PC A18 Live stream. Pimps want to hear more praise

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Llinx

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I watched the A18 test live stream and must admit what I saw looked good. One of the devs said the pimps want to hear more positive comments (I guess they need a bit of a moral boost?).

7 days to die is a game I have waited for, for years! This to me is one of those games where you can pretty much roleplay. This.. is good and this I like. For this reason A16 has been my favorite build. A17 I tend to tolerate as I get somewhat annoyed at floating buildings and vertical roads, not to mention no option to stop zombies digging down ( I niss my underground sanctuary).

There are a couple of things in A17 I really dont like. Stamina - For a guy who is so buff, he is very unfit. Having to buy a fitness perk - Really? In A16 stamina is increased by running around (much more realistic). And in A17, you need to grind to lvl 10 to get a forge, ten grind again to get to lvl 20 to be able to use the bloody thing! (C'mon pimps).. Finally, I miss the book system of A16. I really do. Raiding th crack a book tower was great fun.

On the positive..

You really have made a bloody good game pimps. Nice to see you are always trying to improve content. I do like the way in A18 stream you made vague references to how you could have made certain things better than they are. This is fantastic that you yourselves can see something is not as great as it was supposed to be.

I know many of us complain when changes arrive. Thats just because we get so used to doing things a certain way, change can be difficult to accept. I will also admit I was one of the worst for ripping into A17. I still find it ... not as enjoyable as A16 but I think i'm getting more used to it. So for my not so kind reactions and comment in the past, I appologies.

I beleive I can speak for many, many of us when I say we really do apprecaite how much you devs put into 7 days to improve it by improving graohics, adding new updated POI's, Veichles, weapon mods and so on. So please continue the great work as this is one of the best games I have ever played (I guess Steam telling me I have over 4k hours of playing this says something lol).

Look forward to the return of books In A18. Would also love to see the following :

Lootable corpses (Like A16)

Option to turn of zombie digging down

A more roleplay lvling system (Such as A16's increase stamina llvl by running)

The smoothing out of random gen terain (No more floating buildings)

Ps - Farming is NOT a favorite passtime of mine. I thought the preparing of ground and once crops are planted, they stay in the ground and only need harvesting to be a great, great feature. 10/10 on that.

Keep up the great work. We will continue to look forward to changes in future Alphas.

Right I beleive I have a rather hostile horde night to go and deal with... (Suits up, grabs weapons. Footsteps can be heard heading off with a hollow sound over the iron floor just before the sounds of a heavy steel vault door slams shut behind him..)

 
I guess they need a bit of a moral boost?)
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Well, I guess anyone describing their profession as a "Pimp" is in danger of low morals... ;-)

Probably not low morale though... hehe.

 
I am looking forward to A18 as well. Well... can't really look at it now, nor look back at it.

But judging from the few videos released, it both looks and sounds better. To find out if it plays

better , i'll just have to wait and see.

 
I tried to watch the stream, but when they started breaking open a chest with hatchets instead of using lock picks, I realised there was no rush to showcase the new stuff, and I wasn't prepared to sit there for hours getting nauseous watching a game set to 1 FOV.

 
I tried to watch the stream, but when they started breaking open a chest with hatchets instead of using lock picks, I realised there was no rush to showcase the new stuff, and I wasn't prepared to sit there for hours getting nauseous watching a game set to 1 FOV.
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What surprised me about the stream was that they were throwing spears all the time.

The throw is the power attack and should consume a lot of stamina. You also have to get the spear back from the zombie. Therefore I would have assumed that they use the spear mainly as a melee weapon and only throw it when they are dealing with a single zombie.

 
oh than you. wish it was littler better than that or maybe showed off those 1/4 bricks he was talking bout for when vehicles go up and damage blocks?

 
What surprised me about the stream was that they were throwing spears all the time.
The throw is the power attack and should consume a lot of stamina. You also have to get the spear back from the zombie. Therefore I would have assumed that they use the spear mainly as a melee weapon and only throw it when they are dealing with a single zombie.
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more stamina would be nice!

