PC How do you pick up a forge when it says you need to empty it first?
- Thread starter zombiehunter
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zombiehunter
New member
I have to retract my "game design" statement. I didn't know you could convert your smelted materials back into raw materials, enabling you to pick up the forge. So, apologies to TFP specifically, and to those I seem to have offended in this thread. My take was a bad one and I'll own up to that.
Old Crow
Well-known member
It's still weird and inconsistent design. See my generator bank example. You can pick up a generator bank and it dumps the gas and engines into your inventory. Same with a campfire - it throws the cooking implements into your backpack. Why couldn't the forge do that? If your pack is full, the extras are dumped on the floor, just like if you turn in a quest and have no room for the rewards. It's then up to the player to pick it up before it despawns, which is a fairly generous amount of time.
BFT2020
Well-known member
I just tried the campfire and it doesn't allow me to pick it up with a cooking pot in it, it gives the same message as the forge.
The problem with this (at least for some resources) is that 1 resource doesn't equal 1 item. 1 clay soil turns into 5 clay in the forge, for instance. I don't think sand is 1 to 1 either.
You could make everything 1 to 1, but I don't think most people would appreciate needing 5 times as much clay soil.
You're not getting it. It's consistent in the ratio of what comes back out. It's the inconsistent UI behavior we are talking about.
BFT2020
Well-known member
Do any of the workstations allow you to pick them up if they got items in them? If not, then that means they are consistent as a generator is not a workstation
Ok, good point and I stand corrected, although the resources return still has nothing to do with it one way or the other.
Still, some things we can pickup with items in them and they return the items (generator, battery bank, etc) some keep the items (vehicles) and some will not let us pick them up (workstations).
Then of course there are the storage crates that you can no longer pickup at all, LCB or no LCB.
So regardless it can use some work.
Old Crow
Well-known member
Interesting, last time I did, it shunted the pot, the grill and the beaker into my backpack. This was in A21 prior to the latest "Stable" version.
PoloPoPo
New member
Vaeliorin is right though. Forge behaves completely different than any other workstation as material ratio is not 1:1 anymore. You could even argue that once iron is smelted it is not "iron" anymore but rather "smelted iron" which doesn't exist as an item in the game. So why should all the smelted iron magically get converted back in no time to regular iron when picking up the forge?
As for the forge, it makes perfect sense that you have to craft materials back from their smelted state to regular state if you want them back. And this takes some time. Either that or you'd lose all materials when picking up a forge but getting everything back that has already been smelted, for no reason, doesn't make any sense.
Generator and gas comparison is unfit.
Ok, I guess I wasn't getting it. I was thinking about converting it back, which is what we are forced to do, but using fuel.
It would work to just let one pickup the forge as is and maintain its contents.
Before someone protests, either way it is unrealistic so that shouldn't be a concern.
Y'all who are disagreeing are correct, the rest of us knee-jerked and jumped on a bandwagon, but it is still a major inconvenience if you need to move and there should be a better way.
True, but there is a difference between stating your opinion that B would work better than A, as opposed to just stating that A "is really dumb game design".
The difference is tact and professionalism. We don't need to insult someone else's work if it does not meet our personal standards of quality. Additionally, truly useful feedback would be providing ideas with how it might work better. Not a requirement, but it definitely helps.
Note that I'm not stating you are personally insulting the devs, but I see posts in this thread and all over this forum that serve only as an insult to TFP and provide nothing in the way of valuable feedback.
Riamus
Well-known member
As someone who has programmed apps for business use, I consider someone telling me their opinions to be useful, even if it's saying that they feel it's a bad design. Even with my work with Pille and Teragon, I'll tell him when I think something isn't a good idea or design. There isn't anything wrong with that. That, by itself, is not insulting or bad feedback. It becomes bad feedback when it goes beyond that to start saying things like the developers don't know what they are doing or something more directly insulting than that. Most people don't have the knowledge or experience in game design or programming in general to give you a good alternative unless they've seen something better elsewhere, so a post that just says they think it's a bad design is how they are able to give their opinion. A negative opinion isn't an attack or insulting.
Yes, there are posts floating around that are insulting. But saying it's a "dumb design" really isn't, imo. The insulting posts I saw were the ones mocking people for not being designers and still giving feedback. If you look at those and compare them to the "dumb design" post, you should see a very significant difference. One is being polite (you can quibble about whether "dumb feedback" is polite but I consider it a valid opinion even if I don't agree with it here) and the others are being trollish and disrespectful and direct attacks on others.
The idea today that everyone has to say only nice things to people all the time and where people take offense at things that are very obviously not intended to be offensive is "dumb".
And it's nice of you to say you weren't saying I was insulting the devs, considering I didn't write anything about them. Lol.
Yes, there are posts floating around that are insulting. But saying it's a "dumb design" really isn't, imo. The insulting posts I saw were the ones mocking people for not being designers and still giving feedback. If you look at those and compare them to the "dumb design" post, you should see a very significant difference. One is being polite (you can quibble about whether "dumb feedback" is polite but I consider it a valid opinion even if I don't agree with it here) and the others are being trollish and disrespectful and direct attacks on others.
The idea today that everyone has to say only nice things to people all the time and where people take offense at things that are very obviously not intended to be offensive is "dumb".
And it's nice of you to say you weren't saying I was insulting the devs, considering I didn't write anything about them. Lol.
I wasn't implying you always have to say nice things. No where did I say that. I was simply saying don't insult people. Many people have thick skin and being told their work is dumb just rolls off their back. Great! That doesn't mean it should be our go-to response when we don't agree with something.
Tact and professionalism??? These are consumers. Customers. They aren't under any obligation for either.
While there is a threshold where a customer can become troublesome enough to be cut loose it generally isn't done lightly, none of you would last 5 minutes in most of the places I have worked in the last 35 years if you expect all the customers to blow smoke and sunshine up your arse, especially when they are unhappy.
Getting useful feedback isn't about them making it easy for you, it is almost an artform of reading between the lines, and translating their frequent ignorance of how things work or even proper terminology to use.
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No, I get that. I'm just saying, if you've got say 24 clay in the forge, when you pick it up, what do you get back? 4 clay soil and the other 4 clay just goes poof? That's not a good solution either (I mean, 1 clay soil going poof, I don't really care, but there are almost certainly people who would.)
Basically, I don't know that there's a good solution other than the way it's currently done (or the way it was previously where if you pick up a forge, everything goes poof, but I know people hated when that happened because they didn't realize that would occur. I did that. Once.)
Jugginator
Tester
I hear yall, I put in a request to see if we can handle this a bit better. Maybe a confirmation dialog that states you'll lose everything if you pick it up.
BFT2020
Well-known member
I can see it now, someone rapidly clicks and loses everything, then floods the forum with complaints about bad design
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