PC V2.0 Storms Brewing Dev Diary

[EvilPolygons]

It is quite simple. There is a new slot for the survival kit. Kits go from biome 1 to 4. 4 being wasteland (the best) and protects from every biome's hazard.

Okay, but how does dynamic weather and heat/cold/wet exposure figure into the new system? It was my understanding that dynamic weather-related survival mechanics would be making a return.

Let's say I have a snow kit equipped. It offers 100% immunity to Snow biome hazards, right? Even during a snowstorm? Even if I fall in water, get soaked, and stand around outside during a snowstorm? If that's the case, then what's the actual point of having any kind of inclement weather anymore? What's the point of staying dry in cold weather? Or staying cool in the desert, and taking shelter during sandstorms?
 

I hope I'm wrong, but it kinda sounds like all the fun & interesting weather/temperature/dampness survival mechanics are being thrown out in favor of some overly-simplistic biome progression system. That would be a real shame.

 

[Space4Ace]

As seen in the image, all the way down, there's a message that says it all: 

"These Dates are rough estimates and subject to change".

Believe me, I've been playing 7 days to Die since November 2015 (Alpha 10.1) and the dates first mentioned about the next updates are always way off... Ususally because they are estimates, not an actual promise to anything.

Sometimes it's a good thing, as they decided to add more stuff then expected.

There's one time when some people got upset, and I think it was Alpha 17, where they decided to update Unity to a newer version not long before the release and it pushed the release back quite a bit. TFP said it had nothing to do with the delay of the release, but some people thought it was the main reason for the delay, and a bad decision by TFP.

All I will add is I don't get upset with delays (not going to say I never did, but lets leave at that). I find that they know what they want and it could mean more things that we didn't expect will be in the game.

 

[firewalker101]

So the long waited Dedicated server's option to play with all your friends;  is being pushed off beyond end of Q1  to sometime month(s) down the road?

 

[Riamus]

Okay, but how does dynamic weather and heat/cold/wet exposure figure into the new system? It was my understanding that dynamic weather-related survival mechanics would be making a return.

Let's say I have a snow kit equipped. It offers 100% immunity to Snow biome hazards, right? Even during a snowstorm? Even if I fall in water, get soaked, and stand around outside during a snowstorm? If that's the case, then what's the actual point of having any kind of inclement weather anymore? What's the point of staying dry in cold weather? Or staying cool in the desert, and taking shelter during sandstorms?
 

I hope I'm wrong, but it kinda sounds like all the fun & interesting weather/temperature/dampness survival mechanics are being thrown out in favor of some overly-simplistic biome progression system. That would be a real shame.

Unfortunately, it sounds like dynamic weather is not happening now.  With faatal saying that they aren't even calling it weather internally anymore, it sounds like weather is gone for good.  We can hope, but it doesn't sound like we'll get what we'd like.  Unfortunately, it feels like they are just trying to rush through the last of the development and get the game finished (even if things still get delayed) and just giving us the least difficult options for features.  But we'll see.  I mean, a static damage from each biome that is mitigated by something you craft and never has to be worried about again for that biome in that save is hardly a big feature improvement and would be far simpler and faster to implement than an improved dynamic weather update, which was what we were expecting.  Oh well.  It can be disabled, so at least we can just ignore it if we find it more hassle than value, which I feel will be likely.

 

[HammerDano]

Unfortunately, it sounds like dynamic weather is not happening now.  With faatal saying that they aren't even calling it weather internally anymore, it sounds like weather is gone for good.  We can hope, but it doesn't sound like we'll get what we'd like.  Unfortunately, it feels like they are just trying to rush through the last of the development and get the game finished (even if things still get delayed) and just giving us the least difficult options for features.  But we'll see.  I mean, a static damage from each biome that is mitigated by something you craft and never has to be worried about again for that biome in that save is hardly a big feature improvement and would be far simpler and faster to implement than an improved dynamic weather update, which was what we were expecting.  Oh well.  It can be disabled, so at least we can just ignore it if we find it more hassle than value, which I feel will be likely.

if only they had finished the PC version first. You guys deserved a game as good as your platform. I keep pointing this out...and you guys keep defending TFP. Since 2019 TFP have been dumbing down your game and taking away options, forcing conforming gameplay...and you seem to blindly believe TFP are heads down working hard to give you the best they can. It is frustrating to try to talk to you. You have a low opinion on 2.0 and 3.0...don't really know how you feel about 4.0 yet. so I won't speak on it.

You say things like: don't have high expectations you won't be disappointed. it's bi-polar AF. TFP are the greatest...don't expect anything they update to be good.

