Night Visual are VERY CHEAP

So maybe someday TFP will quietly turn the default brightness to 20% and let people who want it brighter turn it up.

For whatever reason I can't fathom, people seem willing to turn settings one direction but not the other.

Turn the difficulty down. NO!
Turn the brightness down. NO!
Turn storms off. NO!
Turn biome progression off. NO!
I wanna smack them people.. smh just turn it down if you dont like it. Or keep the way things are by default and other changes happen depending on difficulty.

But it terms of brightness. I wouldn't mind the default being 20. But the game just looks awful in the lighting now. I dont need to worry cuz its at 0 but not every hardcore fan is going to do that
 
I've said this in the past when people say it's too bright outside when there's a full moon in the sky... I've lived in the country almost my entire life. I've seen very dark nights because there's no lights anywhere around to brighten the sky. But when there's a full moon in the sky? It isn't dark. It's dim at best. Not really any different from the game on default brightness, and certainly not darker than the game with brightness turned down.

The issue some people have is that they want it to be "scary". This game is not exactly intended to be "scary". There are so much jokes mixed into the game, if you know where to look for them and understand where they joke comes from, that "scary" really doesn't apply to this game. If you're looking for real horror, this isn't really the best game for you. The best this game can offer in that regard (or ever will) are jump scares on rare occasions. Lighting won't change that.

Consider a zombie coming up behind you when you can't see them and don't hear them and they attack you. What is your response? Run in fear? No ... unless it's something like a dire wolf, maybe. ;) You turn around and kill it. A zombie coming up behind you and surprising you is far more "invisible" than a zombie coming up in front of you when it is dark and hard to see because you'll still see the zombie in front of you even if you can't see it until it is a few meters away. A zombie behind you can't be seen at all until you turn around. Yet even so, are you really scared because you didn't see it? Of course not. This isn't that kind of a game.

People adjust brightness all the time in games. It's hardly a difficult thing to do and pretty much any gamer knows how to do that unless they only play casual games where brightness isn't an option. And in that case, they aren't likely to be complaining about the darkness on this game anyhow. Yes, if the lowest setting isn't dark enough for you, then you're either stuck or have to use a mod. But that's always true unless there's a brightness setting that has entirely zero light and you can't see inches in front of your face. So there really isn't a problem with telling people they can adjust their brightness. As I said earlier, it might be useful to have the brightness setting pop up the first time someone plays the game like other games do for gamma, but that's really just a slight convenience and not really necessary.

As far as adjusting defaults? First, that only applies to new players or new installs after a complete wipe of settings or clicking the default settings button because they should never change our own settings after we set things the way we like. So everyone here who is complaining about brightness wouldn't see any improvement if they change the defaults since they are already using their own settings, which wouldn't be changed. So the impact of that kind of change would be limited.

What they could do that would be of more benefit beyond the brightness popup when first loading the game after an install would be to have a tooltip on the brightness setting that clearly explains how it works. That at least lets people understand that it won't change daytime brightness and then maybe they'll actually change the setting.

In the end, they can change defaults and it won't matter to any current players because it won't impact your own settings. So I couldn't care less if they do that. Go for it. But will it really make any difference? Probably not much. If people can't already figure out how to change their brightness if they want it darker, then they are likely going to be complaining about all the other options that are available and not set to how they personally want them.

And, for reference, I have my brightness at 20. It does look good to me. But I didn't get upset about brightness... I just changed it.
 
I agree with the OP. nights are way too bright now, but a few updates back it would get INSTANTLY PITCH BLACK even during the day when you stepped into a POI. I think the lighting in 7D2D is a constant dialing in to get it right. Its never been "perfect." what we need is a gamma slider for min/max brightness to dial in the "night" feel we want.
 
The idea of the game being "scary" isn't necessarily the issue, but rather the tension given. If a game made everything easy then it loses a lot of appeal. It's why people tend to quit games faster when they cheat or mod in ways to make it easier as they get bored.

The proposal for darker nights, at least for me, is to add in some tension to make going outside during 'some' nights a real decision dilemma rather than knowing i'll be fine if I just crouch when needed as I can see everything a mile away.

I'll be the first to say I like the current brightness of the game, but mostly as an option. I still think it would be worth taking the time to develop lower light nights that can occur randomly throughout the game to give players real choice on whether they make the venture into the dark or stay at home. It also gives value to light sources.
 
