PC I need to rant

ElCabong

ElCabong

Survivor
Rant on:

I thoroughly enjoyed my morning playing a19. I don't want to give too much away but some places of interest have been changed to become far more difficult. I ran into a dire wolf that I didn't think it was going to be in one. Of course it killed me so I made a blunderbuss, ran back, and gave it a full blunderbuss blast in the face.

Of course it survived. Just like the mireloc queens when I used a mini nuke in Fallout, not once but twice, and the f****** monster still survived A F****** NUKE!

I'm sorry, I think even a direwolf should be dead taking a point blank shotgun blast in the face. I would make an exception for a green glowing one if there is such a thing. I put my blunderbuss back into the secure storage container because I finished the direwolf off with my club and I think that's probably the only weapon worth equipping.

Rant off:

 
ElCabong said:
I'm sorry, I think even a direwolf should be dead taking a point blank shotgun blast in the face.
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I agree. If only you had had a shotgun... 😉 The Dire Wolf has more base HP than many radiated zombies, bikers, football players, soldiers, etc. Mountain Lion has the same base stats, too, so watch out for those if all you have is a blunderbuss.

 
The dire wolf IS the green glowing version of the wolf but just without the green glow. No way a tier 0 weapon should take it out with just one blast. A blunderbus is not the same as a shotgun and a dire wolf is not the same as wolf.

 
Roland said:
The dire wolf IS the green glowing version of the wolf but just without the green glow. No way a tier 0 weapon should take it out with just one blast. A blunderbus is not the same as a shotgun and a dire wolf is not the same as wolf.
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I actually think the blunderbuss should deal more damage than the shotguns... is that wrong?
Only one shot, long reload and very wide spread.

 
T5 blunderbuss will one shot normal zeds with a close range center mass shot on warrior difficulty. It blows off a lot of heads too. Fat guys/bikers take two shots unless you get a good head shot in. 

Unsure if any points in shotgun will affect blunderbuss at all. I have zero points in that but 5 points in STR. 

 
meganoth said:
... but dirt-cheap ammo
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Wanted to agree with you first... but it is not cheap! It is actually quite a ressource dump. What it IS tho is easy to get by materials. You don't need any perks, coal/nitrate or gunpowder are easy to get, paper mostly too and stone as well. But I still need like 4 coal 4 nitrade a paper and a stone per shot.
Which is often more than 4 hits per ressource with the stoneaxe.

Lateron sure. But then you have the shotgun or the automatic shotgun, so there is no comparison.

 
Viktoriusiii said:
Wanted to agree with you first... but it is not cheap! It is actually quite a resource dump. What it IS tho is easy to get by materials. You don't need any perks, coal/nitrate or gunpowder are easy to get, paper mostly too and stone as well. But I still need like 4 coal 4 nitrate a paper and a stone per shot.
Which is often more than 4 hits per resource with the stoneaxe.

Later on sure. But then you have the shotgun or the automatic shotgun, so there is no comparison.
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Agreed. Plus you can get unlocks to reduce the crafting cost of shotgun ammo further. 

Now Junk Turret Ammo... that's cheap. 

 
Viktoriusiii said:
I actually think the blunderbuss should deal more damage than the shotguns... is that wrong?
Only one shot, long reload and very wide spread.
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Bits of stone vs. crafted lead shot

Crude Kirk vs. the Gorn gunpowder with irregular burn rate vs. chem-station crafted smokeless powder

Inconsistent packing and leakage around the wadding

Wide spread is worse for damage, but better for not missing

The blunderbuss is a barely-safe hand-held cannon firing rocks and grit. We are lucky we don't take damage every time we shoot it! 🙂

 
I found a blunderbuss and decided I'd try it. I really liked what it did for something I found on day 1.

I do like the suggestion that it should do a bit more damage AND have a fair chance of damaging the player. 😉

-Morloc

 
Morloc said:
AND have a fair chance of damaging the player. 😉
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deliciously evil like all your race. :)  That would be cool....but probably complained about as much as vomiting was,,,heheh

There is A LOT more gunpowder in loot these days and stone and paper is plentiful--almost limitless. I've had no problems keeping my stack of blundie ammo flush and that is with two blundies next to each other on my belt.

