PC V2.6 EXP

Oktokolo said:
Glue and paint can be made with drinkable or dirty water.
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If the glue, as before, was prepared from dirty water, then I would have no objections. But alas, from version 1.0, clean water is needed to make it.
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Treb said:
A chicken coop adds the ability to get a steady supply of meat, feather and eggs without having to hunt chickens.
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Why are they needed? In the first 10 days of the game this will be useful, but then we will only get bones from the chicken coop and something tells me that in too small quantities.
 
Suxar said:
If the glue, as before, was prepared from dirty water, then I would have no objections. But alas, from version 1.0, clean water is needed to make it.
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I think, glue and paint shouldn't require clean water. They should have allowed us to make them just from murky water in 1.0.
If they add dirty (or just filtered, but not really clean) water, that would be what glue and paint would ideally be made of.
But if I somehow end up with lots of better water somehow, it would be silly to not also be able to craft glue and paint from clean water.
 
superkami said:
maybe just make that as a mod champ. seems like a lot of steps for something thats not necessary, even in real life you just have to boil the water from a natural source to kill bacteria and a filter to remove dirt and other small particles and creatures.
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I do that (mostly) with a mod, but mentioned it here for the sake of discussion since another person had mentioned more stages.

In real life boiled and filtered water is not equal to a city's potable water. It is much safer than pond water, but not as consistently safe and clean. You're missing sedimentation, chemical treatment, and regular testing steps. Boiled and filtered water is reasonably safe in the short-term.
 
Suxar said:
Why are they needed? In the first 10 days of the game this will be useful, but then we will only get bones from the chicken coop and something tells me that in too small quantities.
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They really aren't. Unless unlocked with no magazines, you will probably not really need them. Eggs are usually only used in the very early game except by people who like making pies. Meat is used, but I can get enough meat without a chicken coop without really trying. I don't normally even go hunting and have more meat than I know what to do with in a very short time in the game. Feathers are about the only thing that could be useful after the early game, and then only for people making arrows. But I don't mind having it in the game.

Suxar said:
What kind of dump do you live in? All my life I drank water from streams and wells and seemed to be alive.
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Wells are fine. They are underground and naturally filtered. Though, depending where you live, the minerals in them can be too much to be very safe. Streams aren't really that safe to drink from, though people do it often. The faster the water flows, the safer it is (generally speaking). And springs are usually the safest because the water is coming up from underground. But you will definitely get a lot more bacteria and stuff in stream water, which can and does lead to health issues in people. Just as in this game, you can get by without getting sick if you drink it, but you can also drink it once and end up sick. And that's when you're in a location with relatively clean water. Not everywhere in the world has "clean" surface water. Even in the US, there are places where you definitely shouldn't drink it.

Oktokolo said:
I think, glue and paint shouldn't require clean water. They should have allowed us to make them just from murky water in 1.0.
If they add dirty (or just filtered, but not really clean) water, that would be what glue and paint would ideally be made of.
But if I somehow end up with lots of better water somehow, it would be silly to not also be able to craft glue and paint from clean water.
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My guess (only a guess) is that since they'd have to make duplicate recipes to allow different ingredients, they chose to use clean water instead of murky water for that exact reason... "it would be silly to not also be able to craft glue and paint from clean water." Since there are already 2 recipes (campfire and chem station), if they wanted to also allow murky water, you'd need to double that to 4 recipes. That is kind of excessive for a single item. Certainly possible, but I'm guessing they didn't want to do that.
 
Riamus said:
My guess (only a guess) is that since they'd have to make duplicate recipes to allow different ingredients, they chose to use clean water instead of murky water for that exact reason... "it would be silly to not also be able to craft glue and paint from clean water." Since there are already 2 recipes (campfire and chem station), if they wanted to also allow murky water, you'd need to double that to 4 recipes. That is kind of excessive for a single item. Certainly possible, but I'm guessing they didn't want to do that.
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If my memory serves me correctly, dirty water was changed to clean in version 1.0. The cans were removed and a dew collector was added. And since after installing the filter you lost dirty water, the recipe with dirty water became ineffective.