Andbefore anyone gets smart:

no, making every activity so stamina consuming that the game comes to a crawl is NOT the same as making a weapon that deals massive damage earlygame cost more stamina to make it more of a last resort/finishing off a strong zombie/last enemy kinda thing.

It is not absolutely needed for balance, but I think it would be nice.

 
more stamina would be nice! Andbefore anyone gets smart:

no, making every activity so stamina consuming that the game comes to a crawl is NOT the same as making a weapon that deals massive damage earlygame cost more stamina to make it more of a last resort/finishing off a strong zombie/last enemy kinda thing.

It is not absolutely needed for balance, but I think it would be nice.
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I have looked at the recording and apparently the spear does not consume any stamina at the moment. Therefore the testers might just use the freedom that they can spam the power attack without losing stamina.

I guess that will be balanced and then the throw will need a lot of stamina like all other power attacks.

 
What surprised me about the stream was that they were throwing spears all the time.
The throw is the power attack and should consume a lot of stamina. You also have to get the spear back from the zombie. Therefore I would have assumed that they use the spear mainly as a melee weapon and only throw it when they are dealing with a single zombie.
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That surprised me as well. I definitely don't use the spear in that manner. It never occurred to me to spam throwing and retrieving. I primarily jab with the spear enjoying its longer reach and sometimes throw it. It is very satisfying to throw. But to play how they were playing seemed a bit unnatural and gamey. Almost like playing Gauntlet or something.

 
That surprised me as well. I definitely don't use the spear in that manner. It never occurred to me to spam throwing and retrieving. I primarily jab with the spear enjoying its longer reach and sometimes throw it. It is very satisfying to throw. But to play how they were playing seemed a bit unnatural and gamey. Almost like playing Gauntlet or something.
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I think TFP need unemotional, well thought out critiques like this. Hype-train praise isn't very helpful.

A18 is better than A17. The spear throw spam can just be avoided. Playing the game as intended remains a choice.

However...

For their next game:

TFP need to end going from one "elevator pitch" idea to another and start a more disciplined development cycle.

After a week long brainstorming session (every idea accepted, every supporting idea linked up and nothing deleted), they get at least one guy to try and poke holes in each idea and the team ether tries to address the problem, draw a line across it, or put the idea on hold. That can take a long time but needs to be done.

If they want, they can go over the process again, building on the new direction of the ideas found best.

 
That surprised me as well. I definitely don't use the spear in that manner. It never occurred to me to spam throwing and retrieving. I primarily jab with the spear enjoying its longer reach and sometimes throw it. It is very satisfying to throw. But to play how they were playing seemed a bit unnatural and gamey. Almost like playing Gauntlet or something.
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The way they were throwing spears, retrieving them instantly and throwing them again was very strange.

 
I think TFP need unemotional, well thought out critiques like this. Hype-train praise isn't very helpful.
A18 is better than A17. The spear throw spam can just be avoided. Playing the game as intended remains a choice.
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Nope. If its in the game, it has to be seen as intended.

Driving away on bloodmoon? Intended.

Chilling on top of a lake on hordenight? Intended.

Stiltbases in A16? Intended.

Noobtubing in MW2? Intended.

Beeing able to avoid all gunshots because your char is smaller in Goldeneye, intended.

As long as it is not a cheat and you do not have to use any xml files or switch settings, everything you CAN do should be seen as intended to be there until the game gets fixed.

Balancing the game and "protecting the player from himself" is not the players choice it is the devs JOB to do.

Sorry. But that just had to be said :D

 
Nope. If its in the game, it has to be seen as intended.Driving away on bloodmoon? Intended.

Chilling on top of a lake on hordenight? Intended.

Stiltbases in A16? Intended.

Noobtubing in MW2? Intended.

Beeing able to avoid all gunshots because your char is smaller in Goldeneye, intended.

As long as it is not a cheat and you do not have to use any xml files or switch settings, everything you CAN do should be seen as intended to be there until the game gets fixed.

Balancing the game and "protecting the player from himself" is not the players choice it is the devs JOB to do.

Sorry. But that just had to be said :D
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You should look up the word: Intended.

You will then know the difference between that word and what an Oversight is.

