to do it. There are still tank zombies, and I tested this with a typical blood moon horde, of 8 zombies 4 normals, 1 cop, 1 feral cop, and 2 wights. If you set the damage too low, they get bored eventually and give up, however the level I've set it to they didn't seem to get bored, but if you were paying attention you could defend it without losing your entire base.

It also has the advantage that it makes wooden bases viable in the early stage again, as at that gamestage you won't be getting ferals, so the regular zombies still have some trouble getting through wood to you, but will manage it if you don't defend.

I expect they will probably address this in a later build of experimental but for now, I think this feels reasonable to me.

View attachment 25767

Nerf_Zombie_Block_Damage.zip

 

[Kubikus]

I think the issue with these super strong zombies might be something Joel (?) has mentioned somewhere: When you have 5 zombies lining up and the first one is beating on your door, it gets boosted by the others behind it. So the damage sums up. Adjustment should be hard, as it might make the individual very weak. Haven't tried your mod, though.

 

[icehot]

I think the issue with these super strong zombies might be something Joel (?) has mentioned somewhere: When you have 5 zombies lining up and the first one is beating on your door, it gets boosted by the others behind it. So the damage sums up. Adjustment should be hard, as it might make the individual very weak. Haven't tried your mod, though.

That might be true, but one feral cop by default does 500 damage per hit to blocks. With this mod, one feral cop would still chew through a wooden base, but stone, and metal are going to be problems now for single zombies no matter how tough they are. However with a horde they do obviously get the buff you mentioned and do manage to create a threat still. Of course I'm happy to adjust values if players can test - my testing really focused on 8 normal zombies against a wooden base, and 8 blood moon type zombies against a concrete and steel base.

 

[Kubikus]

If it is true, there might be only one solution: Have seperate zombies for horde nights and reduce their block damage. Have normal zombies for the general biome spawn and sleepers, so they can destroy doors and such in a reasonable amount of time.

That would probably not even be that much work, a loot could be done with copy paste and search & replace.

 

[icehot]

If it is true, there might be only one solution: Have seperate zombies for horde nights and reduce their block damage. Have normal zombies for the general biome spawn and sleepers, so they can destroy doors and such in a reasonable amount of time.
That would probably not even be that much work, a loot could be done with copy paste and search & replace.

I disagree, I've had cops in early wandering hordes, and quite large hordes, one went straight through my base way before day 7, completely totalled it and it was made of cobblestone - the point of this is that in my opinion zombies against blocks are way too OP with the new AI.

Bear in mind that I've only halved the normal zombie strength from 20 to 10, so escaping doors in POI's is still doable.

 

[icehot]

I'm about to play it in my normal game, so will see how it plays out, and adjust things accordingly.

 

[Voicer]

instead of changing the damage to blocks, I think it would be better to apply modifiers to specific type - wood should be easy to destroy, but steel/concrete etc. harder. I am working on a modlet to do just that (for example vomits will destroy what normal zombie hand cannot, to add some difficulty).

<append xpath="/items/item[@name=meleeHandMaster]/effect_group[@name=Base Effects]">

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.6" tags="stone"/>

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.7" tags="metal"/>

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.8" tags="concrete"/>

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.9" tags="steel"/>

</append>

 

[Belenos]

I'm about to play it in my normal game, so will see how it plays out, and adjust things accordingly.

Hi Icehot, did you get to test your mod?

 

[icehot]

Hi Icehot, did you get to test your mod?

Yes, but not on a horde night yet, so far I've been through a few dungeons, and they're breaking out just fine still, breaking through doors is a little slower, but I don't think it's very noticable for that side of things. So far I'm not changing anything.

 

[icehot]

instead of changing the damage to blocks, I think it would be better to apply modifiers to specific type - wood should be easy to destroy, but steel/concrete etc. harder. I am working on a modlet to do just that (for example vomits will destroy what normal zombie hand cannot, to add some difficulty).
<append xpath="/items/item[@name=meleeHandMaster]/effect_group[@name=Base Effects]">

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.6" tags="stone"/>

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.7" tags="metal"/>

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.8" tags="concrete"/>

<passive_effect name="DamageModifier" operation="perc_add" value="-.9" tags="steel"/>

</append>

The goal was to make a wooden base feasible in the first few days where your gamestage is low.

 

[Kubikus]

I disagree, I've had cops in early wandering hordes, and quite large hordes, one went straight through my base way before day 7, completely totalled it and it was made of cobblestone - the point of this is that in my opinion zombies against blocks are way too OP with the new AI.
Bear in mind that I've only halved the normal zombie strength from 20 to 10, so escaping doors in POI's is still doable.

Then again, cops in wanderings hordes "way before day 7" seems to be the actual issue. I haven't seen a cop in a wandering horde so far, and I'm currently on day 20.

 

[icehot]

Then again, cops in wanderings hordes "way before day 7" seems to be the actual issue. I haven't seen a cop in a wandering horde so far, and I'm currently on day 20.

Yeah agreed I do think the gamestages need setting back a touch, and not by lowering difficulty because that changes how hard the zombies hit the player, and how many HP they have. Though it wasn't the cop horde that totalled my base, it was a normal one, the cop horde came around day 13 iirc.

 

[MetroDetroitGaming]

I'd love to hear the results of this. I have been holding off building a base because of what Ive heard about block damage. As soon as someone verifies this improves this aspect I am def down to implement. Thank you

 

[icehot]

Ok guys, I have some screenshots of before and after the day 28 horde the base is 5x5 solid reinforced concrete with an upper level to shoot down from - played with the nerf and without (copied the save game) and I actively defended both games:

Before:



After (with nerf):



After (without nerf):

 

[icehot]

And here is a passive defence, literally just sat in the very middle of the upper level through the horde night and did nothing:

Without nerf:



With nerf:

 

[kronons]

Just an FYI. For my items.xml it didn't have the

<set xpath="/items/item[@name='meleeHandZombie01']/effect_group[@name=Base Effects]/passive_effect[@name=BlockDamage]/@value">10</set>

I changed it to:

<set xpath="/items/item[@name='meleeHandZombie']/effect_group[@name=Base Effects]/passive_effect[@name=BlockDamage]/@value">10</set>

So it didn't load the mod. It loads now with my change. Not sure if it's just me.

 

[Ricowan]

You might want to verify your files, b199 definitely has meleeHandZombie01 and meleeHandZombie02 in items.xml.

 

[kronons]

You might want to verify your files, b199 definitely has meleeHandZombie01 and meleeHandZombie02 in items.xml.

Thanks I'll double check. Might just be me then.

 

[TopAce6]

anyone test with 08? i know they changed damage to wood, but not sure how/where they made the changes.

 

[Kevin1000]

I have changed zombies block damage in the xml files. You have to edit the block damage for each zombie separately. I just lowered each by about 10% so they can mash your base up but not rediculously fast. However I did not change the multiplier they get when there’s more than one of them. I also did not change their hit damage to the player as it seems like it’s been nurfed already