That stuff about the weather...were did you first hear it? was it an unofficial blurt from someone?  These things mean nothing...you guys speculate, defend it like you know the details, and then just accept it passively when you find out it was bs. 

I want actual communication. I don't care if you don't. I can't make sense of why you wouldn't.

 

[Riamus]

if only they had finished the PC version first. You guys deserved a game as good as your platform. I keep pointing this out...and you guys keep defending TFP. Since 2019 TFP have been dumbing down your game and taking away options, forcing conforming gameplay...and you seem to blindly believe TFP are heads down working hard to give you the best they can.

How do you think console players would feel if they said last summer that they weren't going to release for console for another few years because they wanted to finish it on PC first?  You are upset about that, but most console players are happy to have it available, even if they have to wait on things.

I'm not sure that I've seen anyone say that TFP is making everything the best it can be.  People defend specific things they like and they complain about specific things they don't like.  I can list a number of things that I don't like or agree with.  That doesn't mean I don't support TFP or think they are not working hard.  They have their own views of how they want the game.  They are going to make the game that way, regardless what people think.  After all, they'll never please everyone.  That's just a fact of life.  Everyone has different opinions of what is better or worse.  Just because I think the new biome stuff is lackluster doesn't mean others won't like it.  Just because I think bandits don't need to be in this game doesn't mean people will not love having them.  And what is dumbed down to one person works well for another.  Some people like ultra realistic stuff and some people like arcade stuff.  What works for one doesn't work for everyone.

You say things like: don't have high expectations you won't be disappointed.

No, it's realistic.  It isn't like TFP has only been around a couple years and we don't know what to expect from them.  They've been around over a decade and this is how they do things.  Expecting any different doesn't make any sense.

That stuff about the weather...were did you first hear it? was it an unofficial blurt from someone?  These things mean nothing...you guys speculate, defend it like you know the details, and then just accept it passively when you find out it was bs. 

I want actual communication. I don't care if you don't. I can't make sense of why you wouldn't.

What stuff about weather?  That it would be dynamic?  There were comments from faatal early on that made it sound likely, combined with the description of 2.0 and the fact that we still have the temperature mods in the game, suggesting they would be useful again with 2.0.  There was plenty of reason to think we'd see an improved dynamic weather feature.  It is only recently that faatal has stated that weather would be these static biome hazards instead.  He hasn't said that we'd have no chance to get dynamic weather at some point, but he also didn't give any hint that it might happen, which makes it seem unlikely.

Now, you may not like hearing people speculate.  If you don't, you're in the wrong place.  This forum is 90% speculation and that isn't going to change.  If you don't like it, you have the choice to either ignore it or not hang around here, though I doubt you'll make either choice.

And no one has ever said (from what I've seen since I started coming here) that they would not like better communication.  However, we also know that it's not going to happen.  Many of us are also aware that most developers do not provide any better communication.  There are some that are particularly good at talking about everything they are doing (Paradox does a good job with frequent dev diaries that are very detailed), but most do not.  Sure, we would like that kind of transparency, but it just isn't going to happen.  Be upset if you want, but it just wastes your time because it won't change anything.

 

[EvilPolygons]

Unfortunately, it sounds like dynamic weather is not happening now.  With faatal saying that they aren't even calling it weather internally anymore, it sounds like weather is gone for good.  We can hope, but it doesn't sound like we'll get what we'd like.  Unfortunately, it feels like they are just trying to rush through the last of the development and get the game finished (even if things still get delayed) and just giving us the least difficult options for features.  But we'll see.  I mean, a static damage from each biome that is mitigated by something you craft and never has to be worried about again for that biome in that save is hardly a big feature improvement and would be far simpler and faster to implement than an improved dynamic weather update, which was what we were expecting.  Oh well.  It can be disabled, so at least we can just ignore it if we find it more hassle than value, which I feel will be likely.

That's just utterly depressing.

 

[Professor-Pip]

So the long waited Dedicated server's option to play with all your friends;  is being pushed off beyond end of Q1  to sometime month(s) down the road?

I read in one of these forums that this was finished and was simply awaiting approval from Sony and MS. The poster implied it would be a small patch sent to consoles as soon as it was approved.

 

[HammerDano]

How do you think console players would feel if they said last summer that they weren't going to release for console for another few years because they wanted to finish it on PC first?  You are upset about that, but most console players are happy to have it available, even if they have to wait on things.