No worries, English is a convoluted language. :)

 
To Aldranon's point for future games. Something that's been in the back of my mind lately is similar.

This is The Fun Pimps first game. And they had, or chose to go the Early Access route.

So basically what's been going on is they sketched out a general idea on a napkin.

Showed it around & got some startup money.

Started building the game.

Got the first room or two roughly done and roofed with tar paper, and invited folks over.

TFPs kept working at their idea, yet also had some yammering going on from their visitors (customers).

Some good, some just cursing that their corner was drafty or wet.

So TFPs, trying to not be slum lords, spent some of their limited time & resources to patch up a few holes, even knowing they'd be putting on an entirely new roof in the 'future' (when they could).

When The Pimps tore down the outhouse because the inside bathroom was finally plumbed (toilet flushed at least), there were some who grumbled. They liked the outhouse cause the wife couldn't yell at them while they were on the throne.

Later on as TFPs moved on to adding the formal dinning room they realised that the bathroom was in between the dinning room and the kitchen. Not ideal, and could be quite disturbing if Uncle Rick had been eating too much of his super hot chili... So the bathroom had to be moved to the other side of the house.

As The Pimps added more rooms and floors to their Grand Hotel, the initial two room shack & outhouse were distant memories.

Yet occasionally, to this day, a backhoe may inadvertently cut a buried pipe or wire and then the Hotel guests may go without lights or water for a bit until it's fixed.

Thankfully there's now a formidable Senior Front Deskman, Roland (and his competent staff), who capably interface between the builders (TFPs) and the Guests.

:) Sillyness aside, once I began thinking of this whole process, it came to mind how difficult it would be to attempt to build a very large mansion... -without- finalized plans.

Add in that the rich owners had to move in almost immediately, so instead of completely planning the mansion, you couldn't even fully plan the foundation; but you had to get basic accomodations up immediately.

Now the build site is caotic with kids & dogs & cats running hither and yon, while you're trying to get the rest of the foundation poured.

And lets not get into those damn handprints in the driveway concrete!

As a former carpenter if I drove up to a site and the owner said that the above was the job, well, I'd politely smile, shake his hand and drive off. Then begin laughing my a66 off.

So to the OP's general idea on praise. hmm. Not so much? Kinda? Sorta? Maybe? (maybe it's a definition thing)

Amaze-balls? Boggling? Koo-Koo-for-CocoPops? <--- _damn-straight_! I think they're frickin nuts!! :der:

But I most certainly am -impressed!-. :rockon:

 
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Nope. If its in the game, it has to be seen as intended.Driving away on bloodmoon? Intended.

Chilling on top of a lake on hordenight? Intended.

Stiltbases in A16? Intended.

Noobtubing in MW2? Intended.

Beeing able to avoid all gunshots because your char is smaller in Goldeneye, intended.

As long as it is not a cheat and you do not have to use any xml files or switch settings, everything you CAN do should be seen as intended to be there until the game gets fixed.

Balancing the game and "protecting the player from himself" is not the players choice it is the devs JOB to do.

Sorry. But that just had to be said :D
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This has got to be the most wrong-headed thing I have seen you post Vik. I hope you were being sarcastic. Early Access is access to a work in progress. You keep treating this as a finished and released game and you are going to keep being disappointed and shocked at each update. I guess that could be WHY you get shocked and disappointed at each release.

You posted a meme of a tree destroying a house labeled A16 when A16 came out.

You posted a lot worse about A17 when it came out.

I suspect it will be the same with A18 if you think every partially done feature or as of yet unresolved issue is intended as the final product.

 
Nope. If its in the game, it has to be seen as intended.Driving away on bloodmoon? Intended.

Chilling on top of a lake on hordenight? Intended.

Stiltbases in A16? Intended.

Noobtubing in MW2? Intended.

Beeing able to avoid all gunshots because your char is smaller in Goldeneye, intended.

As long as it is not a cheat and you do not have to use any xml files or switch settings, everything you CAN do should be seen as intended to be there until the game gets fixed.

Balancing the game and "protecting the player from himself" is not the players choice it is the devs JOB to do.