Since the jars are back, the recipe should be back.
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Riamus said:
They really aren't. Unless unlocked with no magazines, you will probably not really need them. Eggs are usually only used in the very early game except by people who like making pies. Meat is used, but I can get enough meat without a chicken coop without really trying. I don't normally even go hunting and have more meat than I know what to do with in a very short time in the game. Feathers are about the only thing that could be useful after the early game, and then only for people making arrows. But I don't mind having it in the game.
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Meat in the late game is also not very necessary. I haven't used it since the middle of the game. Rotten meat is used instead. The only time I use meat is to run around the wasteland at night, holding it in my pocket, so that it doesn’t get boring.
 
Riamus said:
Wells are fine. They are underground and naturally filtered. Though, depending where you live, the minerals in them can be too much to be very safe. Streams aren't really that safe to drink from, though people do it often. The faster the water flows, the safer it is (generally speaking). And springs are usually the safest because the water is coming up from underground. But you will definitely get a lot more bacteria and stuff in stream water, which can and does lead to health issues in people. Just as in this game, you can get by without getting sick if you drink it, but you can also drink it once and end up sick. And that's when you're in a location with relatively clean water. Not everywhere in the world has "clean" surface water. Even in the US, there are places where you definitely shouldn't drink it.
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If we talk about the USA, then I would not risk drinking from the Potomac, but I would absolutely safely drink from the Yukon. If we talk about bacteria, there are a huge number of them, but not so many pathogenic ones. And the main problem in water in our world is not bacteria, but chemical impurities.
 
Suxar said:
Why are they needed? In the first 10 days of the game this will be useful, but then we will only get bones from the chicken coop and something tells me that in too small quantities.
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I'll appreciate the feathers, but neither meat, bones, eggs, or feathers has been a pain point for me mostly because I'm willing to stop for bird nests. A chicken coop is potentially a time savings for me, in that maybe I won't feel the need to stop for bird nests and I won't have 1 or more inventory spots taken up as I travel.
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Suxar said:
What kind of dump do you live in? All my life I drank water from streams and wells and seemed to be alive.
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Somebody did buy Iron Gut... ;)
 
Riamus said:
My guess (only a guess) is that since they'd have to make duplicate recipes to allow different ingredients, they chose to use clean water instead of murky water for that exact reason... "it would be silly to not also be able to craft glue and paint from clean water." Since there are already 2 recipes (campfire and chem station), if they wanted to also allow murky water, you'd need to double that to 4 recipes. That is kind of excessive for a single item. Certainly possible, but I'm guessing they didn't want to do that.
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Yes, that likely is the reason. The crafting system really needs support for alternate inputs.
 
I think that TFP should leave leave cooking the way it is... Campfires are fine and we don't need anything else to cook with.
I also think that making glue and paint from clean water fine and doesn't need to change.

What TFP should really focus on is work on things like the chicken coop, the sandbox options, the bandits and the story mode... We don't need minor changes to cooking and water and jars every time there's a new update. It's fine the way it is so lets move on to important stuff.

Almost forgot... And add the new pig model... Please!!! 😁
 
Space4Ace said:
I think that TFP should leave leave cooking the way it is... Campfires are fine and we don't need anything else to cook with.
I also think that making glue and paint from clean water fine and doesn't need to change.

What TFP should really focus on is work on things like the chicken coop, the sandbox options, the bandits and the story mode... We don't need minor changes to cooking and water and jars every time there's a new update. It's fine the way it is so lets move on to important stuff.

Almost forgot... And add the new pig model... Please!!! 😁
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Don't worry, TFP can chew chewing gum and shoot the shotgun at the same time! 😎
 
Oktokolo said:
A way to make dew collectors useful again:
In addition to murky and drinkable water, there is dirty water
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We don’t need a whole additional layer of water conditioning. All that we need to do is widen the efficiency gap between the campfire and the dew collector. The gap was good in 2.5 because you had to feed the campfire but you didn’t have to feed the dew collector so there was a progression step up going from fire to dew collector.

Now they are roughly equivalent and it is purely taste that dictates whether you go one way or another.

Without adding a whole additional water type, all that needs to be done is to change it so that you can only fill one jar at a time. That small change would make the dew collectors a big step above campfires—especially for mass production. Even the unmodified dew collector that produces murky water would be a step up as all your jars would fill while you were off questing and you wouldn’t have to do it yourself one by one any longer.

They could probably speed up the animation a little bit for the change but not too much.
 
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