Wanting it to do more damage would make it too OP on the default difficulty all so that if you CHOOSE to play Warrior or Insane you can have it a bit easier. Weapons being less effective in killing zeds is part and parcel in flipping those switches. On Nomad which is default +1 (but also the old default and probably the real default) the blunderbus feels great vs all early game zombies.

 
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Roland said:
Wanting it to do more damage would make it too OP on the default difficulty all so that if you CHOOSE to play Warrior or Insane you can have it a bit easier. [...]On Nomad which is default +1 (but also the old default and probably the real default) the blunderbus feels great vs all early game zombies.
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its not about difficulty. I can also just use a torch with infinite durability.

It is about gamefeel. And I already said that it feels nice even on insane. But I feel like it should deal more flat dmg that the shotgun (maybe it already does?). Just because of what it is. Very early on weapons were also stronger than a lot of weapons in ww1&2 since they just loaded it to the brim with gunpowder. Stronger wasn't necessary though so that is why they used safer, better aimable guns lateron.

But I don't want to complain. It already feels nice, it was just a thought for gamebalance.

 
I can agree to that if we do as Morloc suggested and give it a chance to just explode in the player's hands. But then what percent chance do we give it? 

How about 4%....? ;)

 
Roland said:
I can agree to that if we do as Morloc suggested and give it a chance to just explode in the player's hands. But then what percent chance do we give it? 

How about 4%....? ;)
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how about we increase that chance and make it not explode but just hurt the player significantly (20% of the total damage) and take 30% off the durability?
Its better to have a bigger chance to do less damage than a lower chance to instakill and destroy the weapon.

 
If direwolves are the equivalent of green glowing dogs, THEY SHOULD BE GREEN AND GLOWING DAMMIT!

Viktoriusiii said:
how about we increase that chance and make it not explode but just hurt the player significantly (20% of the total damage) and take 30% off the durability?
Its better to have a bigger chance to do less damage than a lower chance to instakill and destroy the weapon.
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That's a good idea. Somewhere between 1 and 4%.

 
Roland said:
I can agree to that if we do as Morloc suggested and give it a chance to just explode in the player's hands. But then what percent chance do we give it? 

How about 4%....? ;)
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Hard Pass. 

The blunderbuss already has enough drawbacks for it's place in progression while dealing enough damage. 

Now, if this was say a kiss-curse mod or perk that a player could opt into, that's another story. Overpowdered - Blunderbuss deals X% more damage but has a X% chance of backfiring dealing X damage to the wielder and reducing durability to 0.  That is something I can get behind. 

For the most part, I think this is how some of the extreme ideas should be handled from the forums instead of putting them in as global changes. Make them optional for those that want more reward for risk without changing the entire game for everyone.

 
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ElCabong said:
If direwolves are the equivalent of green glowing dogs, THEY SHOULD BE GREEN AND GLOWING DAMMIT!
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No. Just think of it as Tier1 and Tier2 wolf. I mean, it's clearly visible even just from its size. And a wolf is an animal, not a zombie, in comparison to e.g. dogs and zombie bear. Why should a not "zomboid" animal glow green?

You made a reckless mistake. Learn from it but don't expect the game being changed just because you made a mistake.

I also carelessly started the "kill some special zombies" challenge yesterday with just a bow and a spear. I expected bikers, maybe militaries or similar, but i didn't expect it spawning 3 running ferrals.... of course i died. Now i know the quest, and in future i will take a closer look into the challenges before starting them. No reason to change the challenge.

BTW: I've never seen radiated dogs...

 
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Roland said:
Me too...lol. I was being sarcastic. I do like your thought of having mods that are double-edged swords. 
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I figured especially with the 4% number thrown in there. LOL.

Kiss-curse is a pretty common in game design and used really well in deck building games like Slay the Spire and in the ARPG space on unique/artifact level items. Silencer is probably the closest example of kiss-curse in 7d2d currently and it even has a path to remove the curse aspect. Which is really good design, IMHO. Most of the curses in those other games have a path to remove/minimize them as well so they make interesting build options.

For my example of Overpowdered, let's say there was a path in the demolitionist perk line that decreased damage from your own explosions. That would make the mod worth building around and expand the build space. 

 
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