I've said this in the past when people say it's too bright outside when there's a full moon in the sky... I've lived in the country almost my entire life. I've seen very dark nights because there's no lights anywhere around to brighten the sky. But when there's a full moon in the sky? It isn't dark. It's dim at best. Not really any different from the game on default brightness, and certainly not darker than the game with brightness turned down.

The issue some people have is that they want it to be "scary". This game is not exactly intended to be "scary". There are so much jokes mixed into the game, if you know where to look for them and understand where they joke comes from, that "scary" really doesn't apply to this game. If you're looking for real horror, this isn't really the best game for you. The best this game can offer in that regard (or ever will) are jump scares on rare occasions. Lighting won't change that.

Consider a zombie coming up behind you when you can't see them and don't hear them and they attack you. What is your response? Run in fear? No ... unless it's something like a dire wolf, maybe. ;) You turn around and kill it. A zombie coming up behind you and surprising you is far more "invisible" than a zombie coming up in front of you when it is dark and hard to see because you'll still see the zombie in front of you even if you can't see it until it is a few meters away. A zombie behind you can't be seen at all until you turn around. Yet even so, are you really scared because you didn't see it? Of course not. This isn't that kind of a game.

People adjust brightness all the time in games. It's hardly a difficult thing to do and pretty much any gamer knows how to do that unless they only play casual games where brightness isn't an option. And in that case, they aren't likely to be complaining about the darkness on this game anyhow. Yes, if the lowest setting isn't dark enough for you, then you're either stuck or have to use a mod. But that's always true unless there's a brightness setting that has entirely zero light and you can't see inches in front of your face. So there really isn't a problem with telling people they can adjust their brightness. As I said earlier, it might be useful to have the brightness setting pop up the first time someone plays the game like other games do for gamma, but that's really just a slight convenience and not really necessary.

As far as adjusting defaults? First, that only applies to new players or new installs after a complete wipe of settings or clicking the default settings button because they should never change our own settings after we set things the way we like. So everyone here who is complaining about brightness wouldn't see any improvement if they change the defaults since they are already using their own settings, which wouldn't be changed. So the impact of that kind of change would be limited.

What they could do that would be of more benefit beyond the brightness popup when first loading the game after an install would be to have a tooltip on the brightness setting that clearly explains how it works. That at least lets people understand that it won't change daytime brightness and then maybe they'll actually change the setting.

In the end, they can change defaults and it won't matter to any current players because it won't impact your own settings. So I couldn't care less if they do that. Go for it. But will it really make any difference? Probably not much. If people can't already figure out how to change their brightness if they want it darker, then they are likely going to be complaining about all the other options that are available and not set to how they personally want them.

And, for reference, I have my brightness at 20. It does look good to me. But I didn't get upset about brightness... I just changed it.

But zombie game should be have scary at night. this is not a horror game, so no need a full darkness. but this game are blighter than another zombie game.
it's losting scary experience at night.
I believe when you was a kid, night was scary. i was national scary in your life.
Game need a national scary at night darkness.
 
I've said this in the past when people say it's too bright outside when there's a full moon in the sky... I've lived in the country almost my entire life. I've seen very dark nights because there's no lights anywhere around to brighten the sky. But when there's a full moon in the sky? It isn't dark. It's dim at best. Not really any different from the game on default brightness, and certainly not darker than the game with brightness turned down.

Agree 100%.

Not everyone appreciates how bright moonlight is (especially at sea), how easy it is to see, and then how dark it can become without moonlight.

Unfortunately, many players lighting expectations have been formed, based on poorly designed lighting mechanics in games. I tested real night lighting against one of the 7d2d lighting mods that many raved about, and the mod just did not mimic real life.

Having said that, if it looks good and is immersive for the player, its hard to argue against having those options.

The idea of the game being "scary" isn't necessarily the issue, but rather the tension given. If a game made everything easy then it loses a lot of appeal. It's why people tend to quit games faster when they cheat or mod in ways to make it easier as they get bored.

I don't find that in game darkness adds tension, I just find it more frustrating to interact with the world. YMMV
 
I don't find that in game darkness adds tension, I just find it more frustrating to interact with the world. YMMV
I agree it's annoying. It's why I don't think it should be the standard. But just like there are blood moons I wouldn't mind a few nights with some variance in the darkness.