Sorry. But that just had to be said :D
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Must be amazing, living in your little bubble there.

Not a single game regardless of state ever had bugs or problems for you, just intended features.

 
You should look up the word: Intended. You will then know the difference between that word and what an Oversight is.

No worries, English is a convoluted language. :)
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This has got to be the most wrong-headed thing I have seen you post Vik. I hope you were being sarcastic. Early Access is access to a work in progress. You keep treating this as a finished and released game and you are going to keep being disappointed and shocked at each update. I guess that could be WHY you get shocked and disappointed at each release.
You posted a meme of a tree destroying a house labeled A16 when A16 came out.

You posted a lot worse about A17 when it came out.

I suspect it will be the same with A18 if you think every partially done feature or as of yet unresolved issue is intended as the final product.
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Must be amazing, living in your little bubble there.Not a single game regardless of state ever had bugs or problems for you, just intended features.
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Let me rephrase it then to make it more... accurate to what I wanted to say (and I do acknowledge that what I said was very... badly phrased):

Nope. If its in the game, the devs are fully aware that it is in the game and do not fix it, even though the game is still in development (or it is small enough for a post gold update) it has to be seen as intended.

Better?

I actually can't explain it better (I tried but deleted it 5 times because its too convoluted)

It was inresponse to someone saying "just don't use/do it".

If it is in the game and not getting fixed, the player should assume that it is meant to be part of the game and use it.

Yes oversight exists. But this actually wasn't to blame TFPs (for once) but a rebuttal of the old "just ignore a games feature, because I like it, even though it destroys a key gameplay element".

And I actually remember editing that meme :D And I thought about it.

And If you could link me to it, that'd be great (Its not in the 7d2d Meme post) because I am reasonably sure that was in response to the horrific levelgates that very early A16 had, coupled to the sleeperbugs and quite a bit more. Which in itself wouldnt be too bad (because it was a .0 or .1) but people defended it by saying "it is early access you can't expect everything to be finished".

I don't know the exact surcumstances, but I am pretty sure that after 16.2 I didn't say a single bad word about the game.

A17 on the other hand...

But if you haven't seen it, nearly ALL my comments regarding A18 are positive. Because it fixes a LOT of the problems that A17 brought. So if they don't bring back levelgates (which mm already said is gone) or do something else similarly stupid, I do not see myself hating A18.

I will still give "negative" feedback, or as I know it: critisism.

And I won't say much positive, unless it completely blows it out of the park, which is unrealistic in experimental an .0

But not because I dislike it, but because I have grown up in a culture that has a saying that goes "not complained is already a compliment" (roughly translated) and I think you guys get enough praise here on the forums already so I want to counterbalance that so you don't get an overinflated ego ^^

I honestly am not a bad guy in RL. Most of my negativity comes from beeing ignored, ridiculed with nitpicks or flat out wrong interpretations and well... all the ♥♥♥♥ that happened since A17 release.

7D2D is my passiongame. And because of that if something is... well... like A17 and I get actually told that I am totally clueless... well... it got to me :D

So there :D I've been nothing but positive (at least I think) about A18 and am really hopeful.
 
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There is a difference between saying something is an intended feature and saying that TFP intentionally left partially done features in. Yes, water has had problems for years now and gone unfixed and this is intentional because TFP doesn't see it as a priority. Its turn hasn't come up yet. So the water that we have is known to be problematic and the devs have intentionally left it in as a broken feature rather than remove water entirely until it is good. But to say that the current water is an intended feature is the wrong way to put it. The current water will NOT be in the game that ships as 1.0

But you are correct to state that the water we have is the only water we have to play with presently and the devs are aware of that and intentionally aren't doing anything about it yet.

(I saw that meme when going through old posts several months ago but can't remember where and wouldn't begin to be able to search for it with the monstrosity we call a search engine here. I remember seeing it and thinking that not EVERYONE was in love with A16 and then I saw the author and had to do a double take... lol)

 
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Site:7daystodie.com/forums whateveryouresearchingfor in google.

Also I get what Vik is saying... I'd phrase it as "that's the way it works now so it must be fine to use".

 
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