I expect some would be upset, but, cooler heads would have explained that this decision actually means they will have the game faster than TFP trying to do both simultaneously.

and why would it take YEARS more? How far away from done, with the PC game, do you think they are? I ask, because it has been stated that everything takes longer doing it this way. (by "this way" I mean trying to do a console port while changing asset art and writing the rest of the PC game code...for things they still have not figured out to do...which at this point SCREAMS wtf?...at least it does to me)

I'm not sure that I've seen anyone say that TFP is making everything the best it can be.  People defend specific things they like and they complain about specific things they don't like.  I can list a number of things that I don't like or agree with.  That doesn't mean I don't support TFP or think they are not working hard.  They have their own views of how they want the game.  They are going to make the game that way, regardless what people think.  After all, they'll never please everyone.  That's just a fact of life.  Everyone has different opinions of what is better or worse.  Just because I think the new biome stuff is lackluster doesn't mean others won't like it.  Just because I think bandits don't need to be in this game doesn't mean people will not love having them.  And what is dumbed down to one person works well for another.  Some people like ultra realistic stuff and some people like arcade stuff.  What works for one doesn't work for everyone.

okay

What stuff about weather?  That it would be dynamic?  There were comments from faatal early on that made it sound likely, combined with the description of 2.0 and the fact that we still have the temperature mods in the game, suggesting they would be useful again with 2.0.  There was plenty of reason to think we'd see an improved dynamic weather feature.  It is only recently that faatal has stated that weather would be these static biome hazards instead.  He hasn't said that we'd have no chance to get dynamic weather at some point, but he also didn't give any hint that it might happen, which makes it seem unlikely.

Now, you may not like hearing people speculate.  If you don't, you're in the wrong place.  This forum is 90% speculation and that isn't going to change.  If you don't like it, you have the choice to either ignore it or not hang around here, though I doubt you'll make either choice.

And no one has ever said (from what I've seen since I started coming here) that they would not like better communication.  However, we also know that it's not going to happen.  Many of us are also aware that most developers do not provide any better communication.  There are some that are particularly good at talking about everything they are doing (Paradox does a good job with frequent dev diaries that are very detailed), but most do not.  Sure, we would like that kind of transparency, but it just isn't going to happen.  Be upset if you want, but it just wastes your time because it won't change anything.

So...I was right...it started as some vague BS.... I want actual communication.

Trash talking them is really going to get you what you want....  And, no... they do not deserve any reward.  We both already answered that.

I asked if console deserve an update, because on this site PC gamers have already declared "it's done when it's done" is good enough for them.

 

[HammerDano]

That's just utterly depressing.

it could turn out to be completely false too.

 

[Riamus]

I expect some would be upset, but, cooler heads would have explained that this decision actually means they will have the game faster than TFP trying to do both simultaneously.

and why would it take YEARS more? How far away from done, with the PC game, do you think they are? I ask, because it has been stated that everything takes longer doing it this way. (by "this way" I mean trying to do a console port while changing asset art and writing the rest of the PC game code...for things they still have not figured out to do...which at this point SCREAMS wtf?...at least it does to me)

So if someone doesn't agree with you, they don't have "cooler heads"?  Lol!

And, yes... years more is very likely.  Look at the timeline.  It was already planned to take at least a year and a half and they've had to delay quite a bit already just on 2.0.  They are going to delay on 3.0 and 4.0 as well.  Anyone who doesn't think so is fooling themselves.  The game will take at least a couple more years to complete.  Besides, as I was stating the time they'd have had to wait from the point where they did get the game, that time from then until now is also part of the time that I stated.  It doesn't matter if you believe that or not.  It is as much an estimate as the timeline is, but with a more realistic expectation than what TFP would like to believe.

And, btw, people developing the console version are rarely the same people developing the PC version.  I'm not sure that TFP has actually stated how they are doing it, but that's is the normal method.  If that's how they are doing it, the console development has little impact on the speed of the PC development other than if they want to do optimizations for console that will also impact PC and so work on those earlier than they would have if only doing PC.  Art assets have nothing to do specifically with either console or PC.  They apply equally to both and will not require any additional time either way.

 

[zztong]

And, btw, people developing the console version are rarely the same people developing the PC version.  I'm not sure that TFP has actually stated how they are doing it, but that's is the normal method.

I thought they had retained some team in Perth Australia. Maybe I have that mixed up with something else.

 

[Riamus]

I thought they had retained some team in Perth Australia. Maybe I have that mixed up with something else.

I hadn't seen anything about that, but I may have missed it.  That would be a clear indication that console development isn't impacting PC development timelines.