For me it adds tension as not being able to see well puts me on edge. It very much did in Dying Light. So for me it's both annoying and adds tension.

But I can appreciate people that dislike it.
 
But zombie game should be have scary at night. this is not a horror game, so no need a full darkness. but this game are blighter than another zombie game.
it's losting scary experience at night.
I believe when you was a kid, night was scary. i was national scary in your life.
Game need a national scary at night darkness.
Did you try reducing the brightness to 0%? It's quite dark at that setting.

Agree 100%.

Not everyone appreciates how bright moonlight is (especially at sea), how easy it is to see, and then how dark it can become without moonlight.

Unfortunately, many players lighting expectations have been formed, based on poorly designed lighting mechanics in games. I tested real night lighting against one of the 7d2d lighting mods that many raved about, and the mod just did not mimic real life.

Having said that, if it looks good and is immersive for the player, its hard to argue against having those options.



I don't find that in game darkness adds tension, I just find it more frustrating to interact with the world. YMMV
Yeah, it's more about how other games treat nights than about any realism. People are used to a certain level of darkness in certain kinds of games and think every game needs to follow suit. There's nothing wrong with wanting darker (or brighter) nights. That's what the brightness setting is for, though. If this is a request to increase the range of brightness from what it is now, then that's a different topic from what we're all discussing.

I agree it's annoying. It's why I don't think it should be the standard. But just like there are blood moons I wouldn't mind a few nights with some variance in the darkness.

For me it adds tension as not being able to see well puts me on edge. It very much did in Dying Light. So for me it's both annoying and adds tension.

But I can appreciate people that dislike it.
I'd be happy to see them use a changing moon so it isn't always a full moon, and with that, a changing level of darkness. However, as long as it's a full moon all the time, I am fine with how it is now. It's easy enough to change the setting if people want it darker. And I think at 0%, it's dark enough to satisfy most players.
 
Isn't it possible that individual monitor settings may make it so players with same game setting will see things different.
So setting to say 0 as some have suggested will still be darker or brighter depending on players monitor setting.
 
Isn't it possible that individual monitor settings may make it so players with same game setting will see things different.
Certainly, which is why a setting system that somehow illustrates the dev intent is kinda mandatory. If one wants to make the black screen a game mechanic, ofc.
 
Who mainly plays all settings at default? New players, because they first have to find out which settings they want to change and they can only know that after having played some time. This is why the default setting must be right for new players.

What is a common complaint of new players? That the nights are boring because they have to stay inside. For new players it is important that they have a chance to notice that they can do stuff in the night and not get noticed by zombies further away.

IMHO this is one important reason why the brightness is not hardcore black (and probably never will be).

To still turn down default brightness one solution to this dilemma could be that TFP added "malfunctioning night vision googles" which could be found very early or bought cheaply. Those would turn on and off randomly (like having a defective contact) or regularily (having a weak battery that needs to fill a capacitor to operate for a few seconds).
Or remove the ferals and stronger zombies from early game nights as those would be death or at least severe debuffs every time the new players goes out at night and immediately give them the impression that going out at night is not worth it.

And as someone noted, screens have different brightness. I play online with friends and noticed that I don't see stuff they can see.

One thing TFP should do in any case is explaining the brightness setting in a game tooltip like Riamus already suggested.
 
To still turn down default brightness one solution to this dilemma could be that TFP added "malfunctioning night vision googles" which could be found very early or bought cheaply. Those would turn on and off randomly

lol..They'd need to increase the font and boldness of the epilepsy warning if they did this....
 
What is a common complaint of new players? That the nights are boring because they have to stay inside. For new players it is important that they have a chance to notice that they can do stuff in the night and not get noticed by zombies further away.
I'm a little allergic to the "new player" argument; so I may be overreacting. Yes, they exist, but that argument has no bottom. Fresh enough gamers get eaten alive in bright daylight by regular walkers. The game can't be balanced to that without making it boringly trivial for people who actually play games - and thus Buy games. We're all "new" only for a tiny bit of our spending lifespan.

If new players are already complaining about feeling stuck inside, atm they are stuck inside because of runners and the occasional siege tank tourist. Making the night darker wouldn't really change that, they're still mainly stuck for the same reason, they can't fight. The game forces them to fight ferals and dogs early on in POIs, they'll learn fighting from that; or won't and find better hobbies.

Once they can fight, a dark night still works as a game mechanic and an atmospheric visual; head lights and torches become useful and everything is slightly more .. uncertain, and thus scary. But if the game gives us essentially daytime vision in the night by default, it feels like it's not supposed to be dark..
 
Just because newbies dont like dark nights - doesnt mean that nights must be ruined compleately

Nobody said newbies don't like dark nights and nights aren't ruined completely in any case since they are plenty dark if you change the game options for darker nights. I've actually played at 0% brightness and it requires you to use a light source indoors, underground, and outside at night. Have you tried 0% brightness? If you have and have given feedback about that optional setting I must have missed it.
 
I'm a little allergic to the "new player" argument; so I may be overreacting. Yes, they exist, but that argument has no bottom. Fresh enough gamers get eaten alive in bright daylight by regular walkers. The game can't be balanced to that without making it boringly trivial for people who actually play games - and thus Buy games. We're all "new" only for a tiny bit of our spending lifespan.

And we play default THAT same tiny bit of our lifespan per game. Combat isn't identical in games, someone familiar with other games still has to adjust to this game and vice versa.
And I play with a few friends and they don't feel the difficulty of the game is boringly trivial. Shall we now conclude my friends and I are not really playing games? We definitely still buy them ;)

If new players are already complaining about feeling stuck inside, atm they are stuck inside because of runners and the occasional siege tank tourist. Making the night darker wouldn't really change that, they're still mainly stuck for the same reason, they can't fight. The game forces them to fight ferals and dogs early on in POIs, they'll learn fighting from that; or won't and find better hobbies

At the difficulty setting I am playing I am careful about going out at night in the first few days. Am I too careful? Maybe. Am I a bad player? Possibly, but despite playing for years I am not suddenly going to get much better. I still get hit often by zombies as soon as they are running.
If it were pitch black I would definitely not go out at night without night vision googles, even as an "experienced" player. And I would assume the same for players who are new to the game.
You can run away from danger that you can see, learn how far away they need to be so they don't notice you, learn that there are zombies that notice you from farther away. But if something dark already hits you, then a hefty health loss and infection is the minumum you'll get and in the first few days health recovery and infection cure isn't easy to get in numbers. And you learned nothing except "in the dark dark shapes hit you suddenly". As I said you can only learn from experience, but what information is there in pitch black dark?

I am not assuming new players are failures. Even assuming they are at the same level as I am at fighting zombies. But I am assuming they are trying out this game for a very short time and if they fail too often in the first 3 hours or think they need to sit around 1/3rd of the time or get killed automatically out of nowhere in the dark then many will simply deinstall it again.
When I started the game years ago I needed more than 3 hours to learn the movement of zombies and how to avoid getting hit. And one could argue I still need a lot to learn.

Once they can fight, a dark night still works as a game mechanic and an atmospheric visual; head lights and torches become useful and everything is slightly more .. uncertain, and thus scary. But if the game gives us essentially daytime vision in the night by default, it feels like it's not supposed to be dark..

"Once they can fight", they can also set options to better fit the game to their abilities. The only thing missing is better information how the slider influences darkness at night.
 
Last edited:
Shall we now conclude my friends and I are not really playing games?
If this is an honest conclusion from my comment, then I must apologize for my lack of clarity. A/B choice follows:

"Games can't be balanced for absolute noobs, without making them boring for anyone experienced" was roughly my intended statement. It would only apply to you and your crew were you to be repeatedly dying to normal walkers in bright daylight; from your description, I would assume this is not the case.
But why?

If it were pitch black I would definitely not go out at night without night vision googles, even as an "experienced" player. And I would assume the same for players who are new to the game.
Why NVG? That has traditionally been a mid-to-late game item; a head light works perfectly fine and even a few torches will make "local" fighting reasonable. By using NVG as your night-safety threshold, I feel you're overselling the progress required to overcome the darkness mechanics.

As I said you can only learn from experience, but what information is there in pitch black dark?
My overall point is, the "darkness" is a trivial problem in comparison to figuring out the combat itself. The game introduces fast paced combat slowly in the day, and uses it as the main risk in the night. Any player, even the ones who cuddle their sleeping bag between 2100 and 0500 will learn the fast paced combat eventually in POIs. Making nights dark would not noticeably slow down that learning, especially when the option to use torches is allowed from day 1.

So I don't think the "think of the newbies" really applies to this discussion; they're barely affected at all.
 
Back
Top