 

[RippedWarrior]

Unfortunately, it sounds like dynamic weather is not happening now.  With faatal saying that they aren't even calling it weather internally anymore, it sounds like weather is gone for good.  We can hope, but it doesn't sound like we'll get what we'd like.  Unfortunately, it feels like they are just trying to rush through the last of the development and get the game finished (even if things still get delayed) and just giving us the least difficult options for features.  But we'll see.  I mean, a static damage from each biome that is mitigated by something you craft and never has to be worried about again for that biome in that save is hardly a big feature improvement and would be far simpler and faster to implement than an improved dynamic weather update, which was what we were expecting.  Oh well.  It can be disabled, so at least we can just ignore it if we find it more hassle than value, which I feel will be likely.

Just adding on to the weather topic - the game already has hypothermal and hyperthermal (cold and hot) effects built in. It is possible to get "freezing" and "frostbite" and "heat stroke" etc. There's also a wetness value that affects both. Although the game has Insulated Liner mod and Cooling Mesh mod, these offer only a fraction of the protection compared to any single piece of armor. Each piece of armor (including primitive) offers a full +20 cold and heat resistance. So I suspect as soon as someone equips thier first piece of armor, nearly all weather debuffs are mitigated.



 

 

[SylenThunder]

I hadn't seen anything about that, but I may have missed it.  That would be a clear indication that console development isn't impacting PC development timelines.

As far as I am aware, that is where the team working on the console is.  I don't know what company they hired. Not even certain they have ever mentioned a name. You can probably find references in earlier posts of this thread though.

 

[Arez]

I thought they had retained some team in Perth Australia. Maybe I have that mixed up with something else.

As far as I remember it is an external group that is responsible for the console ports. I'm sure I've read it here and even heard it mentioned on one of their live streams. 

 

[Riamus]

Just adding on to the weather topic - the game already has hypothermal and hyperthermal (cold and hot) effects built in. It is possible to get "freezing" and "frostbite" and "heat stroke" etc. There's also a wetness value that affects both. Although the game has Insulated Liner mod and Cooling Mesh mod, these offer only a fraction of the protection compared to any single piece of armor. Each piece of armor (including primitive) offers a full +20 cold and heat resistance. So I suspect as soon as someone equips thier first piece of armor, nearly all weather debuffs are mitigated.

Yeah, if you don't have a full set of armor on, you are still affected.  But everyone has a full set on very quickly unless they choose not to.  Even with those mods pre-1.0, those temperature effects had no real impact and were so easy to deal with that they could be ignored.  They'd have to actually work on that system to make it worthwhile, which many of us had expected from 2.0.  But faatal's post seems to indicate that's not what they decided to do for the weather update.

 

[zztong]

That would be a clear indication that console development isn't impacting PC development timelines.

I wouldn't make that assumption. I thought TFP wanted a single code base. If so, changes coming from the console developers would have to be integrated back into the PC. There would likely be some tough decisions. I would also imagine that there would have been time needed for any console developers to get to know the code and I could see that being facilitated by the PC team.

Related to what I understand of your larger discussion with @HammerDano, we're all on the outside of that development effort looking in through frosted windows. I'm sure most of us would all enjoy more communication. But lets not go insane over the fragments we read. That stuff is probably changing week-by-week as the developers mess with it, then possibly again after their QA team starts playing it and giving feedback.

Maybe I should be labeled a "defender of TFP", though I've certainly disagreed with them in the past. But at however many hours I've got in the game, I'm a satisfied customer.

I sometimes wonder if the prerequisite for reading these forums, Steam, or Reddit should be a couple of beers and a bit of the wacky weed.

 

[zztong]

I had to look back to see what Fataal mentioned about weather. (I was fixated on the possible new POI locations comment.)

Do I understand this correctly?

• The player assembles a "kit" of environmental protections. The kit is its own inventory.
  
• There are four "levels" to the kit.
  
• A level protects against that biome and all lower biomes.
  
• You can spend some amount of time in a biome, but time dictates if you suffer, somehow.
  
• This is designed to reinforce the biome progression.
  

 

[Riamus]

I had to look back to see what Fataal mentioned about weather. (I was fixated on the possible new POI locations comment.)

Do I understand this correctly?

• The player assembles a "kit" of environmental protections. The kit is its own inventory.
  
• There are four "levels" to the kit.
  
• A level protects against that biome and all lower biomes.
  
• You can spend some amount of time in a biome, but time dictates if you suffer, somehow.
  
• This is designed to reinforce the biome progression.
  

Looks about right.  The suffering seems to be that you'll start taking damage after a few minutes.  You can also add that you need to go into the biome in order to work on completing your protection item, so you'll have to deal with damage in order to get the protection.  And that there is a new "armor" slot (whatever you want to call it) for that new protection item.

I'm not sure what you mean about the kit being its own inventory, though.  It'll be a set of challenges that are completed in order to create the protection item.